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Patrick Mason on Mormon Stories


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In an unexpected turn,  LDS apologist & current Leonard J Arrington Chair of Mormon History and Culture at Utah State University has broken the Mormon Stories boycott by appearing in a traditional lengthy M.S. podcast episode. And the world continud to turn and the sun did rise this morning. 

As someone who tries to find good in everyone and focus on common ground, I found this to be a very refreshing turn of events and hope that other believers will feel that the logjam has been broken and it is now ok to be interviewed on Mormon Stories,

It was a very faith promoting episode.  

Edited by Craig Speechly
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7 minutes ago, Craig Speechly said:

Can you name a single "believer" that has gone on Mormon Stories since Dehlin's excommunication? 

Dehlin picks and chooses what believers he want on it, so it may not be a boycott. I know at least one who he at least sort of invited quite some time ago, who accepted the invite and yet, somehow Dehlin never got around to following through with him again (the apologist had some very valid criticisms of the Coe interview).

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11 minutes ago, Craig Speechly said:

Can you name a single "believer" that has gone on Mormon Stories since Dehlin's excommunication? 

No, but I also couldn’t name a single “non-believer” that’s gone on Mormon Stories since his ex-communication. I don’t believe Dehlin is particularly looking for “believers” on Mormon Stories. As there’s a rather wide swath of “believers” and comparatively few (singular?) people making invitations for Mormon Stories appearances, a “boycott” may be easier to organize on one end of that equation than the other.

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48 minutes ago, Calm said:

Dehlin picks and chooses what believers he want on it, so it may not be a boycott. I know at least one who he at least sort of invited quite some time ago, who accepted the invite and yet, somehow Dehlin never got around to following through with him again (the apologist had some very valid criticisms of the Coe interview).

I don't think this is entirely correct.  At least according to him he has invited a number of solid believers to be back on that have denied the request.  Some that were on before.  Givens and Bushman among them.

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1 hour ago, Kevin Christensen said:

This is entirely correct.  I offered.  Time went by.  He claimed to be busy.  Not too busy, I noticed, to have several negative interviews during the period I offered.   I speculate that one reason that he did not go through with it with me is that I am neither a Big Name nor offering a notable grievance story.  One notable thing about the Givens and Bushman interviews, Dehlin often asks the same usual questions to Bushman, and asks the same things to Givens, getting the same answers, but it seems that having gotten answers from Bushman made no impression whatsovever.  It is having the Questions that he values.  I had gone to the Mormon Stories Blog after I listened to the Coe interview.  Having noticed Dehlin grousing about "drive-by: apologetics, I gave sources and references for all of my comments.  Such as Coe and Dehlin discussing the supposedly devastating to faith lack of any archeological evidence for brass helmets and iron arrowheads in Mesoamerica, and me pointing out that the Book of Mormon never mentions such things, or mentioning what happens when a person googles "Olmec Iron" and a few other things.  After watching accumulating negative interviews, and the uncritical swallowing of everything Coe said, and the "but, but, but" obstruction during the Brant Gardner interview, and culminating in Dan Peterson's firing, I decided I could not, in good conscience, go on Mormon Stories.  I emailed Dehlin and asked to be removed from consideration.  Some time after that, I went back to Mormon Stories websites, and looked under the Coe interview, and saw that all of my comments had been removed.  He quotes Jeremy Runnells as claiming that “I believe that members and investigators deserve all of the information on the table to be able to make a fully informed and balanced decision as to whether or not they want to commit their hearts, minds, time, talents, income, and lives to Mormonism.”  That is not strictly true.   Dehlin prefers to set the table and in any weighing of arguments, always wants his thumb on the scale.

FWIW,

Kevin Christensen

Canonsburg, PA

Thanks for the info.

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3 hours ago, Teancum said:

I don't think this is entirely correct.  At least according to him he has invited a number of solid believers to be back on that have denied the request.  Some that were on before.  Givens and Bushman among them.

I have no doubt some have refused once they got to know him better.

I am not saying it only goes one way.  Sorry for the misunderstanding if it looked like that.

Thank you, Kevin…always better firsthand.

Edited by Calm
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4 hours ago, Kevin Christensen said:

This is entirely correct.  I offered.  Time went by.  He claimed to be busy.  Not too busy, I noticed, to have several negative interviews during the period I offered.   I speculate that one reason that he did not go through with it with me is that I am neither a Big Name nor offering a notable grievance story.  One notable thing about the Givens and Bushman interviews, Dehlin often asks the same usual questions to Bushman, and asks the same things to Givens, getting the same answers, but it seems that having gotten answers from Bushman made no impression whatsovever.  It is having the Questions that he values.  I had gone to the Mormon Stories Blog after I listened to the Coe interview.  Having noticed Dehlin grousing about "drive-by: apologetics, I gave sources and references for all of my comments.  Such as Coe and Dehlin discussing the supposedly devastating to faith lack of any archeological evidence for brass helmets and iron arrowheads in Mesoamerica, and me pointing out that the Book of Mormon never mentions such things, or mentioning what happens when a person googles "Olmec Iron" and a few other things.  After watching accumulating negative interviews, and the uncritical swallowing of everything Coe said, and the "but, but, but" obstruction during the Brant Gardner interview, and culminating in Dan Peterson's firing, I decided I could not, in good conscience, go on Mormon Stories.  I emailed Dehlin and asked to be removed from consideration.  Some time after that, I went back to Mormon Stories websites, and looked under the Coe interview, and saw that all of my comments had been removed.  He quotes Jeremy Runnells as claiming that “I believe that members and investigators deserve all of the information on the table to be able to make a fully informed and balanced decision as to whether or not they want to commit their hearts, minds, time, talents, income, and lives to Mormonism.”  That is not strictly true.   Dehlin prefers to set the table and in any weighing of arguments, always wants his thumb on the scale.

FWIW,

Kevin Christensen

Canonsburg, PA

Does your offer still stand?

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9 hours ago, Judd said:

No, but I also couldn’t name a single “non-believer” that’s gone on Mormon Stories since his ex-communication. I don’t believe Dehlin is particularly looking for “believers” on Mormon Stories. As there’s a rather wide swath of “believers” and comparatively few (singular?) people making invitations for Mormon Stories appearances, a “boycott” may be easier to organize on one end of that equation than the other.

ActuallyI stand corrected. Both Jim Bennett & Rod Meldrum have recently been interviewed 

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I find it interesting that posters want to debate my use of the word boycott rather than celebrating the melting of the ice pack. 
 

If the breach between believer and non can ever be bridged we will need to communicate with each other to find our common ground. 
 

After all, we’re all from the same dysfunctional family  

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22 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

Does your offer still stand?

My refusal for Dehlin still stands.  In the meantime, Bill Reel interviewed me, as did FAIR several years ago.  And I will be setting a date for another interview from a very bright and credentialed LDS scholar in the near future.  He's doing pod cast and asked.

FWIW,

Kevin Christensen

Canonsburgh, PA

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27 minutes ago, Kevin Christensen said:

My refusal for Dehlin still stands.  In the meantime, Bill Reel interviewed me, as did FAIR several years ago.  And I will be setting a date for another interview from a very bright and credentialed LDS scholar in the near future.  He's doing pod cast and asked.

FWIW,

Kevin Christensen

Canonsburgh, PA

So you are boycotting MS. Please listen to this episode of MS. Dehlin was very respectful. You should go on the podcast. Please reconsider. 

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I'm on the second episode, I like Patrick! I read "Planted" a few years ago and actually gave the book to the RS president when she told me her son was struggling after reading about the warts in the church. It was when I struggled too and she was aware. We were in the RS presidency together, and she was wonderful. 

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On 9/14/2022 at 7:27 AM, Calm said:

Dehlin picks and chooses what believers he want on it, so it may not be a boycott. I know at least one who he at least sort of invited quite some time ago, who accepted the invite and yet, somehow Dehlin never got around to following through with him again (the apologist had some very valid criticisms of the Coe interview).

I know of at least 1 other with a very similar story 

Edited by mfbukowski
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2 hours ago, Tacenda said:

I'm on the second episode, I like Patrick! I read "Planted" a few years ago and actually gave the book to the RS president when she told me her son was struggling after reading about the warts in the church. It was when I struggled too and she was aware. We were in the RS presidency together, and she was wonderful. 

He's great

Go buy his books.

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9 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

So you are boycotting MS. Please listen to this episode of MS. Dehlin was very respectful. You should go on the podcast. Please reconsider. 

One should consider not only what is said in a particular podcast by Dehlin, but what is said elsewhere by him at other times…such as his repeated lying about what Bushman said. And based on that, I can’t imagine that many believers would find it an attractive proposal. 

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7 hours ago, 2BizE said:

In a turn of events, on episode 3 with Patrick Mason on Mormon Stories Podcast, Patrick actually interviews John Dehlin and asks him the hard questions.

Which are?

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20 hours ago, Calm said:

Which are?

I have only watched a few minutes of it, but one question asked was why does John Dehlin claim he has never instructed people to leave the church, when there are some audio/text of him suggesting things very close to this?

you will need to watch it. It certainly had Patrick in the drivers seat and asking the questions and doing the interview.

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4 hours ago, 2BizE said:

I have only watched a few minutes of it, but one question asked was why does John Dehlin claim he has never instructed people to leave the church, when there are some audio/text of him suggesting things very close to this?

you will need to watch it. It certainly had Patrick in the drivers seat and asking the questions and doing the interview.

I remember the question Patrick asked about the pain that the members go through just as much as the members that have a faith crisis. I see them both hurting so much. The faithful that are married in the temple and then have a spouse leave, a child that leaves and their parent imagine their dreams of seeing them marry in the temple vanish. The worrying that their grandchildren won't be raised in the church. 

And on the other end, those that suffer faith crisis have their friends/family/neighbor tell them that Satan is taken over. My sister said this to me, and has been distant for the years of my faith crisis and we are no more...but understand how sad she must feel because she and I were the only ones active and married in the temple out of 6 kids, now she's alone in that world. So on both sides, the church IMO, has divided family sadly. 

Edited by Tacenda
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