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Missionaries' "Nope" Response to Lesbian Doormat


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1 hour ago, InCognitus said:

"Good news" is good news.  I don't know of any church approved missionary training or personal experience with missionary work where the Church has instructed anyone to tell other people their religious views are "wrong" and ours are right.  In a door approach, there is typically no knowledge of the person's religious views, or if they have any at all.  So how would we know if what they believe is "wrong"? 

We take the positive approach.  As President Gordon B. Hinckley put it:  “Let me say that we appreciate the truth in all churches and the good which they do. We say to the people, in effect, you bring with you all the good that you have, and then let us see if we can add to it. That is the spirit of this work. That is the essence of our missionary service”

Yes, you can put lipstick on a pig.

But please keep this in context. These missionaries approached the door of a happily married couple that happened to be composed of two women. What is the good news the missionaries had for this family? 

Edited by Analytics
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1 hour ago, Jim Dandy said:

i am someone who knows The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the only true and living church of Jesus Christ, and no I don't get angry when other people don't know that. I just tell them it is and leave it at that unless they seem to want to know more about it.

 no you don't know.  YOu think you do but you don't know better than anyone else knows who thinks God's telling them their religion is the truth.  Now if you say I believe strongly, have faith strongly and have had what I believe are spiritual experiences that confirm that faith then wonderful.  But you do not know. The church should really give it up on this I know stuff.

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57 minutes ago, smac97 said:

So is the "rudeness" of knocking on a door.

Thanks,

-Smac

And as I noted, almost everybody who is not a Latter day Saint or another faith that knocks doors would tell you it is rude.  You are rather myopic on this one.  It is rude plan and simple.  Come on man. Why do you feel a need to die on every hill?  Are you that sensitive about your religion?

Edited by Teancum
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3 hours ago, Analytics said:

 

Knocking on a stranger's door to tell them that their religious beliefs are wrong and that yours are right is intrusive and off-putting. There is a reason missionaries receive exceedingly few warm receptions when they knock on strangers' doors. 

In contrast, I didn't knock on a stranger's door to talk about this video. Rather, you made an open ended question about it in a public forum.

Answering a question in a discussion forum is fundamentally different that approaching strangers to tell them about your religion.

What you are doing is easy. Sure. In contrast, critical thinking is hard.

It goes both ways, think of all the missionaries that have to sit through others telling them what they believe and trying to get the missionaries to come to their side when being allowed to discuss at their doorstep or out in public. I give a lot of credit to the missionaries that still go to door. I worry for them in this day and age. And witnessed some videos of people that evangelize right back to the missionaries and are downright mean. 

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15 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

It goes both ways, think of all the missionaries that have to sit through others telling them what they believe and trying to get the missionaries to come to their side when being allowed to discuss at their doorstep or out in public. I give a lot of credit to the missionaries that still go to door. I worry for them in this day and age. And witnessed some videos of people that evangelize right back to the missionaries and are downright mean. 

Missionaries only go door-to-door when they’ve run out of productive options. Although I feel bad when they get aggressively proselytized by the people at the door, I have to remember they approached the door, not the other way around. 

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24 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

It goes both ways, think of all the missionaries that have to sit through others telling them what they believe and trying to get the missionaries to come to their side when being allowed to discuss at their doorstep or out in public. I give a lot of credit to the missionaries that still go to door. I worry for them in this day and age. And witnessed some videos of people that evangelize right back to the missionaries and are downright mean. 

It reminds me of what Dave Barry said:

 

“People who want to share their religious views with you almost never want you to share yours with them.”

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1 hour ago, Analytics said:

But please keep this in context. These missionaries approached the door of a happily married couple that happened to be composed of two women. What is the good news the missionaries had for this family?

Did they know there were two women there? Or that they were happily married? Or uninterested in the gospel?

All the video shows is them walking to the door, reading the doormat, making an assumption, and leaving. 

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1 hour ago, Analytics said:

It reminds me of what Dave Barry said:

 

“People who want to share their religious views with you almost never want you to share yours with them.”

This isn't what I did previously when a true blue believer in the lds church when the JW's came by, I would politely say I'm not interested. But now as an unbeliever, and having read what happens to members of their church when they quit believing and they get totally shut out of their family's lives, I can't wait until they arrive on my door step (they stopped their going door to door during covid and I hear they're going out again) and will ask why their church would do such a thing. Or ?? maybe I shouldn't.

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23 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

This isn't what I did previously when a true blue believer in the lds church when the JW's came by, I would politely say I'm not interested. But now as an unbeliever, and having read what happens to members of their church when they quit believing and they get totally shut out of their family's lives, I can't wait until they arrive on my door step (they stopped their going door to door during covid and I hear they're going out again) and will ask why their church would do such a thing. Or ?? maybe I shouldn't.

My son tells me that when he was in college the missionaries kept coming over uninvited until he said, “You do know I have a boyfriend, right?” They never came back. 

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22 minutes ago, JustAnAustralian said:

Did they know there were two women there? Or that they were happily married? Or uninterested in the gospel?

All the video shows is them walking to the door, reading the doormat, making an assumption, and leaving. 

We know from subsequent newspaper articles that they were a married couple and their doormat read, "Gayest Place In Town."

Let's just say, hypothetically, that the missionaries did ring the doorbell and the couple invited the missionaries in and sincerely said they were very interested in hearing their message. How would the missionaries hope this would play out? Would the couple think the missionaries had good news for them and their family?

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14 minutes ago, jkwilliams said:

My son tells me that when he was in college the missionaries kept coming over uninvited until he said, “You do know I have a boyfriend, right?” They never came back. 

That sounds about right. As long as I've been a member, non-binaries were auto-moved off the missionary contact list and over to EQ/RS. As far as general policies go, I find some wisdom in that one.

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3 hours ago, Teancum said:

Sort of like anyone, Latter day Saints included.  Latter day Saints say-I know it is true because I think God tells me it is.

Kind of like murder is wrong (if you think it is) because ....... you feel it is?

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1 hour ago, Analytics said:

We know from subsequent newspaper articles that they were a married couple and their doormat read, "Gayest Place In Town."

We know yes. Because the couple released their doorbell recording on social media. That doesn't say anything about what the missionaries knew at the time. Unless the couple also had a "we are happily married lesbians" sign hanging up, chances are they didn't know anything except that there was a gay person living there (and even that would be an assumption).

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5 minutes ago, JustAnAustralian said:

We know yes. Because the couple released their doorbell recording on social media. That doesn't say anything about what the missionaries knew at the time. Unless the couple also had a "we are happily married lesbians" sign hanging up, chances are they didn't know anything except that there was a gay person living there (and even that would be an assumption).

I'm not sure I follow your point. Let's say, hypothetically, that the doormat said, "We are a happily married same-sex couple. If you think your religion has something to offer us please knock. Otherwise, don't waste your time." If that is what it said, should have they knocked, or does the Church have a policy of not preaching the gospel to happily-married same-sex couples in the same way it doesn't preach the gospel to Jews in Israel, Muslims in the middle east, or polygamists in Utah?

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On 9/6/2022 at 7:52 PM, Jerry Atric said:

Back in the day missionaries would avoid teaching black people in some areas and concentrated on teaching white people. I'm sure some of the missionaries probably thought, "why would a black couple want to join the church? What would be the point?" 

 

Really? You see no problem with a missionary turning away because he knows the people inside are gay? 

How do you define white people?

 

 

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1 hour ago, Chum said:

Light skinned people of European descent.

Like this?

 

1758822C-1BB5-4D10-9AD4-D7AEA651DA50.jpeg

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7 hours ago, Analytics said:

Yes, you can put lipstick on a pig.

Your response doesn't work.  You know how the church doesn't put down other people's faiths.  There's no comparison to what you said.

7 hours ago, Analytics said:

But please keep this in context. These missionaries approached the door of a happily married couple that happened to be composed of two women. What is the good news the missionaries had for this family? 

I will if you will.  I was responding to your generic statement about missionary door-knocking in general:  "Knocking on somebody's door to tell them the "good news" that their religious views are wrong and yours are right is intrusive. Egotistical. Arrogant."  

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4 hours ago, sheilauk said:

Is it also intrusive arrogant and rude to knock on someone’s door when canvassing for people’s political views?  I’ve done that many times and found the vast majority are polite and have no problem saying they are not interested if they are not interested.  It’s a few minutes out of their day.  I’m sure it’s the same for missionaries.  I’ve certainly never been upset when strangers such as JW missionaries have knocked on my door, nor thought them arrogant or intrusive and Ive never heard anyone complain about it either, just laugh about how they sent them away.  Obviously this is only personal anecdotal information so doubtless it carries little weight.  Personally, I am very grateful missionaries came to my door uninvited or I may never have become a member of the Church.

I see it as intrusive simply because someone is unprepared and their day is disrupted and they may feel their space has now been moved in upon which then takes effort to adjust to (I want to use the word invaded, but that has a negative connotation), but there are a lot of intrusive things that are good and extremely kind (my neighbour coming to the door to surprise me with her freshly made sourdough bread, for example) and even some that are necessary (many medical procedures, EMT personnel responding to a fire breaking a door down, caring for a dementia sufferer even though they are angry you are there and want you out).

Edited by Calm
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2 hours ago, Chum said:

Light skinned people of European descent.

We taught Hispanics, Central American Indians, and Mestizos almost exclusively.

Edited by Bernard Gui
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5 hours ago, sheilauk said:

Is it also intrusive arrogant and rude to knock on someone’s door when canvassing for people’s political views?  I’ve done that many times and found the vast majority are polite and have no problem saying they are not interested if they are not interested.

Same!

I regularly knock doors for my employer. Like yours, my experience has been that the vast majority of people are not gits when someone visits. After all, the whole point of a front door is as an interface between the residents of the home and the outside world. It's like having a phone and then whingeing if someone actually rings it ...

Edited by Hamba Tuhan
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1 hour ago, Bernard Gui said:

Like this?

I'm not sure she'd pass a MAGA test - eg: white enough to get easily waved thru border vigilante checkpoints - or be presumed safe from mistreatment right after 9/11 - or not wind up on a no-fly list for no freaking reason at all.

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