let’s roll Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 27 minutes ago, strappinglad said: The problem with the " third part " drawing implies that there is a first part and a second part with a distinct divider between them. Unless you want a bunch of fence sitters ??? which has been refuted . If it means that one third of the spirits followed Satan then no other division is needed. A third part followed Satan. A third part accepted the plan and came to earth to receive a mortal body and work out their salvation. A third part came to earth to receive a mortal body and having merited exaltation based on their premortal works, dwell on earth without accountability, either leaving mortality prior to reaching 8 years old or living past that age without the capacity to be accountable. Link to comment
Calm Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 40 minutes ago, strappinglad said: The problem with the " third part " drawing implies that there is a first part and a second part with a distinct divider between them. Unless you want a bunch of fence sitters ??? which has been refuted . If it means that one third of the spirits followed Satan then no other division is needed. I feel the urge to do a variation on there are two types of people jokes with the third part being neither somehow the first two… Link to comment
filovirus Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 3 minutes ago, let’s roll said: A third part followed Satan. A third part accepted the plan and came to earth to receive a mortal body and work out their salvation. A third part came to earth to receive a mortal body and having merited exaltation based on their premortal works, dwell on earth without accountability, either leaving mortality prior to reaching 8 years old or living past that age without the capacity to be accountable. Revelation 8 7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and afire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up. 8 And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea: and the third part of the sea became ablood; 9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed. 10 And the third angel sounded, and there afell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters; 11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter. 12 And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise. What does "third part of the trees" mean? Just the redwoods? Or just the ones on Europe? What are the other two parts of trees that don't get burned up? The argument fails when we see how "third part" is used in the scriptures. 2 Link to comment
mrmarklin Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 7 hours ago, Duncan said: I can't recall what comedian said it but they toured Temple Square and were told about eternal families and they asked, 'so, what happens if you're good?"😆 Unfortunately, for many of us, he has a point. 1 Link to comment
LoudmouthMormon Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 6 hours ago, LoudmouthMormon said: I have never understood how a third part of heaven could rebell against God, but the celestial kingdom will be totally without any hint of hard feelings or troubles or issues about anything ever. I don't care if the third part was one soul or endless trillions, or somewhere in between. I've never understood how at-least-one-and-probably-more-premortal spirit Children-of-God found a way to rebel, but such things will just be beyond saved and exalted Children-of-God. Link to comment
strappinglad Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 When I see the value " one third " ,I am willing to fudgadjust ( a mathematical term ) for between 30 and 40 percent. Much less drops it to one quarter. Much more is close to one half. I do realize that a term like one third is a metaphor for a " bunch " , and that the ancient scribes played fast and loose with numbers all throughout the scripture, but it still rubs me the wrong way !! 1 Link to comment
strappinglad Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 3 hours ago, filovirus said: And the name of the star is called Wormwood: A short essay on wormwood and chernobyl,... just for something connected to current events. Link to comment
kimpearson Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 So if there is no divorce in the celestial kingdom, what happens to all the folks married in the temple that didn't really like their spouse by the time of death? They get a chance at divorce before the final judgement? What if a wife doesn't want to be in a polygamist relationship that was sealed in the temple? I would love to know how any of us know exactly what is going to happen in every case. We have two revelations in the D&C that barely scratch the surface on these questions and leave many questions unanswered. It seems to me the only thing we can have faith in is if we keep our own covenants and desire to be with our companion for eternity, we can feel certainty of that desire. I just don't see how we know enough to answer an of the OP's other questions. 1 Link to comment
The Nehor Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 15 hours ago, mbh26 said: I might also add, is there divorce in the terrestrial or telestial kingdoms? Nope, they are free love colonies. Is there polygamy? If those involved want it, yes. What would married life be like? Since Gods are the melding of masculine and feminine in a glorious union, it will be divine. What would dating be like? We are told the same sociality that exists here exists there except that it will be coupled with eternal glory. So it will be glorious misery. Will there be breakups, heartaches, irreconcilable differences where two good people just don't agree as there are in the temple marriages and remarriages we see in the church today? Probably not, omniscience tends to prevent those kinds of mistakes. Link to comment
The Nehor Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 12 hours ago, longview said: Since the Universe is infinite and the number of intelligences is infinite, it makes sense what God's Eternal Purposes - - - Which are: invite intelligences to become spirit children of Heavenly Parents train them in the First Estate plateauing after a great while and NOT progressing as much as before, they asked God how can they be like Him? present to them a whole new environment for radically different experiences and call it the Plan of Happiness upon entering the Second Estate, a veil of forgetfulness is placed over the minds of mortal beings so as to NOT overwhelm them with the memory of the Burning and Glorious Presence of God You know the REST of the story. This work NEVER ends. Generations after generations, Eternal Rounds on top of Eternal Rounds. The top degree of the Celestial Kingdom requires faithful and committed covenantal partners. The remainder cannot be anything more than forever best friends. This forever? How do I get out of the Karmic cycle again? Link to comment
let’s roll Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 4 hours ago, filovirus said: The argument fails when we see how "third part" is used in the scriptures. Whose argument fails? I wasn’t making an argument. Link to comment
strappinglad Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 48 minutes ago, The Nehor said: How do I get out of the Karmic cycle You could apply for " Outer Darkness " and chill ! Link to comment
The Nehor Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 3 hours ago, strappinglad said: You could apply for " Outer Darkness " and chill ! According to Brigham Young that takes about as much effort as being exalted. 1 Link to comment
Calm Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 5 hours ago, kimpearson said: So if there is no divorce in the celestial kingdom, what happens to all the folks married in the temple that didn't really like their spouse by the time of death? They get a chance at divorce before the final judgement? What if a wife doesn't want to be in a polygamist relationship that was sealed in the temple? Joseph*** said there was a long time before we would understand the gospel/principles of exaltation fully after death. Sounds to me like even once we accept the gospel, repent and are redeemed by Christ, that there is still extensive preparation that is required before we are ready to move onto the next stage of exaltation in the Celestial Kingdom. During this time, it seems logical to me that we would be understanding and experiencing those we have relationships with in mortality on a much higher level without the obstacles, limitations, and struggles of mortality that may cloud the picture of who we truly are so if there were issues at the time of death or earlier for some reason, we would have a chance to see each other as we truly are and then decide if this is the person we desire to be partnered with for eternity or not. If not, the Spirit will not confirm the eternal nature of the sealing covenant. Quote When you climb up a ladder, you must begin at the bottom, and ascend step by step, until you arrive at the top; and so it is with the principles of the gospel--you must begin with the first, and go on until you learn all the principles of exaltation. But it will be a great while after you have passed through the veil before you will have learned them. It is not all to be comprehended in this world; it will be a great work to learn our salvation and exaltation even beyond the grave. https://emp.byui.edu/ANDERSONR/itc/Book _of_Mormon/03_2nephi/2nephi03/2nephi03_05ladder_js.htm 2 Link to comment
longview Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 21 hours ago, The Nehor said: This forever? How do I get out of the Karmic cycle again? Only if you believe in reincarnation. According to google - - - How do you release a karmic cycle? 7 Strategies To Get Rid Of Your Bad Karma Identify your karma. ... Sever ties to toxic people. ... Learn from (and take responsibility for) your mistakes. ... Perform actions that nourish your spirit and invoke well-being on every level. ... Defy your weaknesses. ... Take a new action. ... Forgive everyone. Link to comment
katherine the great Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 On 3/15/2022 at 10:17 AM, strappinglad said: Given that a significant portion of mortals died before the age of 8 let alone an age to marry, and they will not be kept from any blessings, one assumes dating will be involved sometime before or after the resurrection. Good point. Although if they are arranged marriages I imagine the Heavenly parents would be pretty good matchmakers! 3 Link to comment
JAHS Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 8 hours ago, katherine the great said: On 3/15/2022 at 9:17 AM, strappinglad said: Given that a significant portion of mortals died before the age of 8 let alone an age to marry, and they will not be kept from any blessings, one assumes dating will be involved sometime before or after the resurrection. Good point. Although if they are arranged marriages I imagine the Heavenly parents would be pretty good matchmakers! Of course the sealing has to be performed on earth. If the dating happens in the spirit world I guess we would somehow get word during the millennium that the couple wants to be sealed. 1 Link to comment
katherine the great Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 3 hours ago, JAHS said: Of course the sealing has to be performed on earth. If the dating happens in the spirit world I guess we would somehow get word during the millennium that the couple wants to be sealed. Does it? What if the prospective spouses come from different earths? Which one would be the required location? 1 Link to comment
Duncan Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 3 hours ago, katherine the great said: Does it? What if the prospective spouses come from different earths? Which one would be the required location? reminds me of what George Costanza said about Pig men 2 Link to comment
longview Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 3 hours ago, katherine the great said: Does it? What if the prospective spouses come from different earths? Which one would be the required location? Then you would have a rectangular covenant relationship (her God and his God). Conflicting jurisdictions. Normally it would be triangular. The closer one partner gets to God, the close will the partner get to his/her spouse. The more bonding there is between partners, the closer they will come to God. However, God made innumerable earths. If the partners experienced mortality on different earths both of which were created under control of Elohim and Jehovah, then no problem IMHO. Link to comment
JAHS Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 3 hours ago, katherine the great said: 7 hours ago, JAHS said: Of course the sealing has to be performed on earth. If the dating happens in the spirit world I guess we would somehow get word during the millennium that the couple wants to be sealed. Does it? What if the prospective spouses come from different earths? Which one would be the required location? I am pretty sure we are confined to associate with people only on this earth. Past prophets have said the spirit world for us is on this earth and this earth is supposed to become our celestial kingdom. Link to comment
The Nehor Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 18 hours ago, katherine the great said: Good point. Although if they are arranged marriages I imagine the Heavenly parents would be pretty good matchmakers! 3 Link to comment
The Nehor Posted March 17, 2022 Share Posted March 17, 2022 3 hours ago, Duncan said: reminds me of what George Costanza said about Pig men 1 Link to comment
smac97 Posted March 18, 2022 Share Posted March 18, 2022 On 3/15/2022 at 6:28 AM, mbh26 said: Is there divorce in the celestial kingdom? I would think not. On 3/15/2022 at 6:28 AM, mbh26 said: I might also add, is there divorce in the terrestrial or telestial kingdoms? As there are no marriages in these kingdoms, I think it stands to reason that so too is there no dissolution of such arrangements. On 3/15/2022 at 6:28 AM, mbh26 said: Is there polygamy? Same as above. On 3/15/2022 at 6:28 AM, mbh26 said: What would married life be like? The quality of the Celestial Kingdom is, in the main, presently unknown and unrevealed. "Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him." (1 Cor. 2:9.) "Believe in God; believe that he is, and that he created all things, both in heaven and in earth; believe that he has all wisdom, and all power, both in heaven and in earth; believe that man doth not comprehend all the things which the Lord can comprehend." (Mosiah 4:9.) "For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known." (1 Cor. 13:12.) "We believe {} that God ... will yet reveal many great and important things pertaining to the Kingdom of God." (AoF 1:9.) "The light shineth in darkness, and the darkness comprehendeth it not; nevertheless, the day shall come when you shall comprehend even God, being quickened in him and by him." (D&C 88:49.) "That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ" (Col. 2:2.) On 3/15/2022 at 6:28 AM, mbh26 said: What would dating be like? Will there be breakups, heartaches, irreconcilable differences where two good people just don't agree as there are in the temple marriages and remarriages we see in the church today? There will not be any marriages except in the Celestial Kingdom. Will there be precursors to it? Dating and such? I don't know. Thanks, -Smac 2 Link to comment
The Nehor Posted March 19, 2022 Share Posted March 19, 2022 On 3/15/2022 at 6:45 PM, let’s roll said: A third part followed Satan. A third part accepted the plan and came to earth to receive a mortal body and work out their salvation. A third part came to earth to receive a mortal body and having merited exaltation based on their premortal works, dwell on earth without accountability, either leaving mortality prior to reaching 8 years old or living past that age without the capacity to be accountable. I suspect a different set of divisions. Link to comment
Recommended Posts