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The Elder Holland I Know


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56 minutes ago, Rivers said:

A General Authority said something about LGBT issues and the outrage mob is throwing a fit?  Must be Tuesday.

outrage mob was going after the President of the Church over vaccines, can you imagine? It's still all over the internet

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1 hour ago, MiserereNobis said:

Carl Sagan's book Contact is an excellent examination of this idea from a man who spent his life focused on rationality. In the end, the scientist was unable to convey her experience and called for a poet instead.

I did se the movie.

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1 hour ago, MiserereNobis said:

Psst: I thought you didn't have time to respond to OG's substantial (meaning it has substance) post, yet you keep posting...

His post would take a long time to respond to. Besides I don't need to respond based on the demand of another poster.

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1 hour ago, MiserereNobis said:

Officially, no, gay Catholics should not be priests or live consecrated lives (monks, nuns). The Vatican has affirmed this multiple times, including Pope Francis fairly recently (2-3 years ago?). However, clergy are ordained at the local level, and many bishops ignore this rule. There appear to be many gay priests.

Thank you for educating me on this. It sounds like both the LDS church and Catholic church are grappling with this subject. 

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1 hour ago, Duncan said:

outrage mob was going after the President of the Church over vaccines, can you imagine? It's still all over the internet

I was trying to give you an upvote but accidentally gave you a down vote. I switched it back but it stayed red, so I just took it off, lol! Here is your up vote:) 👍 

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3 hours ago, Teancum said:

Is it tough to do some reflection when it may be you in the shoes of someone else who is suffering?

You are way out of bounds, Brother T. It’s not about me. Looks like he isn’t gay enough for your taste or too stupid to realize the oppression or both. In any case, you have no status to speak for or about him. That’s why I asked earlier if the current LGB folks think they speak for all gay Saints   In this case, they do not. Neither do you.

Edited by Bernard Gui
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25 minutes ago, Peacefully said:

I was trying to give you an upvote but accidentally gave you a down vote. I switched it back but it stayed red, so I just took it off, lol! Here is your up vote:) 👍 

aha! thank you kindly!☺️

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1 hour ago, Duncan said:

outrage mob was going after the President of the Church over vaccines, can you imagine? It's still all over the internet

First Presidency:  We really upset a lot of the conservatives in the church with our statement on vaccination.  We need to even things out by angering the liberals.

Elder Holland: I’ll get right on that.

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5 hours ago, Teancum said:

You shared limited info on something personal. I responded based on  that info. So blame yourself. don't bother with more details.  Not interested in talking with you further about it. 

No. Based on your insensitive and inflammatory comments about him here,  my sharing with you anything more about this sacred experience which has spanned 5 decades would be highly inappropriate and a huge disservice to  my friend.

Edited by Bernard Gui
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9 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

Oh, thank you, Scott. You are human after all! I have been waiting decades to be able to do this! 😉

On the other hand, this is also a brilliant pun. If intentional, my hat is off to you. I am not worthy. 👏

I never laid claim to not being human or to being perfect linguistically. I suppose what sets me apart from some others is I don’t get in a snit when that is pointed out. 
 

Thanks, by the way. 

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1 hour ago, Scott Lloyd said:

I never laid claim to not being human or to being perfect linguistically. I suppose what sets me apart from some others is I don’t get in a snit when that is pointed out. 
 

Thanks, by the way. 

No, I never thought you did. I hope I didn’t tempt you to get the snit. It was all in good fun. 

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2 hours ago, Rivers said:

First Presidency:  We really upset a lot of the conservatives in the church with our statement on vaccination.  We need to even things out by angering the liberals.

Elder Holland: I’ll get right on that.

If anything needed balancing out it was probably the university’s new vice president-level Office of Belonging, announced at the same faculty conference where Elder Holland made his much-maligned speech. 
 

Think about it: What more appropriate occasion to give a resounding acclamation of BYU’s uniqueness than one where it has just been announced that the school is jumping on the trendy “diversity, equity and inclusion“ bandwagon so that it can be like other institutions?
 

One wonders if we’re going to start seeing “safe spaces” and no-whites-allowed zones on campus now. 

Edited by Scott Lloyd
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The whole thing that gets me with this incident is that the whole thing could have been done with a bulk email to staff saying: "Staff are reminded that as employees of BYU, and by extension employees of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, you are expected to act in ways that are not antagonistic to church teachings". Then let Elder Holland speak on something else in his normal manner.

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18 minutes ago, JustAnAustralian said:

The whole thing that gets me with this incident is that the whole thing could have been done with a bulk email to staff saying: "Staff are reminded that as employees of BYU, and by extension employees of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, you are expected to act in ways that are not antagonistic to church teachings". Then let Elder Holland speak on something else in his normal manner.

I think the speech carried a needed impact that could not have been achieved by any bulk email. For better or worse, the public at large now understands, if they didn’t before, the standard to which administration, faculty and staff are being held. That affirmation might be dearly needed in days to come. 
 

Added later: Last year’s sorry episode involving the badly misconstrued intent of the Honor Code revision dramatizes how even on campus, too many are creeping away from that understanding. 

Edited by Scott Lloyd
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3 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

If anything needed balancing out it was probably the university’s new vice president-level Office of Belonging, announced at the same faculty conference where Elder Holland made his much-maligned speech. 
 

Think about it: What more appropriate occasion to give a resounding acclamation of BYU’s uniqueness than one where it has just been announced that the school is jumping on the trendy “diversity, equity and inclusion“ bandwagon so that it can be like other institutions. 
 

One wonders if we’re going to start seeing “safe spaces” and no-whites-allowed zones on campus now. 

Let the wild rumpus begin! Students occupying the Chancellor’s office, riding professors they dislike out on rails, shouting down dissent…all those fun things.  

I’ve imagined the Church cutting BYU loose from its influence, letting it fund and staff itself, set its own independent policies, make its way into the good graces of Big Academia, become like the others. I’m sure that’s not what the Brethren have in mind for its future, but it does give me something to ponder in retirement. 

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12 minutes ago, JustAnAustralian said:

The whole thing that gets me with this incident is that the whole thing could have been done with a bulk email to staff saying: "Staff are reminded that as employees of BYU, and by extension employees of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, you are expected to act in ways that are not antagonistic to church teachings". Then let Elder Holland speak on something else in his normal manner.

This too, but who reads administration emails? Even that would be booed as the Brethren’s heavy handed way of exerting unrighteousness dominion over “their” university. 

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8 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

I think the speech carried a needed impact that could not have been achieved by any bulk email. For better or worse, the public at large now understands, if they didn’t before, the standard to which administration, faculty and staff are being held. That affirmation might be dearly needed in days to come. 

I would replace “might” with “will.” I do not understand how employees or students who sign contracts with BYU go in not aware of what is expected. There are hundreds of other places to go with no such restrictions. Why go there with the intent to rearrange the furniture to one’s liking? Makes no sense to me.

 

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3 minutes ago, JustAnAustralian said:

Isn't that essentially the University of Utah?

Could be. Of course the name would have to be changed and statues of BY toppled. Any suggestions?

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15 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

Could be. Of course the name would have to be changed and statues of BY toppled. Any suggestions?

How about

Prince-Logo.jpg.35ace2fabe78114d3a9cdd57ce78a51b.jpg

The University Formerly Known as BYU?

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1 hour ago, Bernard Gui said:

I would replace “might” with “will.” I do not understand how employees or students who sign contracts with BYU go in not aware of what is expected. There are hundreds of other places to go with no such restrictions. Why go there with the intent to rearrange the furniture to one’s liking? Makes no sense to me.

 

do you think that BYU of 2021 should operate like BYU of 1941? who wants to attend a school or anything that doesn't keep up with the times?

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3 minutes ago, Duncan said:

do you think that BYU of 2021 should operate like BYU of 1941? who wants to attend a school or anything that doesn't keep up with the times?

Guys could have beards at least if it was. ;) 

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