BYU Hawaii denied medical exemption

[bsjkki]

Shouldn’t this student have been given admission and a scholarships to another BYU. 
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9806345/amp/Incoming-freshman-loses-scholarship-refusing-covid-vaccine-medical-conditions.html?__twitter_impression=true

BYU H did not announce their vaccine policy until June 16th. Far too late to apply for scholarships, admission and even housing elsewhere. ‘Infuriating unfairness’ indeed. 
 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by bsjkki

[Calm]

That “warmest alohas” is kind of annoying….more like “you are on your own, buddy” after ignoring the fact she was highly unlikely to be getting vaccinated ever!  Don't really buy “after careful consideration” in terms of her individual case.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Calm

[JustAnAustralian]

How has an incoming freshman already received 200K in scholarships?

[Calm]

45 minutes ago, JustAnAustralian said:

How has an incoming freshman already received 200K in scholarships?

Guaranteed 4 years of tuition and expenses, I am guessing (Presidential scholarship is now 150% of tuition, add on other scholarships).  BYUH was expensive when I looked into it (living expenses, can’t remember tuition.).

added:  looks like a Nelson Scholarship for BYUH would be about $33,000, estimated cost of attending 8 semesters is $80,000….

https://catalog.byuh.edu/tuition-and-fees

I wonder if the $200,000 was a typo for $20,000…looks like she is from Utah and involved in theatre (can’t guarantee the last, but the name popped up in connection with Shrek in Payson), her doctor is Utah based.

Hmm…I wonder if the problem was with the doctor who recommended no vaccine…looks like he does mostly cosmetic procedures now

https://xagemedicalspa.com/dr-stuart-b-porter

added:  or he is the owner of that, but also does functional medicine through another clinic at the same site (can’t get the website of that one to come up).

Edited July 20, 2021 by Calm

[pogi]

1 hour ago, bsjkki said:

Shouldn’t this student have been given admission and a scholarships to another BYU. 
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9806345/amp/Incoming-freshman-loses-scholarship-refusing-covid-vaccine-medical-conditions.html?__twitter_impression=true

BYU H did not announce their vaccine policy until June 16th. Far too late to apply for scholarships, admission and even housing elsewhere. ‘Infuriating unfairness’ indeed. 
 

 

 

 

 

 

I agree with BYU-H on this one.  They give several valid reasons for not accommodating her medical exemption. 

I can understand her fear of relapsing with Guillane Barre, but her fear is emotionally driven and not based in any medical reason and evidence.  On top of the reasons BYU-H mentioned, the medical exemption is not even really valid.  She doesn't have any legitimate condition that would be a contraindication (or even a precaution) to vaccination from a Covid vaccine.  Without a medical contraindication, there can be no legitimate medical exemption.  

There is absolutely no evidence that the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines increase risk for Guillane Barre, and only a tiny correlation (not causation) was seen with the Jansen vaccine.

Quote

 

The FDA added a warning that Johnson & Johnson's COVID-19 vaccine may trigger Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS) in a small number of people in a letter sent to the manufacturer on Monday.

Of the 12.5 million Americans who received this vaccine, about 100 people reported having GBS in the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS). Of these reports, 95 of them were serious and required hospitalization, and there was one reported death, an FDA spokesperson told MedPage Today.

No similar signal has been identified with the Moderna and Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccines, the FDA spokesperson said.

"Although the available evidence suggests an association between the Janssen vaccine and increased risk of GBS, it is insufficient to establish a causal relationship," the FDA said in a statement. "Importantly, the FDA has evaluated the available information for the Janssen COVID-19 vaccine and continues to find the known and potential benefits clearly outweigh the known and potential risks."

https://www.medpagetoday.com/infectiousdisease/covid19vaccine/93537

 

Quote

 

People with a history of Guillain-Barré syndrome

No cases of Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS) were reported following vaccination among participants in the mRNA COVID-19 vaccine clinical trials. One case of GBS was reported in a participant in the vaccine group in the Janssen COVID-19 vaccine clinical trial, compared to one GBS case among those who received placebo. With few exceptions, ACIP’s general best practice guidelines for immunization do not include history of GBS as a contraindication or precaution to vaccination. People with a history of GBS may receive any FDA-authorized COVID-19 vaccine. Any occurrence of GBS following COVID-19 vaccination should be reported to VAERSexternal icon.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/clinical-considerations/covid-19-vaccines-us.html#Contraindications

 

 

In no way shape or form does the risk of vaccine outweigh the benefits from a Guillane Barre standpoint, and especially not from a BYU-H standpoint. 

I do understand the concern over the late policy, but the student should have realized that her medical exemption is not legitimate and made other plans, just in case. 

Just get the vaccine.  Problem solved!

 

Edited July 20, 2021 by pogi

[Calm]

33 minutes ago, pogi said:

They give several valid reasons for not accommodating her medical exemption. 

I don’t have a problem with the refusal…one needs to consider others, including tourists/visitors who may risk getting stuck if testing positive…even if it had been a documented valid medical risk (though wondering if that could be illegal based on some disabilities laws?)

I do think they could have offered help to get her connected to other BYU…just a name and number and an offer to send her application documents would have been nice.

Her response of going on Sean Hannity was over the top IMO.

Quote

the student should have realized that her medical exemption is not legitimate

When her parents and doctor are telling her differently, few 18year olds are going to think otherwise.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Calm

[Calm]

35 minutes ago, pogi said:

Jansen vaccine.

Is the Johnson and Johnson also called Janssen? (Never mind, it obviously is)

Edited July 20, 2021 by Calm

[pogi]

9 minutes ago, Calm said:

I don’t have a problem with the refusal…one needs to consider others, including tourists/visitors who may risk getting stuck if testing positive.

I do think they could have offered help to get her connected to other BYU…just a name and number and an offer to send her application documents would have been nice.

Her response of going on Sean Hannity was over the top IMO.

If she had a valid medical reason not to get vaccinated, I would agree.  They don’t owe her anything.  She is choosing not to go to BYU-H, they are not turning her away.  She can go if she really wants.

Edited July 20, 2021 by pogi

[JAHS]

6 minutes ago, Calm said:

Is the Johnson and Johnson also called Janssen?

Yep. Same thing.

[pogi]

3 minutes ago, Calm said:

Is the Johnson and Johnson also called Jansen?

Yep.  Jansen Biotech.  Same company.  Jansen is just so much shorter to type than Johnson and Johnson.

[Calm]

10 minutes ago, pogi said:

They don’t owe her anything

They don’t, I think it would have been kind though because of the late announcement…and would have been a much better PR look rather than then ‘you are on your own’ letter.

added:  BYUH could have also thought ahead and warned students at the beginning of the application process that they might require vaccinations and what possible exemptions there might be and to prepare alternates.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Calm

[Calm]

Just now, pogi said:

Yep.  Jansen Biotech.  Same company.  Jansen is just so much shorter to type than Johnson and Johnson.

Okay…guessing you quoted first, but posted second as the corrected Janssen is in the above post, but not yours.  Either you were distracted or a slower typer….it is that time of day, looking for anything to distract from the hint of things to come….

[Calm]

She can take a year at UVU, she has till August 1

https://www.uvu.edu/registration/registration_deadlines/fall.html

$3000 plus fees, living expenses low since she can live at home.  I don’t know if they require vaccinations, will ask husband.  Doubt it.  All his students had Covid last year in one class, in another he had a nurse come in and gave extra credit for getting one.

Edited July 20, 2021 by Calm

[pogi]

12 minutes ago, Calm said:

They don’t, I think it would have been kind though…and would have been a much better PR look rather than then ‘you are on your own’ letter.

True, it would have been kind. But, when someone is trying to manipulate the system to get into your college, it seems that their response was appropriate.  

[Calm]

My niece did not get the vaccine because of past bad reactions. I don’t know what they were specifically, but it may have been medically more wise to get the vaccine. Thankfully after two weeks+, she is back to normal. Unfortunately everyone and the dog practically got it at the family reunion (she was so careful, but still went to Primary where a number of families turned up positive).  Only a few of the late bloomers are still working through it, but it could have been bad for my brother as he was getting steadily worse over a week or so.  He got the cocktail and is back at work today, though very tired. 
 

This just convinces me even more vaccines are needed. I am very pro getting the vaccine and if you don’t, your choice but don’t get upset that others don’t want to be around you (my niece was horrified it happened, she was probably at the reunion because most everyone assured her they weren’t bothered by her not taking it). Her husband had.  She is not anti vaccine. 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Calm

[Calm]

15 minutes ago, pogi said:

True, it would have been kind. But, when someone is trying to manipulate the system to get into your college, it seems that their response was appropriate.  

If you mean the doctor’s note, I see no reason not to assume she believes she shouldn’t take it and it was not manipulative. Otoh, the Sean Hannity interview looks like a way to either pressure BYUH into letting her in or into giving her a scholarship to another BYU and admitting her in fall or to get funding from sympathizers for other colleges…which is her right, but she is harming BYU and by extension the Church PRwise. I was more sympathetic before I realized how the info got out there.  I didn’t really think about it, hadn’t reached the whole article, and just assume it was picked off social media and spread. 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Calm

[bsjkki]

3 minutes ago, pogi said:

True, it would have been kind. But, when someone is trying to manipulate the system to get into your college, it seems that their response was appropriate.  

Your response seems overly harsh. She had no way of know her exemption would be denied and no way of knowing which schools would institute vaccine  mandates. Pfizer has had cases of GBS. If I had lost my ability to walk due to a vaccine injury. I would be incredibly hesitant to ever ‘give it a go.’ Especially being in an age group that rarely suffers any covid harm.
 

She was denied her exemption with an email that comes off incredibly ‘so sad, too bad’ and almost flippant. 
 

I don’t see how’ manipulating the system’ is defined by going public with your experience. Her story is true. I don’t expect BYU H to change their mind but I did not think a vaccine mandate would happen at any of the church schools. 

[bsjkki]

And if it’s true they are mandating for students but not faculty, they deserve the bad press. 

Edited July 21, 2021 by bsjkki

[bsjkki]

22 minutes ago, Calm said:

If you mean the doctor’s note, I see no reason not to assume she believes she shouldn’t take it and it was not manipulative. Otoh, the Sean Hannity interview looks like a way to either pressure BYUH into letting her in or into giving her a scholarship to another BYU and admitting her in fall or to get funding from sympathizers for other colleges…which is her right, but she is harming BYU and by extension the Church PRwise. I was more sympathetic before I realized how the info got out there.  I didn’t really think about it, hadn’t reached the whole article, and just assume it was picked off social media and spread. 

I find denigrating the source as needlessly politicizing this conversation. It was spread by Facebook and Instagram and Tiktok,  picked up by TPUSA. Do you really think the New York Times would care? Her mother was surprised and upset. Late notice of requirement caused much of the issue. She had already turned down all her other scholarships and successful admissions to other schools. Schools know May deadlines exist. They took a month after other Hawaii schools made their vaccination requirements before making this call. 

[Calm]

14 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

I find denigrating the source as needlessly politicizing this conversation

I meant agreeing to an interview by anyone as opposed to sharing the info with friends on a public platform and that getting picked up and then answering a reporter’s questions who had contacted her to be polite.  I would feel the same way if she went on BBC which is my preferred news source.

Edited July 21, 2021 by Calm

[The Nehor]

I smell a rat.

[Calm]

48 minutes ago, bsjkki said:

Late notice of requirement caused much of the issue. She had already turned down all her other scholarships and successful admissions to other schools. Schools know May deadlines exist. They took a month after other Hawaii schools made their vaccination requirements before making this call. 

That is why I think it would have been nice to have helped her get into a different BYU, whether there was a technical obligation or not. The midJune announcement was wrong IF there was no warning. Covid has been around for a year and they knew vaccines would be available for students at sometime that summer unless something major happened. The school had even more responsibility to plan ahead than one individual student.  If minds were changed due to the Delta variant, that was just stupidity imo because given enough time such a variant was going to show up and iirc it had been out there for some time.
 

The response as given shows little care for her as an individual.  I am disappointed that it came from a BYU  even if they are in the power seat because of the high demand of students who want to go there…unless things have changed drastically.  Practically every student in Provo wanted a year in Hawaii…especially in midwinter…when I was there, including me.

Are you seeing anything from BYU yet?  So far I am seeing just her side. There might have been additional contact explaining details, BYUH might have even sent out something in general. 
 

Added:  I think unless such problems were common, a decent solution would have been to waive tuition to BYUP and allow her to take classes where there was room at least. She could live at home, so she wouldn’t be taking up anyone else’s resources.  Or maybe free independent study for a year they didn’t feel comfortable giving her a spot.  Disappointing but she wouldn’t have to wait a year to start college. 

Edited July 21, 2021 by Calm

[bsjkki]

9 minutes ago, Calm said:

I meant agreeing to an interview by anyone as opposed to sharing the info with friends on a public platform and that getting picked up and then answering a reporter’s questions who had contacted her to be polite.  I would feel the same way if she went on BBC which is my preferred news source.

I guess I don’t see a difference. So talking with a reporter for print news is okay but not seeking the publicity? Facebook and social media is what you do when seeking publicity. Sorry, I am sensitive to the denigrating of sources,  if the information is factual and obviously misread your intent. 
 

Im trying to find out if it’s true all faculty are exempt? Anyone know?

[Raingirl]

57 minutes ago, pogi said:

True, it would have been kind. But, when someone is trying to manipulate the system to get into your college, it seems that their response was appropriate.  

I would think anyone heading off to college this fall would be smart enough to assume that vaccines would be required, and have a back-up plan in place in case their request for an exemption wasn’t approved.  Especially so in a state that has been pretty firm about Covid restrictions. 
 

At the university where I work, vaccination has been under discussion for many months, so no one would be caught off-guard by the requirement when the final decision was made. And it was made many months ahead of the fall term.  I can understand the university’s decision, as they are considering the well-being of the whole university community, as well as the surrounding community, and even the state. 

[bsjkki]

University of Hawaii drops vaccine requirement. 
 

https://www.khon2.com/coronavirus/university-of-hawaii-drops-in-person-coronavirus-vaccine-requirement-cites-high-vaccination-rates/

“When we announced that all students would be required to be vaccinated to participate on campus, it was with the condition, and frankly the expectation, that at least one vaccine would be fully approved by the FDA by the fall semester. Over 500 universities nationwide have announced vaccination requirements and the condition for full approval by the FDA is the same approach taken by for example the University of California and the Cal State University Systems, two of the largest higher education systems in the country. 

“The FDA has not completed the full approval process, so student vaccine mandate is as stated enforcement will be limited to students residing on campus not to attending classes in person. It may also extend to certain other specific activities, events and facilities that will be determined based on the health-risk assessment. Given the high rate of vaccination within our and new guidelines that we’re finalizing now, we’re confident that our campus es will be safe places to learn, live and conduct research. 

“Enforcement at the vaccination requirement to attend in-person classes will take place only after a vaccine is fully authorized by the FDA so that would be no sooner than the Spring 2022 semester. In the meantime, we will continue to reach out to all of our community to educate and to encourage.”

Edited July 21, 2021 by bsjkki