Protestant reformer martin luther

[Anakin7]

    One of the Father's of the protestant reformation Martin Luther once stated " Works are neccessary for salvation, but they do not cause salvation, for faith alone gives life". Where does this quote come from and what is the context?.  I have shared this quote on an LDS/Evangelical Facebook group of which one critic has stated that it is taken out of context regarding Martin Luther's total belief system of faith alone save's in connection to Martin Luther's other writings.  Any links or comments are welcomed. Tham/nk you.

The Atonement It Is The Central Doctrine, Washing My Garment/Robe In His Blood, In His Eternal Debt/Grace, He Died To Make Man Holy, It's Not Just 6 Words To A Song, They Have Eternal Meaning.

 

[MrShorty]

A quick internet search found:

1) This which references a Sermo 170: https://philgons.com/2010/06/luther-on-the-necessity-of-good-works/

2) Wikipedia, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_Fide which references (#58 as of today) Ewald M. Plass, "What Luther says," page 1509

I have no idea how one would track down either reference.

[Calm]

9 hours ago, MrShorty said:

A quick internet search found:

1) This which references a Sermo 170: https://philgons.com/2010/06/luther-on-the-necessity-of-good-works/

2) Wikipedia, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sola_Fide which references (#58 as of today) Ewald M. Plass, "What Luther says," page 1509

I have no idea how one would track down either reference.

While this is a massive collection of his sermons, I did not find that specific quote. And iirc the first volume had something similar.  I would suggest doing a “find”  for “works are” to locate relevant sections in the pdf assuming you don’t just want to read them.

Looks like the title to the desired lecture is “The Disputation Concerning Justification”.

https://www.monergism.com/sermons-martin-luther-8-volumes

Edited May 7, 2021 by Calm

[Calm]

I have looked online for the Disputation Concerning Justification, but can only find references to it so far. My suggestion if you want to read it is to talk to a librarian and see if they can special order a book that has it (there is apparently a collection abbreviated LW out there as it was referenced several times...Luther’s Works perhaps.  Added:  my guess was correct and I was just punning...). It is unlikely to be in most public libraries I am guessing. 
 

Thinking it is in one of this series:

https://www.thriftbooks.com/series/luthers-works/74607/

.

Edited May 7, 2021 by Calm

[Calm]

Found the full citation. It is Luther’s Works, Volume 34, page 165

https://www.fortresspress.com/store/product/9780800603342/Luther-Works-Volume-34-Career-of-the-Reformer-IV

Or used for $15

https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/luthers-works-vol-34-career-of-the-reformer-iv_martin-luther/9551606/#edition=8926568&idiq=9756607

Edited May 7, 2021 by Calm

[Robert F. Smith]

17 hours ago, Anakin7 said:

    One of the Father's of the protestant reformation Martin Luther once stated " Works are neccessary for salvation, but they do not cause salvation, for faith alone gives life". Where does this quote come from and what is the context?.  I have shared this quote on an LDS/Evangelical Facebook group of which one critic has stated that it is taken out of context regarding Martin Luther's total belief system of faith alone save's in connection to Martin Luther's other writings.  Any links or comments are welcomed. Tham/nk you.................

I don't know the source, but Luther makes perfect sense, since Jesus himself emphasized that we would all be judged by our works.  Yet Luther is also correct to emphasize faith, because it is the final arbiter:  If you only do works to be seen of men, then that reputation is your only reward.  But if you do works because of your faith, then that has value.  Works are a sign of faith, but only He who sees your heart knows whether you did those works for Him or for your own self-aggrandizement.  One would have thought that Luther would have read the letter of James in that light, but apparently not, which makes one wonder whether he actually understood that lesson properly.

[Robert F. Smith]

7 hours ago, Calm said:

I have looked online for the Disputation Concerning Justification, but can only find references to it so far. My suggestion if you want to read it is to talk to a librarian and see if they can special order a book that has it (there is apparently a collection abbreviated LW out there as it was referenced several times...Luther’s Works perhaps.  Added:  my guess was correct and I was just punning...). It is unlikely to be in most public libraries I am guessing. 
Thinking it is in one of this series:

https://www.thriftbooks.com/series/luthers-works/74607/.

I once took a course in Catholicism from a Paulist priest at Old St Mary's in Chinatown, San Francisco, and they had the complete works of Luther in their library.  He even cited Luther in his lessons.

[Bernard Gui]

5 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

I once took a course in Catholicism from a Paulist priest at Old St Mary's in Chinatown, San Francisco, and they had the complete works of Luther in their library.  He even cited Luther in his lessons.

He must have read The Art of War.

[Anakin7]

7 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

I don't know the source, but Luther makes perfect sense, since Jesus himself emphasized that we would all be judged by our works.  Yet Luther is also correct to emphasize faith, because it is the final arbiter:  If you only do works to be seen of men, then that reputation is your only reward.  But if you do works because of your faith, then that has value.  Works are a sign of faith, but only He who sees your heart knows whether you did those works for Him or for your own self-aggrandizement.  One would have thought that Luther would have read the letter of James in that light, but apparently not, which makes one wonder whether he actually understood that lesson properly.

I agree 100% Absolutly, Completly.

[MiserereNobis]

On 5/7/2021 at 3:48 AM, Robert F. Smith said:

I once took a course in Catholicism from a Paulist priest at Old St Mary's in Chinatown, San Francisco, and they had the complete works of Luther in their library.  He even cited Luther in his lessons.

@Bernard Gui, it appears a certain priest is in need of your particular type of assistance...

[poptart]

https://bookofconcord.org/formula-of-concord-solid-declaration/article-iv/

This is kinda lost on the Lutheran bodies here stateside, seems like they either say because they do more in church they are better or that they can "sin boldly" And do whatever.   After what I've seen I think Martin Luther would be rolling in his grave if he knew what people did with his work. 

Much as I like his work, for me the Catholic take on Repentance makes far more sense, that and it does a better job of zapping entitlement.

 

Quick edit, looks like the LDS church would agree with the Book of Concord, at a glance anyway.

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/tg/good-works?lang=eng

Edited May 8, 2021 by poptart

[poptart]

Just found this, was made in 2003.  Title of the movie is Luther, one of my favorites actually.  Thought it would be appropriate for this thread, it's the whole movie BTW.

Martin Luther | full movie in English | #martinLuther #jdschristmedia - YouTube

[Bernard Gui]

On 5/8/2021 at 8:43 AM, MiserereNobis said:

@Bernard Gui, it appears a certain priest is in need of your particular type of assistance...

Not sure what this means....

[CV75]

A tipsy Protestant Reformer walks into a bar carrying a stuffed kingbird, asking, "Can you make my martin loother?"

Edited May 9, 2021 by CV75

[MiserereNobis]

20 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

Not sure what this means....

Sorry, I was trying to make a joke that a Catholic priest quoting Luther needs to be examined by a Papal inquisitor like Gui.

[Bernard Gui]

4 hours ago, MiserereNobis said:

Sorry, I was trying to make a joke that a Catholic priest quoting Luther needs to be examined by a Papal inquisitor like Gui.

Ah.....That's a good one, but you must remember that no one expects the Mormon Inquisition!

[Calm]

Just now, Bernard Gui said:

no one expects the Mormon Inquisition!

Even the Mormon Inquisitor apparently....;)