Fair Mormon's new YouTube branding strategy

[bluebell]

14 minutes ago, Analytics said:

My understanding is that he called the police on the advice of a friend of his who happens to be an attorney. The rationalization for calling was that the video was really, really, disturbing and the police should be aware of it. This wasn't a judgment on Dehlin's part that the video was illegal--just that it was something the police should have in their file in case something somehow escalated.

I've been told that if somebody does something that really makes you feel threatened (e.g. posting a video that shows your head being bashed in), it is prudent to call the police and let them make the decision about how to handle it.

I can see that being the case.  But the call to 911 is weird.  Everyone that I have ever known in such a case (which has only been a couple of people) has just called the police station, since there isn't an emergency to warrant a 911 call.

And it's weird to call the police and specifically name people and organizations who did not produce the threat as being the ones the police should be aware of.  Wouldn't you want to make the police aware of the people who made the video?

I'm not saying that Dehlin and his family weren't sincerely disturbed by that horrible video.  I would be.  I would probably make sure the police knew about it too.  But the whole tweet about calling 911 and reporting the church (who Dehlin knew had nothing to do with the video whatsoever) seems like such a publicity stunt it's hard to take it very seriously.

[Analytics]

7 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I can see that being the case.  But the call to 911 is weird.  Everyone that I have ever known in such a case (which has only been a couple of people) has just called the police station, since there isn't an emergency to warrant a 911 call.

And it's weird to call the police and specifically name people and organizations who did not produce the threat as being the ones the police should be aware of.  Wouldn't you want to make the police aware of the people who made the video?

I'm not saying that Dehlin and his family weren't sincerely disturbed by that horrible video.  I would be.  I would probably make sure the police knew about it too.  But the whole tweet about calling 911 and reporting the church (who Dehlin knew had nothing to do with the video whatsoever) seems like such a publicity stunt it's hard to take it very seriously.

I completely agree, although I would add that relatively popular internet personalities promoting the video is also bad.

Edited December 8, 2020 by Analytics

[bluebell]

11 hours ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

 

Direct link. It’s disgusting and it needs to stop. 

One of Kwaku's biggest issues right now is that he doesn't know how to deal with being called out.  He's young and only a few years into this type of stuff so that's not surprising.  He responds the way my 15 year old responds to being called out, by doubling down on the behavior and embracing it even more.  It's an immature defense mechanism that probably makes sense for his age and experience level but it's not serving him well.  

It does need to stop but judging by other tweets and posts I've read, I don't think he has the humility or self awareness yet to let himself go there.  Hopefully he will be able to change eventually.  He could do so much good if he could get his ego out of the way.

[bluebell]

6 minutes ago, Analytics said:

I completely agree, although I would add that relatively popular internet personalities promoting the video is also bad.

Oh yes, it was so dumb that Brad and Kwaku linked to it and commented on it.  I really don't know how they thought that was a good idea, except that perhaps hubris blinded them.  

Edited December 8, 2020 by bluebell

[bluebell]

28 minutes ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

I think calling the police was the right thing to do (not 911 though). The video was disgusting and disturbing. That said, Dehlin’s attempt to monetize this, his publicly hosting of the video, and his reaching out to Kwaku all undermine his position as “victim”. 

This video was the best thing to happen to Dehlin in a long time.  He's relevant again.  I'm sure he's going to be laughing all the way to the bank.

[Meadowchik]

8 hours ago, Ipod Touch said:

OMG(oodness)! DezNAT ArE A BUnCH OF NaZI wHItE SuPREMaCISTS!!!!

Get out of here with that nonsense.

Deznat are a bunch of morons.  Idiot kids making "edgy" comments. Your moral panic is just a bunch of pearl clutching.

So your rebuttal is to not take DezNat seriously?

[Nemesis]

57 minutes ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

 

For the record, I find John Dehlin’s comments about Kwaku also disturbing. It’s gotta be hard to be Kwaku so I’m inclined to cut him a bit of slack (this does not extend to the person who actually created the video). 

Well I’m cringing over this blatant racism.  Wow!   Wonder how John is going to spin this one. 

[Ipod Touch]

43 minutes ago, Meadowchik said:

So your rebuttal is to not take DezNat seriously?

I take DezNat as seriously as I take Kpop stans on twitter.  Making some dumb kids on twitter out as some existential racist threat is peak boomer Karen.

[Analytics]

56 minutes ago, Nemesis said:

Well I’m cringing over this blatant racism.  Wow!   Wonder how John is going to spin this one. 

How is it racism? Because he called the cops on Kwaku and Cardon, but only invited Cardon to talk on his show?

[Ipod Touch]

4 minutes ago, Analytics said:

How is it racism? Because he called the cops on Kwaku and Cardon, but only invited Cardon to talk on his show?

Um.... John and that lady basically discounted Kwaku as a black man because he "sounds" and "acts" white.  Two pasty-white psuedo-intellectuals explaining that a black man isn't *really* black.

That's racism.

[bluebell]

6 minutes ago, Analytics said:

How is it racism? Because he called the cops on Kwaku and Cardon, but only invited Cardon to talk on his show?

I have the same question as I'm not seeing the race connection.  And John didn't invite Cardon onto his show, he asked Cardon if he could go on Cardon's show.

[juliann]

1 hour ago, Nemesis said:

Well I’m cringing over this blatant racism.  Wow!   Wonder how John is going to spin this one. 

I doubt he noticed it. Now we can see why Kelly accused him of racism. 

[smac97]

31 minutes ago, Analytics said:

How is it racism? Because he called the cops on Kwaku and Cardon, but only invited Cardon to talk on his show?

Nemesis linked to a post that has two videos, the second of which is, well, here's my transcript of that that lady is saying to John (where she is describing Kwaku) :

Quote

"...is that he doesn't speak like a, like many black people do.  He has a very English vernacular.  He doesn't have a black dialect.  So he speaks like a proper white person raised in Utah.  So he's the perfect figure for Mormonism, because he's basically like, seems like a white person with dark skin.  The way he talks.  The things he likes.  The way he dresses.  So, yeah..."

I'm reminded of this story:

Quote

Senator Joe Biden expressed regret today for describing presidential rival Barack Obama as an articulate and clean African-American, trying to stem damage to his nascent 2008 campaign.

The Delaware Democrat spoke today at the Democratic National Committee's winter meeting.

He told the audience "I want to say that I truly regret that the words I spoke offended people that I admire very much.".

Biden spent his first day as an official presidential candidate Wednesday explaining his statement that Obama is "the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean."

Thanks,

-Smac

Edited December 8, 2020 by smac97

[Maureen]

29 minutes ago, Ipod Touch said:

Um.... John and that lady basically discounted Kwaku as a black man because he "sounds" and "acts" white.  Two pasty-white psuedo-intellectuals explaining that a black man isn't *really* black.

That's racism.

What!!?? What does this statement even mean? Can you provide some context to explain what you're talking about?

M.

[Ipod Touch]

4 minutes ago, Maureen said:

What!!?? What does this statement even mean? Can you provide some context to explain what you're talking about?

M.

 

 

"He doesn't speak with a black dialiect.  he speaks like a proper white person raised in Utah"

[bluebell]

14 minutes ago, smac97 said:

Nemesis linked to a post that has two videos, the second of which is, well, here's my transcript of that that lady is saying to John (where she is describing Kwaku) :

I'm reminded of this story:

Thanks,

-Smac

Ah, I didn't see the second video with the woman.  Yeah, that's not a good look.

[Analytics]

16 minutes ago, smac97 said:

Nemesis linked to a post that has two videos, the second of which is, well, here's my transcript of that that lady is saying to John (where she is describing Kwaku) :

I'm reminded of this story:

Thanks,

-Smac

Thanks; I didn't see the second video.

[Meadowchik]

1 hour ago, Ipod Touch said:

I take DezNat as seriously as I take Kpop stans on twitter.  Making some dumb kids on twitter out as some existential racist threat is peak boomer Karen.

You are free to own that opinion and I disagree with it.

DezNat's contribution to LDS dialogue is harmful and corrosive. And the more the church is associated with it, even if through indirect associations like FairMormon, the more harmful it can be. 

 

[juliann]

2 hours ago, Meadowchik said:

So your rebuttal is to not take DezNat seriously?

What is your rebuttal to accusing Seriac of being DezNat when she is on record denouncing them in August? That is kind of ..... despicable.

[juliann]

13 minutes ago, Ipod Touch said:

"He doesn't speak with a black dialiect.  he speaks like a proper white person raised in Utah"

Who IS this racist lady? It wasn't that long ago when I was being scolded for bringing up race. I'd advise Kwaku haters to start checking their comment sections. It is starting.

[Analytics]

2 hours ago, SeekingUnderstanding said:

I think calling the police was the right thing to do (not 911 though). The video was disgusting and disturbing. That said, Dehlin’s attempt to monetize this, his publicly hosting of the video, and his reaching out to Kwaku all undermine his position as “victim”. 

One thing that might need clarification is the timeline of what Dehlin did and when. It looks like Dehlin saw the video on Friday night, and started contemplating whether he should call the cops then.

Saturday morning at 7:58 he reached out to Cardon and said he'd like to be a guest on his show.

Then at 1:21 pm John called 911 (I've been told that in most areas, it is appropriate to call 911 for a non-emergency--when they answer the phone they ask if it's an emergency and if it isn't they politely transfer you to the non-emergency line).

So the narrative that John called 911 and then reached out to Cardon is not quite right--he reached out to Cardon while contemplating calling the cops, but several hours before he actually did so.

[juliann]

9 minutes ago, Meadowchik said:

 

DezNat's contribution to LDS dialogue is harmful and corrosive. And the more the church is associated with it, even if through indirect associations like FairMormon, the more harmful it can be. 

 

Really. Knock it off.

I'm sure it's opinion the church supports every other noxious label you can think of but there is a Godwin's Law rule here. 

[smac97]

45 minutes ago, juliann said:

Quote

So your rebuttal is to not take DezNat seriously?

What is your rebuttal to accusing Seriac of being DezNat when she is on record denouncing them in August? That is kind of ..... despicable.

From Hanna's Twitter feed on August 12:

Quote

Requested by many thread-- thoughts on DezNat:

1. I like adherence to prophets, the Family Proclamation, and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. 

2. I don't like violent or overly inflammatory rhetoric.

3. I don't use the hashtag because there are some takes I don't like, but I don't think everyone who uses the hashtag is hateful. Most are decent with some in there that I disagree with on messaging.

4. I don't think speaking about them categorically is effective (it's a hecka mixed bag, sorry I'm doing it too yikes). 

5. I agree with them on some stuff and disagree on other stuff.

6. My thoughts are pretty nuanced, but essentially what they do well, I praise, what they don't do well, I don't, but that's the same for literally every person on Twitter. 

7. They probably disagree with some of my takes, but I don't view them all as hateful people.

Seems pretty reasonable.

Thanks,

-Smac

Edited December 8, 2020 by smac97

[kllindley]

Apparently, I am in the minority when it comes to the video retweeted by Kwaku and Ellis. I do find it distasteful. However, I also don't understand how it can possibly be perceived as a threat of violence. The bat was labeled (according to different sources) StoneXVI or This is the Show. How a production company or series of YouTube videos would inflict violence on John Dehlin is beyond me.  Maybe John is actually terrified that these videos will somehow kill him. But as far as I am concerned, this is blatantly a ploy for attention. Just another example of the double standard at play. 

 

[juliann]

1 minute ago, Analytics said:

One thing that might need clarification is the timeline of what Dehlin did and when. It looks like Dehlin saw the video on Friday night, and started contemplating whether he should call the cops then.

Saturday morning at 7:58 he reached out to Cardon and said he'd like to be a guest on his show.

Then at 1:21 pm John called 911 (I've been told that in most areas, it is appropriate to call 911 for a non-emergency--when they answer the phone they ask if it's an emergency and if it isn't they politely transfer you to the non-emergency line).

So the narrative that John called 911 and then reached out to Cardon is not quite right--he reached out to Cardon while contemplating calling the cops, but several hours before he actually did so.

I'm curious what that minor difference that makes to you.  

The real question is...when did he broadcast the video himself in this timeline? I heard he is claiming his lawyer told him to keep the dangerous meme that would bring murders to his home visible.