New Eagle Scouts in Your Ward?

[Bernard Gui]

Yesterday, our grandson Dedicatissimo (son of Artisticosso) along with four other lads in their stake received the Eagle Scout award. They earned it before the Church separated from Scouting, but due to current circumstances were unable to receive them until now. What is remarkable is that they started their trail back when the separation was announced, which put a lot of pressure on kids, leaders, and parents to complete everything on time. They did not run “Merit Badge Mills.” They served in positions of leadership. All the service projects were substantial. The average age of the boys was 13.5 years. Held outside at the heroic Scoutmaster’s large property, it was a moving experience. Dedicatissmo is my only grandson (out of 10) to earn the award. The rest were too young, some by just a few months.

Did Scouts in your ward make concerted efforts to earn their Eagle before the deadline? Our stake has some who have formed a non-LDS troop to continue in Scouting. Do you have any?

Edited September 21, 2020 by Bernard Gui

[Hamba Tuhan]

4 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

Did Scouts in your ward make concerted efforts to earn their Eagle before the deadline? Our stake has some who have formed a non-LDS troop to continue in Scouting. Do you have any?

The Church has had no relation with Scouting where I live. When I served as Young Men president, we had a couple of boys who were involved with a Scout troop, but they both said it was boring in comparison to their quorum activities.

[NoahVail]

12 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

Did Scouts in your ward make concerted efforts to earn their Eagle before the deadline? Our stake has some who have formed a non-LDS troop to continue in Scouting. Do you have any?

No. I'm personally glad to see the Church out of Scouting - for Scouting's sake.

For this next, I'm speaking about the SE US, where we marginalized Scouting on a good day. On a bad day LDS youth trashed scout camps to the point where camp councils were considering asking LDS units to skip that year.

I've served in about every position from tiger cub leader to unit commissioner. For a time, I was the liaison between our district and LDS units. I'm a huge shill for Scouting and not at all for LDS scouting. I'm not overstating the case to say that my years in LDS scouting may have been the worst experience of my life. I profoundly regret staying involved for as long as I did.

As to what actually went wrong, suffice to say it was mainly compulsive cloistering and ward politics - just ward members doing human nature stuff.

[ksfisher]

1 hour ago, NoahVail said:

No. I'm personally glad to see the Church out of Scouting - for Scouting's sake.

For this next, I'm speaking about the SE US, where we marginalized Scouting on a good day. On a bad day LDS youth trashed scout camps to the point where camp councils were considering asking LDS units to skip that year.

I've served in about every position from tiger cub leader to unit commissioner. For a time, I was the liaison between our district and LDS units. I'm a huge shill for Scouting and not at all for LDS scouting. I'm not overstating the case to say that my years in LDS scouting may have been the worst experience of my life. I profoundly regret staying involved for as long as I did.

As to what actually went wrong, suffice to say it was mainly compulsive cloistering and ward politics - just ward members doing human nature stuff.

So it doesn't sound like you've had any Eagle Scouts in your ward lately.

[Bob Crockett]

1 hour ago, NoahVail said:

No. I'm personally glad to see the Church out of Scouting - for Scouting's sake.

For this next, I'm speaking about the SE US, where we marginalized Scouting on a good day. On a bad day LDS youth trashed scout camps to the point where camp councils were considering asking LDS units to skip that year.

I've served in about every position from tiger cub leader to unit commissioner. For a time, I was the liaison between our district and LDS units. I'm a huge shill for Scouting and not at all for LDS scouting. I'm not overstating the case to say that my years in LDS scouting may have been the worst experience of my life. I profoundly regret staying involved for as long as I did.

As to what actually went wrong, suffice to say it was mainly compulsive cloistering and ward politics - just ward members doing human nature stuff.

I'm with you.  It was a disaster.  Although there were good men really interested in helping boys, it was just another place for men to engage in unbridled sandbox politics. And all my sons except one were eagle scouts.  Too much conflict between LDS and non-LDS units.  California Scouting really despised the LDS units.  

[Bernard Gui]

8 hours ago, NoahVail said:

No. I'm personally glad to see the Church out of Scouting - for Scouting's sake.

For this next, I'm speaking about the SE US, where we marginalized Scouting on a good day. On a bad day LDS youth trashed scout camps to the point where camp councils were considering asking LDS units to skip that year.

I've served in about every position from tiger cub leader to unit commissioner. For a time, I was the liaison between our district and LDS units. I'm a huge shill for Scouting and not at all for LDS scouting. I'm not overstating the case to say that my years in LDS scouting may have been the worst experience of my life. I profoundly regret staying involved for as long as I did.

As to what actually went wrong, suffice to say it was mainly compulsive cloistering and ward politics - just ward members doing human nature stuff.

Hmmm. A sour grapes and derailing response that has nothing to do with the OP. My experience with LDS Scouting in New Mexico, Illinois, Washington, and Australia are the opposite of yours. I’m sad to see it go. Now back to the OP. 

[Bernard Gui]

16 hours ago, Hamba Tuhan said:

The Church has had no relation with Scouting where I live. When I served as Young Men president, we had a couple of boys who were involved with a Scout troop, but they both said it was boring in comparison to their quorum activities.

So, none of the boys in your area pursued the Eagle award. Thanks. 

[NoahVail]

11 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

So, none of the boys in your area pursued the Eagle award. Thanks. 

Some sour grapes for our sour grapes?

[Bernard Gui]

3 hours ago, NoahVail said:

Some sour grapes for our sour grapes?

I’m celebrating the remarkable achievement of five young men, one of whom is my grandson, and the dedicated service of their leaders. Please take your negative comments to another more contentious thread of your own creation if this is all you have to offer.

Edited September 22, 2020 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

in addition to earning their Eagle award, the boys also completed a total of seven Eagle palms - all during the time between the announcement the Church was separating from Scouting and the actual termination of relationships!

Edited September 22, 2020 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

20 hours ago, Hamba Tuhan said:

The Church has had no relation with Scouting where I live. When I served as Young Men president, we had a couple of boys who were involved with a Scout troop, but they both said it was boring in comparison to their quorum activities.

We had many great experiences in both Scouting and AP quorums. Because they were closely intertwined in the United States, the two worked in tandem to serve boys. We were blessed to be a part of both.

Edited September 22, 2020 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

19 hours ago, Bob Crockett said:

I'm with you.  It was a disaster.  Although there were good men really interested in helping boys, it was just another place for men to engage in unbridled sandbox politics. And all my sons except one were eagle scouts.  Too much conflict between LDS and non-LDS units.  California Scouting really despised the LDS units.  

What does this have to do with the OP? My experience was not like you describe. The dedication of the men and boys I witnessed at the Eagle Court of Honor was uplifting and inspirational. They were blessed to be a part of it.

Edited September 22, 2020 by Bernard Gui

[truth a la carte]

Our ward had a great scouting program, the best I've seen in any ward I've been in. The leaders were excellent and loved scouting, and (most of) the boys loved scouting as well. When it was announced that the Church would be separating from scouting, the scout leaders put together a timeline, outlining exactly what needed to be accomplished and by what date . The timeline was simple but extremely thorough, and included all advancements and time-based requirements, as well as the number of campouts that the boys needed to go on.

Just about all the boys in our ward earned their Eagles who (a) had started scouting in time, and (b) would have earned their Eagle under normal circumstances. The last group to finish was quite young, average age 13.5 just like the group in Bernard Gui's ward, and as a result things were really tight at the end there. Three did their Boards of Review in mid-December with *just* enough time to send their completed projects to BSA.

Our ward has a few stragglers who were close but didn't quite make it due to their age. Both come from families that have always been heavily into scouting. They plan to join another scout troop for a year or two to finish things up. A close friend of many of the boys belongs to a troop sponsored by the kids' school, and the boys plan to switch over to that one (they may have done this already).

 

[Bernard Gui]

1 hour ago, truth a la carte said:

Our ward had a great scouting program, the best I've seen in any ward I've been in. The leaders were excellent and loved scouting, and (most of) the boys loved scouting as well. When it was announced that the Church would be separating from scouting, the scout leaders put together a timeline, outlining exactly what needed to be accomplished and by what date . The timeline was simple but extremely thorough, and included all advancements and time-based requirements, as well as the number of campouts that the boys needed to go on.

Just about all the boys in our ward earned their Eagles who (a) had started scouting in time, and (b) would have earned their Eagle under normal circumstances. The last group to finish was quite young, average age 13.5 just like the group in Bernard Gui's ward, and as a result things were really tight at the end there. Three did their Boards of Review in mid-December with *just* enough time to send their completed projects to BSA.

Our ward has a few stragglers who were close but didn't quite make it due to their age. Both come from families that have always been heavily into scouting. They plan to join another scout troop for a year or two to finish things up. A close friend of many of the boys belongs to a troop sponsored by the kids' school, and the boys plan to switch over to that one (they may have done this already).

 

Thanks so much for the comment. That is exactly what our leaders did here. It’s the true spirit of Scouting and priesthood service. Those boys are blessed to have such dedicated leaders. This experience  will have positive life-long impact on the boys, their parents, and the leaders. That was already evident in the remarks of the boys at our grandson’s Court of Honor. My Scoutmaster Howard Adams was one of the most influential men in my life.  

Edited September 22, 2020 by Bernard Gui

[Ginger Snaps]

No.  I literally can't remember the last time we had an Eagle scout in our ward, though to be fair, we also do not have a large quantity of youth.  Scouting was dead here long before the church finally pulled out.  None of the boys that age were interested, beyond a little bit of camping/fishing.  

[Calm]

The issue with Church scouting vs regular scouting is as with everything, one tends to be more committed to something if one chooses to be involved rather than required to be involved.  Think involvement variation of Little League vs playing baseball/softball in PE classes. 
 

With Church scouting there was a huge variation in experience depending on leaders. My husband was positive about scouts because his last scouting leader was like a second father to the boys. But if his first scouting leader had been his last, I bet he would have hated it given that man came in the first day and told the boys they were all losers and always would be and taught class that way. 
 

My son started out with a great Den mother, but when we moved to Canada in a newly wed (students) and nearly dead (seniors, mostly women) ward and he ended up with me as Akela, someone with no experience or love for scouting (and in fact the longer I did stuff the more I disliked it as everything that would make the kids really bond with scouting was so expensive except the Church stake stuff) who only volunteered because no one else would. I tried my best but no way was I going to invest or require the Church to invest in hundreds or thousands of dollars in training for me when I was only going to be in until they found someone better...thankfully after a year they got in a dad who knew what he was doing. I think I did okay as I tried hard not to let my personal feelings get in the way of having fun or doing things the scouting way, but with 11 boys to track and no experience, it was very hard to complete projects in a timely fashion, so they were likely behind on badge work.  I highly doubt any of the young men came out of that year feeling committed to scouting.  Otoh, my son’s later years were absolutely fantastic as a diehard scouter moved into the ward and took up after cubs and his Young Men leaders were all the high adventure type, though not so much into getting all the scout awards. He didn’t get his Queen Venturer award and didn’t care, but he went kayaking on the ocean, winter and summer camps, learned how to rock climb and many other experiences.  
 

But from what I have seen, as time went on, there were fewer leaders available with much scouting training.  And therefore quality dropped. The expense of training including time for parents who were already booked heavily in other ways was unreasonable, imo. 

[Bernard Gui]

44 minutes ago, Ginger Snaps said:

No.  I literally can't remember the last time we had an Eagle scout in our ward, though to be fair, we also do not have a large quantity of youth.  Scouting was dead here long before the church finally pulled out.  None of the boys that age were interested, beyond a little bit of camping/fishing.  

That’s sad. Scouting had so much more to offer than camping and fishing. 

[Bernard Gui]

19 minutes ago, Calm said:

The issue with Church scouting vs regular scouting is as with everything, one tends to be more committed to something if one chooses to be involved rather than required to be involved.  Think involvement variation of Little League vs playing baseball/softball in PE classes. 
 

With Church scouting there was a huge variation in experience depending on leaders. My husband was positive about scouts because his last scouting leader was like a second father to the boys. But if his first scouting leader had been his last, I bet he would have hated it given that man came in the first day and told the boys they were all losers and always would be and taught class that way. 
 

My son started out with a great Den mother, but when we moved to Canada in a newly wed (students) and nearly dead (seniors, mostly women) ward and he ended up with me as Akela, someone with no experience or love for scouting (and in fact the longer I did stuff the more I disliked it as everything that would make the kids really bond with scouting was so expensive except the Church stake stuff) who only volunteered because no one else would. I tried my best but no way was I going to invest or require the Church to invest in hundreds or thousands of dollars in training for me when I was only going to be in until they found someone better...thankfully after a year they got in a dad who knew what he was doing. I think I did okay as I tried hard not to let my personal feelings get in the way of having fun or doing things the scouting way, but with 11 boys to track and no experience, it was very hard to complete projects in a timely fashion, so they were likely behind on badge work.  I highly doubt any of the young men came out of that year feeling committed to scouting.  Otoh, my son’s later years were absolutely fantastic as a diehard scouter moved into the ward and took up after cubs and his Young Men leaders were all the high adventure type, though not so much into getting all the scout awards. He didn’t get his Queen Venturer award and didn’t care, but he went kayaking on the ocean, winter and summer camps, learned how to rock climb and many other experiences.  
 

But from what I have seen, as time went on, there were fewer leaders available with much scouting training.  And therefore quality dropped. The expense of training including time for parents who were already booked heavily in other ways was unreasonable, imo. 

Thanks, but maybe more appropriate for a different thread?

The same can be said of adult leaders in the current AP program. I admire adults who magnify their callings with the youth even when it might be inconvenient or require sacrifice. In my experience as a Scout and as a long-time leader, it was always made clear that what we did was “for the boys.” 

 I hope the new program is successful in fostering that attitude. It certainly paid off for my grandson and his family. 

Edited September 22, 2020 by Bernard Gui

[Calm]

Would you like me to delete?  I am fine if so. 

[Tacenda]

1 hour ago, Calm said:

Would you like me to delete?  I am fine if so. 

I don't think it was wrong for this thread, what you said! 

About the topic, and to save my allotment of posts, I'll add that I am excited to see that they will do something similar to scouting! My boys never got their eagle, nor did my husband, all of them got all the way to just short of their eagle, and helped all of the other boys get theirs. We didn't hold over a driver's license or ? to get them to get it, nor did we do much to help them other than encourage them because we'd seen other parents do a lot of the work. My husband was in scouting for years, and I was so happy that he was there. I was a Den Leader and enjoyed that so much! Young men need these experiences, but hoping they will be ultra careful to make sure there isn't abuse or neglect. I bet that is totally being handled. 

[Amulek]

On 9/21/2020 at 1:43 AM, Bernard Gui said:

Did Scouts in your ward make concerted efforts to earn their Eagle before the deadline? Our stake has some who have formed a non-LDS troop to continue in Scouting. Do you have any?

Those who were fairly close made a concerted effort to finish things off before the deadline. Technically, a couple of them ended up moving to a non-LDS troop because, while they had finished everything prior to the end of the year, there wasn't enough time to get them all scheduled for their board(s)? of review. 

However, it seemed as though pretty much everyone who was First Class or lower (who would have needed to join / go another year for minimum leadership requirements) didn't really bother.

 

[Bernard Gui]

6 hours ago, Calm said:

Would you like me to delete?  I am fine if so. 

Not at all. 

[Bernard Gui]

5 hours ago, Tacenda said:

I don't think it was wrong for this thread, what you said! 

About the topic, and to save my allotment of posts, I'll add that I am excited to see that they will do something similar to scouting! My boys never got their eagle, nor did my husband, all of them got all the way to just short of their eagle, and helped all of the other boys get theirs. We didn't hold over a driver's license or ? to get them to get it, nor did we do much to help them other than encourage them because we'd seen other parents do a lot of the work. My husband was in scouting for years, and I was so happy that he was there. I was a Den Leader and enjoyed that so much! Young men need these experiences, but hoping they will be ultra careful to make sure there isn't abuse or neglect. I bet that is totally being handled. 

This thread is about boys and leaders who went the extra mile to earn the Eagle award before the Church separated from Scouting, not about what people don’t like about Scouting. Perhaps someone could start one and so folks can vent there?

[Bernard Gui]

5 hours ago, Amulek said:

Those who were fairly close made a concerted effort to finish things off before the deadline. Technically, a couple of them ended up moving to a non-LDS troop because, while they had finished everything prior to the end of the year, there wasn't enough time to get them all scheduled for their board(s)? of review. 

However, it seemed as though pretty much everyone who was First Class or lower (who would have needed to join / go another year for minimum leadership requirements) didn't really bother.

 

Thanks for the comments. I suspect there were many who just let it slide. IMO, that’s a shame. In the past having Eagle Scout on your resume was a big plus. It may have lost a bit of its luster now, but my hat is off to those who made the effort to finish the course. That will serve them well in future endeavors. 

[Tacenda]

43 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

This thread is about boys and leaders who went the extra mile to earn the Eagle award before the Church separated from Scouting, not about what people don’t like about Scouting. Perhaps someone could start one and so folks can vent there?

True, hope you get more comments to help you out.