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Covid II: Medical Info and Implications


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I will probably edit more direction for new posters later, but for now requests to avoid purely political and mostly political comments still apply.  If a source is primarily political, find another source like an original study it refers to and leave out any likely political comments such as "why aren't we hearing about this?"  If there is no other source, quote the medical info only, put in a link and warn it is political, but you only want to discuss the medical info.

Please, please, please do not attribute dishonesty or bullying or other negative personal attributes to other posters.  Please do not be disingenous or intimidate (I am assuming posters have strong self identities and can handle a little of this if it does seem to be occurring by ignoring it, I don't want derails focusing on these...report instead).  This can be a highly emotional topic given it is life and death and quality of life for many whether medical or other, so expect frustrations to be high at times.  If you feel a post goes too far, please report it and ignore the personal stuff so you don't add to a derail.  Or send me a PM and let me use my opening poster status that gives me and only me  (well, besides mods) the right to do a little bullying.

Topic is Covid 19, medical news including what we know and don't know.  This includes emotional and mental health, physical and psychological and social...but NOT political.  Thread is meant to be both resource for easy researching (links found for you by others) as well as discussions to help us frame our ideas and put the info together.

When in doubt, start your own thread if you really want to discuss something I see implying politics too much...I realize you can't read my mind, but guess based on the previous thread please.  And you can always ask.  I will be less hesitant to report posters to mods this thread; also be aware I will be more protective of those I see as providing valuable 'expert' opinion, whether in medical field, legal, charitable works, etc (meaning one is either a professional or a volunteer with experience in the topic being discussed or demonstrate to my view they have done extensive research from a variety of resources so can approach the sub topic in academic as well as conversational manner).

Claims need to be backed up with references, please use medical studies if possible when discussing those.  Link whenever possible, if no link provide enough enough it is easy for google to track down the reference you are using rather than ending up with a half dozen articles on the subject (like a direct quote or point out a few unusual keywords).

Previous thread available here for catch-up or to track down that article you know you saw (board search function can be limited to a thread and will search posts less than a year old):

https://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/72931-co-vid-19-what-is-and-isnt-known-discussion-and-debate/

 

Edited by Calm
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Posted (edited)

My daughter had just been prescribed this first drug the day before I read this, but don't know if it is at a strong enough dose.  I meant to try it because the usual nasal sprays don't touch the post nasal drip for me (TMI I know, but that is standard for me, right?)

https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/cebina-identifies-a-common-antihistamine-nasal-spray-as-a-potential-anti-covid-19-approach-301090185.html

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CEBINA, in collaboration with Professor Robert Konrat, a renowned structural biologist (University of Vienna, Austria) has applied a computational approach, integrating several software tools and novel biological pathway analysis, to identify potential anti-COVID-19 drugs. This approach was complemented with in vitro viral infection testing with SARS-CoV-2 performed in a collaboration with Professor Ferenc Jakab, Head of the BSL-4 Laboratory in the Szentágothai Research Center, University of Pécs, Hungary. The results show that five generic drugs demonstrate anti-SARS-CoV-2 activity. The most potent among the identified drugs, Azelastine is available as a topically applied product and has only modest side-effects. The other identified drugs are commonly used in anti-hypertensive therapy: Telmisartan, Metoprolol, Losartan and Amiloride.

I really hope this doesn't get me autobanned for too many drug names....

Edited by Calm
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Another nasal spray or inhaler product being investigated:

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/08/418241/aeronabs-promise-powerful-inhalable-protection-against-covid-19

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Led by UCSF graduate student Michael Schoof, a team of researchers engineered a completely synthetic, production-ready molecule that straitjackets the crucial SARS-CoV-2 machinery that allows the virus to infect our cells. As reported in a new paper, now available on the preprint server bioRxiv, experiments using live virus show that the molecule is among the most potent SARS-CoV-2 antivirals yet discovered.

In an aerosol formulation they tested, dubbed “AeroNabs” by the researchers, these molecules could be self-administered with a nasal spray or inhaler. Used once a day, AeroNabs could provide powerful, reliable protection against SARS-CoV-2 until a vaccine becomes available. The research team is in active discussions with commercial partners to ramp up manufacturing and clinical testing of AeroNabs. If these tests are successful, the scientists aim to make AeroNabs widely available as an inexpensive medication to prevent and treat COVID-19.

“Far more effective than wearable forms of personal protective equipment, we think of AeroNabs as a molecular form of PPE that could serve as an important stopgap until vaccines provide a more permanent solution to COVID-19,” said AeroNabs co-inventor Peter Walter, PhD, professor of biochemistry and biophysics at UCSF and a Howard Hughes Medical Institute Investigator. For those who cannot access or don’t respond to SARS-CoV-2 vaccines, Walter added, AeroNabs could be a more permanent line of defense against COVID-19.

Medical study:

https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.08.08.238469v1

Edited by Calm
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First: Gloves haven't scored a mention since March. No "they help' or 'nope. we were wrong'. What gives? I still wear them.

Second: Initially there was a lot of consensus that the virus was primarily transmitted via conducive surfaces. That ought to indicate that unmodified indoor activity is where most of our risk is.  I've heard nothing concrete since.

In the last 2 months, I've heard a number of researchers strongly suggesting (or even warning) that aerialization is a vector we need to be concerned with. Sometimes it includes a lot of discussion about droplet size.  However, there's little clarification or amplification of those researchers' concerns. Again, what gives?

 

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Did you read the previous thread? It had several posts about aerosols. 

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Just now, Calm said:

Did you read the previous thread? It had several posts about aerosols. 

Today's my first day.  I'll look.

Perhaps it'll be worth revisiting here. You know how bazillion-post-threads are.

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7 minutes ago, NoahVail said:

First: Gloves haven't scored a mention since March. No "they help' or 'nope. we were wrong'. What gives? I still wear them.

Second: Initially there was a lot of consensus that the virus was primarily transmitted via conducive surfaces. That ought to indicate that unmodified indoor activity is where most of our risk is.  I've heard nothing concrete since.

In the last 2 months, I've heard a number of researchers strongly suggesting (or even warning) that aerialization is a vector we need to be concerned with. Sometimes it includes a lot of discussion about droplet size.  However, there's little clarification or amplification of those researchers' concerns. Again, what gives?

 

Correction requested if this is wrong, but as far as I know the virus is spread by getting into another person's body after coming in through that person's eyes or nose or mouth, which is why it helps to wear a mask over your nose and mouth to try to keep the virus, if you have it, from getting into someone else's body as you breathe and your breath travels through the air to enter someone else's mouth or nose or eyes .  I don't know why goggles aren't recommended but I wear glasses now so they keep mine covered.  Gloves aren't considered necessary because the focus is on washing your hands before you touch your mouth or nose or eyes.  

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I intend to take more of a back-seat in this thread. I think I may have come off as overbearing in the last one and made some enemies unintentionally.  But I might poke my head in every now and then to make some observations and share experiences, and maybe answer some honest questions that I think I can help with. 

Edited by pogi
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57 minutes ago, NoahVail said:

Today's my first day.  I'll look.

Perhaps it'll be worth revisiting here. You know how bazillion-post-threads are.

I don’t have a problem with continuing the discussion as it is still being researched. But to avoid confusion with other posters who might see this as carrying on what we were talking about or make assumptions posters are aware of points brought up in the other thread, it would be a good idea to skim through the older thread and read the more informative posts and check out the linked articles. 

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1 hour ago, Ahab said:

Correction requested if this is wrong, but as far as I know the virus is spread by getting into another person's body after coming in through that person's eyes or nose or mouth, which is why it helps to wear a mask over your nose and mouth to try to keep the virus, if you have it, from getting into someone else's body as you breathe and your breath travels through the air to enter someone else's mouth or nose or eyes .  I don't know why goggles aren't recommended but I wear glasses now so they keep mine covered.  Gloves aren't considered necessary because the focus is on washing your hands before you touch your mouth or nose or eyes.  

I agree wholeheartedly Ahab! Today I had an eye exam, and I'm sure the doc and me were thankful for masks!! And I too worry that I should be wearing some kind of glasses. 

Also, I tried something, I have a slight runny nose, from allergies I believe, and was worried it may turn into a cold. So guess what this girl did, I put hand sanitizer on a Q-tip and saturated my nose inside hoping to zap it, haha. I guess you do what you do, by instinct or what not. I just hate the thought of getting a cold and not knowing if it's Covid. This is my second bout of thinking it was a hefty cold, but it petered out in one or two days. 

But really believe the percentage of covid cases dissipate with mask wearing. 

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6 hours ago, Tacenda said:

I agree wholeheartedly Ahab! Today I had an eye exam, and I'm sure the doc and me were thankful for masks!! And I too worry that I should be wearing some kind of glasses. 

Also, I tried something, I have a slight runny nose, from allergies I believe, and was worried it may turn into a cold. So guess what this girl did, I put hand sanitizer on a Q-tip and saturated my nose inside hoping to zap it, haha. I guess you do what you do, by instinct or what not. I just hate the thought of getting a cold and not knowing if it's Covid. This is my second bout of thinking it was a hefty cold, but it petered out in one or two days. 

But really believe the percentage of covid cases dissipate with mask wearing. 

Rather unorthodox, I can recommend a saline solution as a more orthodox method and very effective in my experience. 

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Can’t remember if this got posted (been ignoring my medical app as I was experimenting with adjustments to new med):

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamacardiology/fullarticle/2768916

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamacardiology/fullarticle/2768914

Concerns with cardio issues

Edited by Calm
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Aug. 18, 2020 -- The COVID-19 pandemic has spread so rapidly since the first U.S. case was reported Jan. 20 that it’s now the third-leading cause of death in the country, Thomas Frieden, MD, former director of the CDC, told CNN.

"COVID is now the No. 3 cause of death in the U.S. -- ahead of accidents, injuries, lung disease, diabetes, Alzheimer's, and many, many other causes," Frieden said.

The CDC says heart disease and cancer are the first- and second-leading causes of death.

The coronavirus has caused more than 170,000 deaths in the United States and has been taking more than 1,000 lives weekly for several weeks, Frieden said.

"Last week, Americans were eight times more likely to get killed by COVID than were Europeans," he said.

https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200818/covid-the-third-leading-cause-of-death-in-the-us

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FYI, if you are experiencing abnormal levels of anxiety or depression, you might be watching too much Covid news. 

Things you might try:

https://www.everydayhealth.com/infectious-diseases/tips-on-how-to-handle-anxiety-in-the-time-of-covid-19/

I am finding it quite interesting how different family and friends are coping...or not.  Some denying, some obsessing, some going ‘clinical’ (my version, not sure it it is to try to get a sense of control or more emotional distancing), some withdrawing.  
 

Edited by Calm
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This is not to become political, just to give a window into how many teachers are feeling vulnerable right now and so how we might help.

Be extra supportive of teachers you know right now. If you have a chance, maybe call and function as a listening ear for their concerns.  Not all are feeling troubled, but some are. The last few weeks I am talking almost nightly with my sister as she is preparing for getting back to teaching, trying to figure out her routine. She lives alone and with Covid lacks her usual support system. We help each other with our concerns about Mom, me her about teaching, she me about my daughter and family stuff best not talked about with family (like how sometimes I want to slap them out of their silliness). 
 

 For most people sharing concerns helps them feel more in control as long as it doesn’t become routine. 
 

From my med app:

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Teachers are drafting wills and obits along with lesson plans. The Florida Times Union foundthat some educators in the state are now prioritizing the drafting of their wills as in-person classes start up again amid the deadly coronavirus outbreak. When Jacksonville special education teacher Whitney Red****, 33, posted a draft of her own obituary on Facebook, it went viral.

My sister updated her will. Not just because of Covid, but I think it contributed.

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Some possible good news, 57% would be huge reduction if true, especially if those who were asymptomatic or mild cases had a similar effect as honestly, taking blood from people recovering from a drastic illness seems kind of cruel even though worth it for many.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.07.29.20162917v1
 

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To determine the effect of COVID-19 convalescent plasma on mortality, we aggregated patient outcome data from randomized clinical trials, matched control, and case-series studies. Fixed-effects analyses demontrated that hospitalized COVID-19 patients transfused with convalescent plasma exhibited a ã57% reduction in mortality rate (13%) compared to matched-patients receiving standard treatments (25%; OR: 0.43, P < 0.001). These data provide evidence favouring the efficacy of human convalescent plasma as a therapeutic agent in hospitalized COVID-19 patients.

 

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I hope Pogi pops in and lets us know if there is any talk about this:

https://news.yale.edu/2020/08/15/yales-rapid-covid-19-saliva-test-receives-fda-emergency-use-authorization
 

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.08.03.20167791v1
 

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The FDA has given the green light for a fast saliva test. On Saturday, the FDA issued emergency use authorization to Yale School of Public Health for SalivaDirect, a new method for the rapid detection of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. The technique does not require any special type of swab or collection device — a saliva sample can be collected in any sterile container. Nathan Grubaugh, PhD, a researcher at Yale, told YaleNews that he expected labs to charge about $10 per sample.

https://www.everydayhealth.com/infectious-diseases/coronavirus-alert/

Good, good news if true:

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Researchers see possible lasting immunity even after mild cases. The New York Timesreported Sunday that several new studies (including prepress research in MedRxiv and a study in the journal Cell) that suggest even people who have had mild symptoms of COVID-19 may be building strong and long-lasting immunity to the virus

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.08.01.20166553v1

https://www.cell.com/action/showPdf?pii=S0092-8674(20)31008-4

Edited by Calm
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From the Everyday Health link (I like Everyday though it isn’t always precise interpretation because it presents a wide range of snippets, includes links for more in-depth for those that interest me, and they keep a non political tone even when talking about politics).

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The pandemic is having a devastating effect on the education of young people, a UN study found. The International Labor Organization (ILO), an agency of the United Nations (UN), published its global survey of youth this week, highlighting that more than 70 percent of students around the world have been negatively impacted by the closure of schools and training centers because of the pandemic. The study, based on 12,000 participants age 18 to 29 from 112 countries, also found that 1 in 6 young people who were employed before the outbreak stopped working altogether, and working hours among employed youth fell by nearly one-quarter. About 17 percent said that they were experiencing anxiety and depression related to the outbreak.

On a positive note, almost one-third of respondents were actively volunteering, and 27 percent said they were making donations toward the COVID-19 response

 

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This concerns me...when the lights are off, will the masks stay on?  Eating means no masks. 
 

http://investor.amctheatres.com/file/Index?KeyFile=404963658

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AMC Safe & Clean components include significant reductions in the maximum tickets available for each showtime and seat blocking in reserved seating auditoriums to allow for appropriate social distancing between parties, enhanced cleaning procedures that include extra time between showtimes to allow for a full, thorough cleaning and nightly disinfecting utilizing electrostatic sprayers, use of high tech HEPA vacuums, upgraded air filtration efforts including the use of MERV 13 filters wherever possible, new guest and associate safety protocols that include mandatory mask wearing by all guests and associates, hand sanitizing stations throughout the theatre, and the availability to guests of disinfectant wipes. The entire AMC Safe & Clean plan can be found at amctheatres.com/amc-safe-and-clean.

AMC is planning to open more than 100 theatres on August 20, with additional theatres to follow during the next two weeks. As currently planned, the following theatres are set to open on August 20, when guests can enjoy movie tickets for just 15 cents each (plus tax).

 

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One more...toss the neck gaiters and bandanas...the first makes things worse, second why bother wearing it?

https://advances.sciencemag.org/content/early/2020/08/07/sciadv.abd3083

I think this is the MacGyver gadget we were talking about last thread. 
 

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A schematic and demonstration image are shown in Fig. 1. In brief, an operator wears a face mask and speaks into the direction of an expanded laser beam inside a dark enclosure. Droplets that propagate through the laser beam scatter light, which is recorded with a cell phone camera. A simple computer algorithm is used to count the droplets in the video. The required hardware for these measurements is commonly available; suitable lasers and optical components are accessible in hundreds of research laboratories or can be purchased for less than $200, and a standard cell phone camera can serve as a recording device. The experimental setup is simple and can easily be built and operated by non-experts.

 

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Want to help others?:

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Blood Donors Needed

The American Red Cross is seeking people who have fully recovered from the coronavirus to sign up to donate plasma to help current COVID-19 patients. You may qualify to donate plasma if you meet specific convalescent plasma and regular blood donation requirements. The FDA offers more information about plasma donations on its website. The Red Cross continues to have an emergency need for regular blood donations as well, facing an ongoing critical blood shortage.

Help the Hungry

As the result of job losses, school closures, and health concerns related to the COVID-19 pandemic, many communities and individuals are in need across America. Feeding America is seeking donations to support food banks nationwide.

 

 

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5 hours ago, Calm said:

One more...toss the neck gaiters and bandanas...the first makes things worse, second why bother wearing it?

Just based on personal observation, but the people I know who wear bandannas tend to be those who would just as soon not wear any face covering at all, but want to be seen as being compliant with the law / social norms. They don't want to go so far as to make an affirmative political statement against wearing masks - unlike, say, those who have been making face coverings out of lace - but they don't really care that strongly about wearing masks either, so the intent is to do the minimum amount necessary in order to remain compliant and be seen / perceived as being supportive. 

 

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