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Two Anecdotes Re: Most Foreign Missionaries Coming Home


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17 minutes ago, Rain said:

I had actually thought of a medical example.  I had severe pre-eclampsia with my first child.  At some point, after 2 weeks in the hospital my blood pressure shot up more and wasn't coming down.  They started me on pitocin to start contractions.  The pitocin was doing nothing for me though.  The doctor finally talked with me and told me that things were not progressing.  He gave me the option of starting a c-section or waiting another 12 hours, but felt we would probably do a c-section then as well.  My husband and I discussed it and felt that we should go ahead and do a c-section.

We in no way felt manipulated.  I do not regret having that c-section even though I am a big advocate for giving birth vaginally whenever possible.  It was just right for me.  I wasn't much older than a missionary at that time.

So it is possible that it was manipulative, but given the circumstances with what is going on in the world it seems more likely to be informative than manipulative.  

The difference is your surgeon/obstetrician didn't say, "You can do a C-section or wait 12 hours, but I strongly recommend the C-section, and if you choose waiting, you will probably end up doing a C-section, anyway." :) 

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5 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I think they are letting the missionaries who are serving in Canada to stay in Canada, it's safer here! They released all the senior missionaries in this mission except for two couples

Crazy that they sent the couples home from Canada, too! I thought that was just foreign countries, not one of our territories . . . =@

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5 minutes ago, rongo said:

That explains it. Any health concerns at all were the "preemptive strikes." In my son's mission (Norway), they sent home missionaries with asthma or other health conditions, even if they had only been out for a short time. I think, given the circumstances, it's clear that preexisting conditions are going to be a front line disqualifier for the time being. As you and others have said, it's how they feel about it that really matters. 

It's amazing that she was called to Russia with an autoimmune disease on medication (prednisone or another steroid?).  

Diagnosed waiting to go into the mtc.  She has had a roller coaster the last year.  She is strong though.  

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2 minutes ago, rongo said:

Crazy that they sent the couples home from Canada, too! I thought that was just foreign countries, not one of our territories . . . =@

I love July the 4th, it's the day we in the British Commonwealth celebrate getting rid of all those pesky colonies😎 It makes me wonder why the Mission President and wife are still here as they are no more older then the couples but if they left it would be chaos! The two couple still here are with the Temple construction group, so they aren't technically connected to the mission and both are in isolation.

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4 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I love July the 4th, it's the day we in the British Commonwealth celebrate getting rid of all those pesky colonies😎 It makes me wonder why the Mission President and wife are still here as they are no more older then the couples but if they left it would be chaos! The two couple still here are with the Temple construction group, so they aren't technically connected to the mission and both are in isolation.

My wife ix-nayed "God Save the King" as one of the hymns for our family sacrament service on Sunday. The boys said, "We never sing this, they're getting rid of it in the new hymnbook, and we already know the tune." I need to pick my battles, so I didn't dig in on this one . . . :) 

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3 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Unlike with young men in the Church, full time missionary service has never been regarded as an obligation for young women. I should think any young woman who endeavors to render such service but finds that circumstances make it impossible for her to do so should consider that her very desire and attempt will be counted unto her for righteousness as though she had gone on to fulfill a full 18 months of service. She should move forward, confident that her Heavenly Father is pleased with her, and seek other ways to serve Him for the rest of her life. 

 

3 hours ago, Rain said:

This applies to the elders as well. 

True, but my intent here was to emphasize that full time missionary service is a priesthood duty for young men, one that young women do not have; hence they don’t have the same obligation as young men. 
 

President Monson explained it this way on the occasion of his announcing the change ages of eligibility for missionary service: 

“We affirm that missionary work is a priesthood duty—and we encourage all young men who are worthy and who are physically able and mentally capable to respond to the call to serve. Many young women also serve, but they are not under the same mandate to serve as are the young men. We assure the young sisters of the Church, however, that they make a valuable contribution as missionaries, and we welcome their service.” 

 

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3 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Unlike with young men in the Church, full time missionary service has never been regarded as an obligation for young women. I should think any young woman who endeavors to render such service but finds that circumstances make it impossible for her to do so should consider that her very desire and attempt will be counted unto her for righteousness as though she had gone on to fulfill a full 18 months of service. She should move forward, confident that her Heavenly Father is pleased with her, and seek other ways to serve Him for the rest of her life. 

I'm not sure why you didn't write the same thing about young men. Here's what it would sound like.

I should think any young man who endeavors to render such service but finds that circumstances make it impossible for him to do so should consider that his very desire and attempt will be counted unto him for righteousness as though he had gone on to fulfill a full 24 months of service. He should move forward, confident that his Heavenly Father is pleased with him and seek other ways to serve Him for the rest of his life.

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3 minutes ago, Thinking said:

I'm not sure why you didn't write the same thing about young men. Here's what it would sound like.

I should think any young man who endeavors to render such service but finds that circumstances make it impossible for him to do so should consider that his very desire and attempt will be counted unto him for righteousness as though he had gone on to fulfill a full 24 months of service. He should move forward, confident that his Heavenly Father is pleased with him and seek other ways to serve Him for the rest of his life.

I never said that didn’t apply to young men as well. But as I just explained to Rain, young men don’t have the same priesthood duty regarding missionary work as do young men, so they don’t have the same obligation (see my response post to her with the quote from President Monson). My intent was to underscore that fact. 

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9 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

they don’t have the same obligation (see my response post to her with the quote from President Monson). My intent was to underscore that fact. 

But that has nothing to do with not being able to serve when one has been called and either is doing it or anticipating going and then being sent home, which is what we are talking about.  Your comment would relate to whether someone was making a decision to go at all.

Edited by Calm
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1 hour ago, rongo said:

The difference is your surgeon/obstetrician didn't say, "You can do a C-section or wait 12 hours, but I strongly recommend the C-section, and if you choose waiting, you will probably end up doing a C-section, anyway." :) 

I must have miscommunicated in my post, because that is what he DID say.

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4 hours ago, rongo said:

My wife ix-nayed "God Save the King" as one of the hymns for our family sacrament service on Sunday. The boys said, "We never sing this, they're getting rid of it in the new hymnbook, and we already know the tune." I need to pick my battles, so I didn't dig in on this one . . . :) 

😊😊😊

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Ironically the US has the highest total number of confirmed cases now so it is not particularly safer here. I am not convinced the numbers are representative in any nation. Several nations are lying and no one (including the US) except maybe South Korea and Taiwan are testing enough to have a good handle on how many cases there are.

We are still behind several nations in per capita numbers of course but we are also behind them in seeing serious spread. The US is also only sixth in total deaths behind Italy, Spain, China, Iran, and France. New York City is the place to watch. They have over a quarter of the confirmed cases in the whole US there. Medical resources are not coping well. A nurse died and rightly or wrongly their death their colleagues are blaming the infection on lack of equipment. The next suspected big epicenter is anticipated to be in New Orleans. They are already seeing a spike and Mardi Gras is not known for being big on social distancing.

We passed 500k confirmed cases worldwide last night and at the current rate of increase will see 600k either Friday night or Saturday morning. Canada is getting confirmed cases in their northern territories. A little spooky. They lost whole villages to the Spanish flu up there a century ago. Some medical institutions considered sending expeditions to those sites hoping that investigating the sites might allow them to find Spanish flu so the strain behind that pandemic could be isolated with some degree of certainty.

Stay safe everyone.

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I will never understand a "being shafted" feeling.    Does the Lord or the church owe missionaries time in the field?   Of course it is a major upheaval.   But going where He wants us to go, being where He wants us to be, is fundamental to our eternities.   And when that includes something different from what we planned, trusting Him that we will manage the shift, and be fine, is what that mission would have helped you learn over time but now a missionary can learn it in a shorter time.

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I am grateful the Brethren recognized that the safest and best place for many of the young missionaries is at home for now.

The rest can be sorted out easily.

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The Lord is giving the brethren revelation on all matters concerning missionaries. That much is clear.

I don’t think anyone is being shafted. Remember the first presidency all grew up at a time where there were restrictions on missionary work and they did not go. Would you say they were shafted?

trust the Lord. Sometimes what is necessary for us is to show willingness to serve. 
 

I came home from my mission sick. I was released and sick for months still after that. If I had not returned when I did my major would not have been offered and I would not have been home to help a friend come into the Church.

seek the Spirit. Trust the Lord. Do the fast this Sunday for healing.

and prepare for conference 

 

 

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5 hours ago, rpn said:

I will never understand a "being shafted" feeling.    Does the Lord or the church owe missionaries time in the field? 

Good point. Your comment, and others' here, make me reflect on how I feel a sense of entitlement for missions. I don't think that's a bad thing, if it includes a real desire to serve a mission (and genuine disappointment when that is taken away), as opposed to simply feeling entitled to it as a rite of passage or social event. 

The "being shafted" part stems from the Church saying that X will happen with missionaries in Y and Z situations, but then not following through on that in some instances. I realize that things are moving rapidly with Corona responses, and I allow for good people doing the best that they can. It doesn't ease the blow when the axe happens to fall on you, though. 

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2 hours ago, rongo said:

Good point. Your comment, and others' here, make me reflect on how I feel a sense of entitlement for missions. I don't think that's a bad thing, if it includes a real desire to serve a mission (and genuine disappointment when that is taken away), as opposed to simply feeling entitled to it as a rite of passage or social event. 

The "being shafted" part stems from the Church saying that X will happen with missionaries in Y and Z situations, but then not following through on that in some instances. I realize that things are moving rapidly with Corona responses, and I allow for good people doing the best that they can. It doesn't ease the blow when the axe happens to fall on you, though. 

Yes. That axe happens to all if us at different points in our lives and we can learn so much from the experience, but we need to let people grieve when it happens because it IS hard. We should love them and mourn with them.

We also need to let them mourn so they can get past that to see the opportunities that come from having that experience and if we don't sincerely validate their grief, it may put up blocks on them seeing how the Lord is directing them.  

I've been very careful in what I say with those missionaries and their parents because I knew they needed to mourn.  I neglected to see that you, rongo, needed to mourn as well.  I'm sorry about that.  

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The missionaries in this Canadian mission are staying, so that's a relief to everyone. Mind you the all the senior missionaries left and that will leave a big hole to fill in the branches

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18 hours ago, rongo said:

I know that placing the swarms of foreign missionaries was always going to be a logistical nightmare, and some things had already been announced that would help, but not solve, the problem (e.g., early releases, etc.). But this really seems like some missionaries are being shafted and not even offered the stateside reassignments they were told would be available to them. Missions being extremely important for development to me, I feel heartbroken for the untold missionaries who are being shortchanged with this Corona debacle. All-around sad! :( 

I agree that it's sad but it makes good sense.  Most people aren't even accepting other family members into their homes while this Corona thing is going on, so missionaries trying to visit people in their homes would likely be turned away, as well.  

The only way it would work would be if missionaries wore masks and gloves while vising or trying to visit people, but most people would probably not be comfortable with that, even if the masks and gloves were very stylish and looked really nice.

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On the subject of missionaries coming home, the Church appears to have solved the problem with crowds at the airport.  We had one missionary from our stake coming home from South America and his family just got a call from him when he was already at the airport ready to be picked up.  Another family in our stake has a missionary in the same country and hasn't heard when they'll be home, so they're expecting to get a phone call out of the blue any day now!

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Our governor has issued a strict "stay at home, do not travel, except for food or medical purposes" mandate. Then I get this in an email from our ward.

I'm conflicted....but leaning toward "What are you thinking?"

What do you think?

Quote

Are you looking for something fun to do with your family?  We have had two of our sweet missionaries come home due to the Covid 19 virus.  Tomorrow Friday March 27th we would like for our ward to create a parade.  If you and your family can make some signs and hang them on the side of your vehicle.  We will go to see xxx's first.  Her street is not conducive to a parade so she will be at the xxx's home.  We will drive to their house at 5:00. Drive slowly by, yell your love out the window, wave, sing, be crazy.  Then we will drive over to xxx's house.  Then again, drive by slowly, yell your love out the window, wave, sing, be crazy.  This will make them feel loved, as they have to be in their houses and can't have people come by to welcome them home.  If you have any questions call xxxx or xxx.  Hope to see you there.
 

 

Edited by Bernard Gui
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In the meantime, our son Talentissimo and his friend are homeless, living in a van in the Arizona desert. As all the tourists are being shut out of the national and state parks move into more remote areas like where they are, it's put them in the position of having no where to go and being afraid of being rounded up by LE and put into a homeless quarantine. They have some resources of their own and had chose to live a year out on the road, earning money through odd jobs and musical busking as they went. Now that everything is being shut down, they are pretty much stranded. 

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2 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

In the meantime, our son Talentissimo and his friend are homeless, living in a van in the Arizona desert. As all the tourists are being shut out of the national and state parks move into more remote areas like where they are, it's put them in the position of having no where to go and being afraid of being rounded up by LE and put into a homeless quarantine. They have some resources of their own and had chose to live a year out on the road, earning money through odd jobs and musical busking as they went. Now that everything is being shut down, they are pretty much stranded. 

Campgrounds maybe? Surely they won't round them up, hope not! I watched a bunch of episodes on YouTube awhile back on living in vans and traveling. Looked like a lot of fun! 

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4 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

What do you think?

If I were one of those missionaries, I'd want everyone to go away and shut up. Of course, I'm the sort of person who reads the handbook and knows that we're discouraged from big to-dos in relation to departing and returning missionaries in even normal circumstances ...

But seriously, who wants that crap (wave, sing, be crazy)? This is decidedly not how one makes me feel loved.

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4 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

Our governor has issued a strict "stay at home, do not travel, except for food or medical purposes" mandate. Then I get this in an email from our ward.

I'm conflicted....but leaning toward "What are you thinking?"

What do you think?

 

My previous neighborhood has a FB group and this is nearly every day that my neighborhood is doing this for returning missionaries:

 

*** #### HAS LEFT THE AIRPORT!***

We have just found out that ELDER ****** will be returning home TODAY from serving in Mexico Oaxaca Mission! His flight lands at 4:50. I will update with when & where to line up & make some noise to welcome ***** home! Please spread the word since not everyone is on Facebook.

****** said they would be happy to drive down *** Drive so lets line *** East-*** Drive (again in vehicles for social distancing, or step out on your porch lets say for now about 5:45.
I will update in the comments if times change.

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