Jump to content
Seriously No Politics ×

Home Church


Recommended Posts

11 minutes ago, PacMan said:

I can confirm that Area instructions sent to our stake president was not to turn a home sacrament service into a mini-sacrament meeting (I have the actual text). This also includes a prohibition on meeting together with friends for the service. Only families.

I don’t know why, but the the more I think about it it the more it makes sense. Mini-sacrament meetings lead to mini-wards, which lead to all sorts of problems.

Our bishop has authorized families in the ward to hold sacrament services at home until ward sacrament meetings resume, provided there is at least a priest with a current and valid temple recommend to administer the sacrament. Seems to be working okay. 

Any chance you could message me the relevant portion of the text?  

Link to comment
17 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

Our bishop said "it is not necessary to take the sacrament more than once per month" so he will be allowing the sacrament once per month. Each and every instance (every household each time) has to be approved in advance.

For those without a priesthood holder in the home they will arrange for someone to come to the home. Only 1 person is needed. The non-priesthood holder will prepare their own water and bread and receive it themselves after the priesthood holder has blessed it through a screen door or window.

Seriously. This is craziness. It extremely controlling to require approval for each family in each instance instead of giving a blanket approval. I have yet to determine the benefit of denying someone the opportunity to receive the sacrament weekly if they are able. Would anyone like to try to explain that one? ;) 

Also, blessing the sacrament through the door is interesting and raises some questions. If the sacrament can be blessed through a door or window, why not over the phone, or over skype?

Weird. I didn’t realize a non priesthood holder could prepare the sacrament (break the bread, etc).  Also, doesn’t the person blessing it have to kneel during the prayer?

Link to comment

I think part of the thinking for leaders who don't want families to bless the sacrament is that they want the ministering brothers to do this for their families. That's the case in my wife's sister's stake --- they specifically want each family to have to get it from their ministering brothers (and, in many cases, to force contact with them, often for the first time). This saddened my SIL, because her husband, a convert, was excited about doing it as a family. 

Link to comment
20 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

Our bishop said "it is not necessary to take the sacrament more than once per month" so he will be allowing the sacrament once per month. Each and every instance (every household each time) has to be approved in advance.

For those without a priesthood holder in the home they will arrange for someone to come to the home. Only 1 person is needed. The non-priesthood holder will prepare their own water and bread and receive it themselves after the priesthood holder has blessed it through a screen door or window.

Seriously. This is craziness. It extremely controlling to require approval for each family in each instance instead of giving a blanket approval. I have yet to determine the benefit of denying someone the opportunity to receive the sacrament weekly if they are able. Would anyone like to try to explain that one? ;) 

Also, blessing the sacrament through the door is interesting and raises some questions. If the sacrament can be blessed through a door or window, why not over the phone, or over skype?

There is an extreme controlling aspect of Mormonism that rears its ugly head at times like these. Sheesh! I'm glad our leaders just gave blanket approval and left it at that. This is going to be a fond family memory for us. 

If we only have to take it monthly, then why don't we? Because we are supposed to do it "oft," per Jesus. I'm glad my leaders are encouraging (or at least, not discouraging) families to do it as they see fit. 

Link to comment
2 minutes ago, rongo said:

I think part of the thinking for leaders who don't want families to bless the sacrament is that they want the ministering brothers to do this for their families. That's the case in my wife's sister's stake --- they specifically want each family to have to get it from their ministering brothers (and, in many cases, to force contact with them, often for the first time). This saddened my SIL, because her husband, a convert, was excited about doing it as a family. 

That sounds good in theory but not every ministering brother will be worthy to do it, will they?  

 

Link to comment
3 minutes ago, bluebell said:

That sounds good in theory but not every ministering brother will be worthy to do it, will they?  

 

Presumably, the EQP/bishopric will account for that, but what a logistical nightmare, requiring that this be in every case and not case by case. 

We were going to take the sacrament to a 94 year-old widow we home teach, but she had already been invited to do home church with another elderly couple. That's also okay (but, apparently, not in some jurisdictions). 

ETA: Plus, what about where there are duds who won't even do their sacrament duties for their families. This will also happen. Can families not do it themselves then, in these areas (or make their own arrangements)?

Edited by rongo
Link to comment
1 minute ago, rongo said:

There is an extreme controlling aspect of Mormonism that rears its ugly head at times like these. Sheesh! I'm glad our leaders just gave blanket approval and left it at that. This is going to be a fond family memory for us. 

If we only have to take it monthly, then why don't we? Because we are supposed to do it "oft," per Jesus. I'm glad my leaders are encouraging (or at least, not discouraging) families to do it as they see fit. 

Right.

Is this "once a month sacrament" a new doctrine? I don't think so :) 

5 minutes ago, bluebell said:

Weird. I didn’t realize a non priesthood holder could prepare the sacrament (break the bread, etc).  Also, doesn’t the person blessing it have to kneel during the prayer?

No one needs to kneel. It's just a traditional thing. The prepping and passing of the sacrament, though traditionally done as a priesthood duty isn't one of the listed priesthood duties in the D&C. It's just the way its been done. Historically women and girls have helped prepare and pass the sacrament.

Link to comment
1 minute ago, HappyJackWagon said:

Right.

Is this "once a month sacrament" a new doctrine? I don't think so :) 

No one needs to kneel. It's just a traditional thing. The prepping and passing of the sacrament, though traditionally done as a priesthood duty isn't one of the listed priesthood duties in the D&C. It's just the way its been done. Historically women and girls have helped prepare and pass the sacrament.

The apostles sometimes end up doing monthly. I sin enough that I need it more often.

A lot of the sacrament practices we have are done to focus on the ordinance. The instructions on how to do it are in D&C 20. I am not opposed to kneeling or how the deacons pass it or even that everyone should be silent. It is all done to focus attention where it belongs (words of the ordinance and give time to reflect). In a family environment it may adapt some.

And yes, there have been cases of Young Women passing the sacrament. The duty of the Deacons to pass and Teachers to prepare are, in essence, assignments attached to Priesthood responsibility but are not explicitly and exclusively Priesthood duties. We have them do it because the leaders who hold the Priesthood keys have asked them to do it.

Link to comment
16 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

No one needs to kneel. It's just a traditional thing.

The kneeling is actually scriptural and required by the General Handbook - 

Quote

And the elder or priest shall administer it; and after this manner shall he administer it—he shall kneel with the church and call upon the Father in solemn prayer, saying:

(D&C 20:76)

Quote

...the person blessing the bread kneels and says the sacrament prayer for the bread... 

(General Handbook, 18.9.4) 

It used to be that the whole church would kneel for the sacrament prayer in the 19th century, but as congregations grew in number the prophets altered the outward ordinance to where only the person blessing the sacrament needed to kneel. 

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1978/03/i-have-a-question/has-it-ever-been-the-practice-for-the-whole-congregation-to-kneel-during-the-sacrament?lang=eng

Link to comment
25 minutes ago, pogi said:

The kneeling is actually scriptural and required by the General Handbook - 

It used to be that the whole church would kneel for the sacrament prayer in the 19th century, but as congregations grew in number the prophets altered the outward ordinance to where only the person blessing the sacrament needed to kneel. 

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1978/03/i-have-a-question/has-it-ever-been-the-practice-for-the-whole-congregation-to-kneel-during-the-sacrament?lang=eng

They used to raise their hands up. But I don't think hat was ever specified anywhere. 

1112556777_ldschangedsacrament.jpg.e17de6b625624af514a4eef127bbfad9.jpg

Link to comment
40 minutes ago, pogi said:

The kneeling is actually scriptural and required by the General Handbook - 

It used to be that the whole church would kneel for the sacrament prayer in the 19th century, but as congregations grew in number the prophets altered the outward ordinance to where only the person blessing the sacrament needed to kneel. 

https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/1978/03/i-have-a-question/has-it-ever-been-the-practice-for-the-whole-congregation-to-kneel-during-the-sacrament?lang=eng

Uh oh. I'd better tell my bishop and stake president.

Link to comment
20 minutes ago, JAHS said:

They used to raise their hands up. But I don't think hat was ever specified anywhere. 

1112556777_ldschangedsacrament.jpg.e17de6b625624af514a4eef127bbfad9.jpg

That's interesting.  I can't tell if he is also kneeling or not. 

Where is that article from.  I found the commentary "However, it should still be used today" rather presumptuous.  Based on what? 

Link to comment
17 minutes ago, pogi said:

That's interesting.  I can't tell if he is also kneeling or not. 

Where is that article from.  I found the commentary "However, it should still be used today" rather presumptuous.  Based on what? 

http://barerecord.blogspot.com/2015/10/340-changing-ordinance-removing-symbols.html

https://www.reddit.com/r/exmormon/comments/5dog7k/another_from_the_archive_sometimes_we_forget_how/

Here's where I saw it. The comment about how it should be done today I think was just a personal opinion. 

Edited by JAHS
Link to comment
On 3/16/2020 at 10:31 AM, bluebell said:

What guidances has everyone gotten about  how to handle Sundays at home?

Our bishop gave all families permission to do the sacrament in their homes, provided someone has authority to do so. He also made provisions for those without a priesthood holder present.  And he gave guidelines for how to do the sacrament correctly. 

Then in closing he wrote:  “All ward members should be advised that the stake president passed along instruction from Elder Peterson (area authority seventy) that replication of a sacrament meeting (talks, prayers, hymns, etc.) is not required or appropriate.  We are strongly encouraged to focus on the ordinance of the sacrament.   The ordinance of the sacrament should take place separately from our Sunday study.  (Example: Sacrament ordinance, then song, prayer, study of Come Follow Me, song, prayer.)“

My friend lives in the same town but in a different stake and her stake president basically told her that it was a good opportunity for families to do their own sacrament meeting stuff, including talks, etc. 

We thought it was odd that our stake presidents have each of us conflicting counsel.

Any one get counsel on having sacrament-type meetings or hear from the area 70 on it? 

Did not the First Presidency, do so? If not, I guess I should contact our Bishop. Currently he and many in our extended family went on a cruise, so I don’t know when we will hear from him. When they all decided to go on the cruise, things has not turned so grave, so I hope they don’t get stranded.  

Link to comment
2 hours ago, PacMan said:

priest with a current and valid temple recommend to administer the sacrament.

I think this might miss out on an opportunity for a priest to learn the importance of his priesthood.  Not saying encouragement of nonworthiness, but if he had made the effort in the past week to abide by baptismal covenants...I wish that might be enough. 

Edited by Calm
Link to comment
53 minutes ago, Calm said:

I think this might miss out on an opportunity for a priest to learn the importance of his priesthood.  Not saying encouragement of nonworthiness, but if he had made the effort in the past week to abide by baptismal covenants...I wish that might be enough. 

Not to mention that having a current temple recommend is not a requirement of blessing it.

Link to comment

My Bishop was all set to require two priesthood holders to bless the sacrament, since this is the preference normally.  Ministering brothers would have been needed for at least 2/3 of our families.  Fortunately for the sanity of my EQP dh, the Bishop changed his mind to authorizing family priesthood holders.  Those without are to be offered the sacrament weekly, with the hope that everyone will receive it at least once per month.

I have a couple friends (different stakes from each other) whose stake presidents initially would not authorize home Sacrament.  They both received word Sunday afternoon or evening that they were authorized after all.

My two oldest attend a YSA ward.  Son, who is in charge of organizing the Sacrament, talked to his Bishop last night.  The plan is to divide up whoever comes to the building on Sunday into 12 different rooms.  Each room will be given the Sacrament separately.  

 

Link to comment
5 minutes ago, Traela said:

My Bishop was all set to require two priesthood holders to bless the sacrament, since this is the preference normally.

One boy/man can bless the sacrament. And, one man can anoint and seal the anointing. Two is preferable, but if there's only one, that's fine. 

I've given many solo blessings when there were no other men available. Two, where possible, is best, but not always possible. 

ETA: I think this current situation is an opportunity to strengthen reliance and reverence for the Patriarchal Order of the priesthood. Some leaders are focusing on strengthening bonds within the ministering system, but for those whose leaders allow, I think there will be great blessings as far as family bonds. 

Edited by rongo
Link to comment

We just had the missionaries over for dinner, and they told us that within our own stake, there are different protocols for different wards, based on the bishops' recommendations. That warmed my heart! I feel that the sacrament should be up to the bishops (as an Aaronic priesthood ordinance). So, our ward was left up to the households, with home teachers looking out for their families without priesthood. Our neighboring ward, whom we share a building with, did not authorize the sacrament this last week. 

Link to comment
23 hours ago, bluebell said:

My sons’ seminary classes are going completely online and video conferencing during the closure. Should be interesting. 

This might become the new normal. Schools/colleges might find out that they can teach effectively online and it could become a standard option.

Link to comment
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...