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Bring ye all the ​​​tithes​ into the storehouse


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1 hour ago, Anonymous Mormon said:

I always understood that money from tithing went to further the Church's mission of saving souls. Specifically, this was done through temples, churches, scriptures, missionary efforts, etc. Separate from this is fast offerings and humanitarian. If I understand it correctly, that is what is taught and practiced by the leaders.

I wonder if that is why this $100B surplus exists, because the money is only ear-marked for things related to building the kingdom and the need hasn't been there as much, so they have put excess away as savings?

If the church started to give a percentage of its tithing money to other causes (humanitarian, etc.), what is the correct amount? When does it distract from the primary objective of the church in bringing saving ordinances to the world? Any non-profit can feed, shelter, and clothe, the needy and I donate time and money to other non-profits to accomplish this. But I give to the church specifically because I want to further the Lord's work of getting others His covenants.

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“We take seriously the responsibility to care for the tithes and donations received from members. The vast majority of these funds are used immediately to meet the needs of the growing church including more meetinghouses, temples, education, humanitarian work and missionary efforts throughout the world. Over many years, a portion is methodically safeguarded through wise financial management and the building of a prudent reserve for the future. This is a sound doctrinal and financial principle taught by the Savior in the Parable of the Talents and lived by the church and its members. All church funds exist for no other reason than to support the church’s divinely appointed mission.

The Church's mission is 4 fold and includes "caring for the poor and needy".  

The 100 billion is a modest reserve (in scale of our church) for the future.  There may come a time when more of it is used for humanitarian needs.

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15 hours ago, Benjamin Seeker said:

In light of the recent discussion on tithing and it being the holiday season, I wanted to start a discussion on what reasonable minds would put on their tithing-related Christmas wish-list.

Here is what’s on mine: 

I would love to experience more beautiful places to worship. Our chapels are generally uninspiring imho, partly due to economizing.

Custodians! ; ) Actually, I don’t mind cleaning the chapel at all. I find it’s meaningful service.

This is a correct use of tithing.

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I would like to see more local humanitarian aid. For example, how cool would it be if certain chapels ran a soup kitchen or something like that? Lots of poor non-Mormon and Mormon hungry souls could be helped. 

This is not what tithing is designated for.  Fast offerings are to help the poor and needy.

If we want the Church to help the poor more we need to fast more often and give fast offerings.

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12 minutes ago, Attalus said:

I wonder if we'll ever advance to the point of being able to watch and participate from home, or from anywhere we can get the signals on our phones or tablets.

Back in the 1980s, BYUtv actually had a ward that it broadcast.  It was a camera set up in a regular looking chapel, and you could see the Bishop get up and conduct the program, with random ward members speaking each week.  I suspect it was for people who were unable to get to Church but still wanted the "Sacrament meeting" experience each week (with the Sacrament being provided by the local ward, of course).

Sadly, none of these have been preserved on YouTube, but apparently one ward recently did something similar...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YV8UtUAw04A
 

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32 minutes ago, Attalus said:

I wonder if we'll ever advance to the point of being able to watch and participate from home, or from anywhere we can get the signals on our phones or tablets.  Something like Skype for large audiences, with several cameras in different positions so that we can see the entire chapel and even into the foyers.  For Fast & Testimony meetings whoever wants to talk next would just start talking on our end and everyone else would be able to see it when they are tuned in.  And for Sacrament meeting the priests could bless whatever bread and water we had in our own homes and then pass it to each other at home.  That way we would be able to be as comfortable as we are in our own homes while attending or participating in our Church meetings, seeing whoever is tuned in to the meetings, without having to go anywhere.

I hope we never get to the point where we don't meet together.  There is something special about actually talking to people face to face.

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19 minutes ago, cinepro said:

Back in the 1980s, BYUtv actually had a ward that it broadcast.  It was a camera set up in a regular looking chapel, and you could see the Bishop get up and conduct the program, with random ward members speaking each week.  I suspect it was for people who were unable to get to Church but still wanted the "Sacrament meeting" experience each week (with the Sacrament being provided by the local ward, of course).

Sadly, none of these have been preserved on YouTube, but apparently one ward recently did something similar...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YV8UtUAw04A
 

They still play them on the BYU channel every Sunday.  The fashion did not hold up well.

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7 minutes ago, cinepro said:

Back in the 1980s, BYUtv actually had a ward that it broadcast.  It was a camera set up in a regular looking chapel, and you could see the Bishop get up and conduct the program, with random ward members speaking each week.  I suspect it was for people who were unable to get to Church but still wanted the "Sacrament meeting" experience each week (with the Sacrament being provided by the local ward, of course).

Sadly, none of these have been preserved on YouTube, but apparently one ward recently did something similar...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YV8UtUAw04A
 

Byu-Tv has been carrying a program titled "Worship Service" on Sunday mornings for some time now... the portion of the speakers, not the sacrament...  And I remember the crying rooms... great idea.

Somehow the $100B does not bother me in the least... I have an acct that I use to save for a "rainy day" or emergencies, etc... After tithing, and paying current bills/expenses, I allot as much as possible to build the emergency fund... It's only prudent and keeps me out of trouble, like when I need new brakes or tires... the brakes were $300+ and tires over $650.  But because I had planned ahead and put money away in a separate fund I simply wrote out the checks without skipping a beat.   don't others do the same thing?  

GG

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3 hours ago, bluebell said:
3 hours ago, cinepro said:

Back in the 1980s, BYUtv actually had a ward that it broadcast.  It was a camera set up in a regular looking chapel, and you could see the Bishop get up and conduct the program, with random ward members speaking each week.  I suspect it was for people who were unable to get to Church but still wanted the "Sacrament meeting" experience each week (with the Sacrament being provided by the local ward, of course).

Sadly, none of these have been preserved on YouTube, but apparently one ward recently did something similar...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YV8UtUAw04A
 

They still play them on the BYU channel every Sunday.  The fashion did not hold up well.

Right they are called Worship Service and come on just before Music and the Spoken Word on Sunday mornings.
This is back when the ladies all made their own dresses with the big Bibs on the front

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4 hours ago, Attalus said:

I wonder if we'll ever advance to the point of being able to watch and participate from home, or from anywhere we can get the signals on our phones or tablets.  Something like Skype for large audiences, with several cameras in different positions so that we can see the entire chapel and even into the foyers.  For Fast & Testimony meetings whoever wants to talk next would just start talking on our end and everyone else would be able to see it when they are tuned in.  And for Sacrament meeting the priests could bless whatever bread and water we had in our own homes and then pass it to each other at home.  That way we would be able to be as comfortable as we are in our own homes while attending or participating in our Church meetings, seeing whoever is tuned in to the meetings, without having to go anywhere.

Too much loss of community with that, imo.  There is something in humans that needs face to face interaction.  There are benefits to online interaction...I have conversations here with so many more people than I was ever able to find before, but having both types of community...as well as a few more ideally imo...is essential.

For those who have health issues, travel difficulties, or risk persecution with government or gangs, online meetings could be a great blessing though.  I know there are groups in Europe who use it for Young Women's.  I assume YM as well, but was told about daughters.  Probably happens elsewhere.  Ideal for seminary in some ways.

Edited by Calm
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13 hours ago, rpn said:

Most church members do not know how close to bankruptcy the church was within the recent past.   I, for one, want our leaders to be fully listening to their inspiration and doing exactly what they are inspired to do with anything members donate.  (And I think the paid building cleaning generated a rich/poor (the type of job if not financially) feeling in many church buildings.  It made taking care of the building a them issue, instead of an us problem.)

And the Worldwide Pathway program does provide low cost education around the world to members.

As far as the day inspiration piece goes, not to sound like a jerk, but it’s not necessarily inspiration that makes the financial clock tick. For example, JS was a very inspired prophet, yet from what I understand, he sucked at the financial piece. Also, if we can chock the current financial success the church is having today to inspiration, what in the world was happening for the first 150 years?

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11 hours ago, Bill “Papa” Lee said:

Our Church buildings are not built with the abilities to support “soup kitchens”, even though we have “kitchens” in our buildings, they are not meant to be used for cooking meals, only for heating, and supporting limited functions for feeding members, and then only on special occasions. We also do not have have dinning facilities by the same nature, nor full time staff to support such functions. The Church does however,  certainly has the money and means to create such facilities, but we do feed 10,000’s of families weekly through our Bishop Storehouses, throughout the world. Here in the Atlanta area, we fill 1,000’s of meal orders at many different Chapels, so that all are not required to drive to the Bishop’s Storehouses. Many volunteer to pick up these orders and then transport them weekly to designated buildings, or also pick them up and deliver them to those who cannot do so for themselves. I know first hand, as I did for so many years, and friends who are now retired, who fill these orders, drive them via commercial trucks to these many designated chapels, every single week. We do this for both members and non-members, we also deliver many goods to other charities who feed the poor, again weekly. 

I think the Bishop’s store house is great. It is however a bit insular.

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10 hours ago, ksfisher said:

Where do you live.  In Salt Lake City the church actually supports almost all of soup kitchens/emergency food pantries in the downtown area.

Running a soup kitchen is actually a huge undertaking, lots of health regulations and code.  Even just handing out food it a full time job.  Many local churches here have done something similar, only to find out that the time needed by congregation members is too much.  Others do very well over a long time though.

Donate more to the fast offering and humanitarian aid fund.  Simple solution.

I’m thinking of something less insular than fast offerings and more local and hands on than a donation to the humanitarian fund. 

10 hours ago, ksfisher said:

Agreed.  I think this helps the members of the ward take ownership for the building as well as providing opportunities to serve.

👍

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6 hours ago, JLHPROF said:

This is a correct use of tithing.

This is not what tithing is designated for.  Fast offerings are to help the poor and needy.

If we want the Church to help the poor more we need to fast more often and give fast offerings.

Tithing in the Book of Mormon and Bible and early sections of the D&C is principally focused towards caring for the poor and needy. It was a later development that put building as the focus of tithing. I’m not sure what policy or revelation put fast offerings as the primary driver of helping the needy. Anyhow, doctrinally speaking, it’s very easy to make the case that the original conception of tithing was to take care of the poor, and it was expanded on from there.

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2 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said:

So I clicked on this thread expecting to find a celebration of the principle of tithe paying. Instead I find a whimsical exercise in make-believe ark steadying. 
 

As I’m sure you well know, many of the church programs and services that we enjoy today we’re started on a local level. A thread of interesting or new ideas about tithing doesn’t have to be seen as ark steadying. It can be seen as a good exercise in inspiration. Have an idea of your own instead of pissing on the parade.

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19 minutes ago, Benjamin Seeker said:

Tithing in the Book of Mormon and Bible and early sections of the D&C is principally focused towards caring for the poor and needy. It was a later development that put building as the focus of tithing. I’m not sure what policy or revelation put fast offerings as the primary driver of helping the needy. Anyhow, doctrinally speaking, it’s very easy to make the case that the original conception of tithing was to take care of the poor, and it was expanded on from there.

By funding the infrastructure of the Church, tithing does help the needy in the sense that, in untold ways, the Church is the instrument by which their needs are met. 

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35 minutes ago, Benjamin Seeker said:

 I’m not sure what policy or revelation put fast offerings as the primary driver of helping the needy. 

Isaiah 58

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11 hours ago, Calm said:

Oh that brings to mind a favorite longtime wish...invest money in more comfortable pews and chairs.  Easier to be inspired when not in pain.

This! We need more couches in the foyer for all the people who cannot abide the pews!

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12 hours ago, bluebell said:

I'd rather the church continue to support those soup kitchens that are already up and running.  That would be the best use of funds.  Where that doesn't exist though, that could be an idea.  But I agree with beautifying chapels.  I know they are unadorned so that nothing replaces our focus on the Savior but come on!  They are often so uninspiring.  Even the lighting.  

and the couches!!!!!!!!!!!! blech. I know of two Stakes that built their own chapels, with no knowledge from SLC, they just pooled their own money and built it themselves

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We have a Bishop's Storehouse, every two weeks. Our Bishop said that there was a rumour it may get shut down due to some orders are enormous, as in one family in our ward get $1400 a month in food and stuff, which is exorbitant. One family in another ward was getting something similar and turned out was selling what they didn't need, so free food and turn a profit. So, they got shut down PDQ

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15 minutes ago, Duncan said:

We have a Bishop's Storehouse, every two weeks. Our Bishop said that there was a rumour it may get shut down due to some orders are enormous, as in one family in our ward get $1400 a month in food and stuff, which is exorbitant. One family in another ward was getting something similar and turned out was selling what they didn't need, so free food and turn a profit. So, they got shut down PDQ

Someone earlier complained here about bishops and RS presidents going over recipients’ resources. This is one good reason why that is done.

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1 hour ago, Duncan said:

We have a Bishop's Storehouse, every two weeks. Our Bishop said that there was a rumour it may get shut down due to some orders are enormous, as in one family in our ward get $1400 a month in food and stuff, which is exorbitant. One family in another ward was getting something similar and turned out was selling what they didn't need, so free food and turn a profit. So, they got shut down PDQ

You need to write a book about these stories, lol! 😉

Edited by Tacenda
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1 hour ago, Duncan said:

We have a Bishop's Storehouse, every two weeks. Our Bishop said that there was a rumour it may get shut down due to some orders are enormous, as in one family in our ward get $1400 a month in food and stuff, which is exorbitant. One family in another ward was getting something similar and turned out was selling what they didn't need, so free food and turn a profit. So, they got shut down PDQ

We had a guy that was trading the food for drugs, money, and cigarettes. Unfortunately for him, his apartment building manager was the executive secretary in the ward and learned of it pretty quickly. That was his last order of food from the storehouse.

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3 hours ago, rchorse said:

We had a guy that was trading the food for drugs, money, and cigarettes. Unfortunately for him, his apartment building manager was the executive secretary in the ward and learned of it pretty quickly. That was his last order of food from the storehouse.

eek!

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8 hours ago, rchorse said:

We had a guy that was trading the food for drugs, money, and cigarettes. Unfortunately for him, his apartment building manager was the executive secretary in the ward and learned of it pretty quickly. That was his last order of food from the storehouse.

I hope he comes to himself and gets out of addiction.

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