Lesbian Couple Divorce to Join the Church

[Darren10]

Here's a story of Courtney and Rachelle. Courtney grew up in the LDS Church and "did everything [she] was supposed to". During her enrollement at BYU, she met Rachelle. Courtney moved to Oregon to be with Rachelle and they got married. Courtney said her soul was torm into pieces as she was gau but knew the Church was true. Courtney found lots of happiness with Rachelle and at a picture session, Courtney's father apologized for previously, by his choice, not ever meeting Rachelle; and that began a healing process. The LDS missionaries showed up to Courtney and Rachelle's door. They both agreed to listen to their message and after feeling the peace brought into their home by the missionaries and by reading the Book of mormon and knowing it was true, Rachelle agreed to join the church they both filed ofr divorce in order for Rachelle to be baptized. 

I think this is a miraculous story. It shows how through the love of Christ anyone can change. It also shows how the most effective way to bring the love of Christ into the lives of ithers is through charitbable service. Not preaching, not condemnation. Though those do have a place in the gospel, it is through personable loving service that Christ's love is most likely felt by others. Jesus knows His own and does not forget them.

http://www.ldsliving.com/Watch-A-Lesbian-Couple-Shares-Why-They-Divorced-to-Join-the-Church-in-Powerful-Video/s/86166?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=social_button

[pogi]

Wow, that is a powerful story which triggers so many different emotions.  I feel so incredibly happy and sad for them all at once.  I rejoice in the light that they have embraced and the love of the Savior which is apparent in their countenance, but I sorrow at the incredible loss that they must feel, and the unique challenges that face them ahead.  It would be interesting to see a re-interview of them in 10-20 years.  After the spiritual high of working with the missionaries wears off, and after the fellow-shipping slows down, and the loneliness starts to creep in, will they regret their decision?  At that time, they are going to be staring into the face of a fiery furnace that will either purify them or burn them terribly.  I pray for them and hope that they will have sustained fellowship through those difficult days ahead.     

Edited August 23, 2017 by pogi

[USU78]

Things are inborn:  until the Master Himself makes a mud plaster for the man born blind.

Things are immutable:  until the Master Himself heals hearts and either removes thorns, or grants strength to live with thorns.

[thesometimesaint]

The track record of praying away the Gay is not good.

[cdowis]

2 minutes ago, thesometimesaint said:

The track record of praying away the Gay is not good.

It is not a matter of "praying it away".  Each of us may have a trial that does not simply get prayed away.  2 Cor 12:7

[ALarson]

2 hours ago, Darren10 said:

Here's a story of Courtney and Rachelle. Courtney grew up in the LDS Church and "did everything [she] was supposed to". During her enrollement at BYU, she met Rachelle. Courtney moved to Oregon to be with Rachelle and they got married. Courtney said her soul was torm into pieces as she was gau but knew the Church was true. Courtney found lots of happiness with Rachelle and at a picture session, Courtney's father apologized for previously, by his choice, not ever meeting Rachelle; and that began a healing process. The LDS missionaries showed up to Courtney and Rachelle's door. They both agreed to listen to their message and after feeling the peace brought into their home by the missionaries and by reading the Book of mormon and knowing it was true, Rachelle agreed to join the church they both filed ofr divorce in order for Rachelle to be baptized. 

I think this is a miraculous story. It shows how through the love of Christ anyone can change. It also shows how the most effective way to bring the love of Christ into the lives of ithers is through charitbable service. Not preaching, not condemnation. Though those do have a place in the gospel, it is through personable loving service that Christ's love is most likely felt by others. Jesus knows His own and does not forget them.

http://www.ldsliving.com/Watch-A-Lesbian-Couple-Shares-Why-They-Divorced-to-Join-the-Church-in-Powerful-Video/s/86166?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=Social&utm_campaign=social_button

I'm happy for them if this is what they want and what they believe is right for their lives.  It will be interesting to follow their story to see where they are in 5, 10, 20 years from now.  But I only wish them the best.  I do think it's a sad statement that someone needs to get a divorce to join the church.  Just my feelings and opinion.

Are they still living together (as roommates)?  Does anyone know?  (I have not listened to the video, but have just read their story and some comments).

[Kenngo1969]

18 minutes ago, thesometimesaint said:

The track record of praying away the Gay is not good.

Red herring and non sequitur.

[poptart]

I wonder if there was another motivating factor behind this, there goes the financial benefits they might have enjoyed under their marriage.  I know for me besides no one being willing to talk about Joseph Smiths Masonic ties the ban on gay relationships was the main deal breaker.  Knowing what I would have to give up for something that offered little return on investment was a huge turnoff.  Most people my age have either made horrible choices or were just screwed, everyone I ever knew who married in the states is now divorced, many now messed up mentally.  Not saying gay couples are perfect but geez when I look at whats out there limiting myself to just heterosexual relations is simply not going to happen.  That and being told the benefits of obeying the rules by middle/upper middle class people who have not had to suffer like I have was a bit insulting, give me the wealth and success they have as well as the stable family and good contacts and I'd consider it.

Hope the best for this couple, the missionaries i've known were very nice people, the congregations were very much hit or miss. 

Edited August 23, 2017 by poptart

[Daniel2]

Their story reminds me of the story of Elder Christofferson's brother, Tom.  Like him, they don't seem to imply their sexual orientation changed--rather, they chose to prioritize their religious identity over their relational identity ("the only thing that matters is our relationship with our Heavenly Father---nothing else matters"). 

I imagine that the emotional and spiritual response I feel as I listen to these two women's story is similar to the emotional and spiritual response that devout Latter-day Saints may feel when they hear a loved one leaves their family and Faith to pursue a relationship and marriage with someone of the same gender.  Hearing their story concerns me that other devout members of the LDS church close to gay family members will continue to hold out hope that more of us can and should follow their examples, rather than accept and respect those who chose a different path.   But while their choice saddens me, I fully support and respect their agency to choose how to conduct their lives and to share their stories.

At this stage of my life, I can't imagine living without the fulfillment of the loving relationship my husband and I share, and I, too, believe I have been blessed because of our relationship and have the opportunity to be a force for good in our extended family's and friends' lives.  May these young women continue to likewise find fulfillment, peace, and love on their journey.  It sounds like they both will have the tremendous opportunities and ability to lift, love, and bless others.

I wish them all the best.

D

[thesometimesaint]

40 minutes ago, cdowis said:

It is not a matter of "praying it away".  Each of us may have a trial that does not simply get prayed away.  2 Cor 12:7

Are they still Gay or not? 

[Bob Crockett]

45 minutes ago, thesometimesaint said:

The track record of praying away the Gay is not good.

I doubt your statement.   When I was a bishop I could see that for about half of the homosexuals who were Latter-day Saints, your statement is untrue.  I know a former bishop who has made a success out of following Jesus and putting aside his temptations.  As well as many other people.  The "half" rate in my experience corresponds with the inactivity rate in the church.

[Darren10]

1 hour ago, pogi said:

Wow, that is a powerful story which triggers so many different emotions.  I feel so incredibly happy and sad for them all at once.  I rejoice in the light that they have embraced and the love of the Savior which is apparent in their countenance, but I sorrow at the incredible loss that they must feel, and the unique challenges that face them ahead.  It would be interesting to see a re-interview of them in 10-20 years.  After the spiritual high of working with the missionaries wears off, and after the fellow-shipping slows down, and the loneliness starts to creep in, will they regret their decision?  At that time, they are going to be staring into the face of a fiery furnace that will either purify them or burn them terribly.  I pray for them and hope that they will have sustained fellowship through those difficult days ahead.     

I would very much like to see their status in the future. They made a great decidion now and precisely for the correct reasons. They will (and am convinced they have been already) greatly blessed for their decision. There will be struggles ahead. We all have them but theirs I think is powerful. They have to point blank forget who they are and strive to become something new. In and of itself we all have to do thst but to put off their own sexual and emotional attraction and allow the Lord to fill in that void with something new I imagine will be immensely challenging. They are devinitely in my thoughts and prayers and they most devinitely seem like very fine individuals regardless of what they choose in the future on this matter. 

[Darren10]

57 minutes ago, thesometimesaint said:

The track record of praying away the Gay is not good.

I thought about "pray away the gay" when I saw this video and I thought, "THIS IS HOW IT IS TO BE DONE!" Not out of a  direct call to repentence, not out of shunning them, not out of bitterness or dispair for them. It is to be done as shown in the video. 1) apologize for any wrong doing as did Courtney's father; 2) create an open and welcoming environment as did the LDS missionaries, local ward, and do not forget Courtney's upbringing in the Church. Despite her personal struggle, she knew it was true and that never left her. 3) Extend unconditional love for the, as they are Heavenly Father's children as you and I are Heavenly Father's children. 4) The choice is theirs to make. They made this choice after feeling the Hoyl Spirit in their lives confirming God's deep love for them and the pathway to them feeling the Hoyl Spirit was opened to them out of charity or pure love. 

I think anyone can change with this fomula. It is not guaranteed and statistically you are correct, it does not happen often for homosexuals, in fact, I do not know of anyone who was homosexual but no longer, but it this formula can and does change lives. 

[Darren10]

36 minutes ago, Daniel2 said:

Their story reminds me of the story of Elder Christofferson's brother, Tom.  Like him, they don't seem to imply their sexual orientation changed--rather, they chose to prioritize their religious identity over their relational identity ("the only thing that matters is our relationship with our Heavenly Father---nothing else matters"). 

I imagine that the emotional and spiritual response I feel as I listen to these two women's story is similar to the emotional and spiritual response that devout Latter-day Saints may feel when they hear a loved one leaves their family and Faith to pursue a relationship and marriage with someone of the same gender.  Hearing their story concerns me that other devout members of the LDS church close to gay family members will continue to hold out hope that more of us can and should follow their examples, rather than accept and respect those who chose a different path.   But while their choice saddens me, I fully support and respect their agency to choose how to conduct their lives and to share their stories.

At this stage of my life, I can't imagine living without the fulfillment of the loving relationship my husband and I share, and I, too, believe I have been blessed because of our relationship and have the opportunity to be a force for good in our extended family's and friends' lives.  May these young women continue to likewise find fulfillment, peace, and love on their journey.  It sounds like they both will have the tremendous opportunities and ability to lift, love, and bless others.

I wish them all the best.

D

I fully agree that Courtney and Rachelle's change isn't their sexual orientation but what they choose to do with it. I also agree that they have great opportunities to love and to serve others. Furthermore, , I think other members should gain hope that despite homosexual attraction, one can still choose the right path. I disagree that their choices is saddening but I appreciate your perspective. Their choices are definitely what God wants them to do. I pray for their strength and opportunities to grow towards God in His gospel. 

[Darren10]

1 hour ago, cdowis said:

It is not a matter of "praying it away".  Each of us may have a trial that does not simply get prayed away.  2 Cor 12:7

Exactly! 

[Kenngo1969]

1 hour ago, thesometimesaint said:

The track record of praying away the Gay is not good.

 

1 hour ago, cdowis said:

It is not a matter of "praying it away".  Each of us may have a trial that does not simply get prayed away.  2 Cor 12:7

 

27 minutes ago, thesometimesaint said:

Are they still Gay or not? 

Asked and answered. 

[Storm Rider]

The choice for every human is to either follow after the Son of God or not. It is not about following the Savior and still choosing to follow after sin.  The choice is one of where our heart will be - either following after the Savior, failing and repenting, but never ceasing in our desire to overcome our passions, temptations, etc.  Questions, as prurient as they are, is not about whether they are gay or not - the question is are they choosing to follow Christ no matter the personal sacrifice.  

Disciples of Christ are seeking a way to always follow him while never forgetting our own sinful nature.  I admire anyone who chooses to follow the Savior.  Self-sacrifice is one of the steps to discipleship.  Some of us are better at it than others - these two individuals set an example for all of us to emulate. 

[cdowis]

1 hour ago, poptart said:

  I know for me besides no one being willing to talk about Joseph Smiths Masonic ties

You may find this helpful.  He has specialized knowledge on this issue.

 

[bluebell]

These people put me to shame.

[USU78]

2 hours ago, cdowis said:

It is not a matter of "praying it away".  Each of us may have a trial that does not simply get prayed away.  2 Cor 12:7

And there's this reasonable expectation in 2 Timothy 4:

 

Quote

 

7 I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith:

8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.

 

We needn't expect our fight to end after prayer, even heart-felt prayer ...  a reasonable person expects the fight  ...  the race  ...  to be a lifelong one.

[Darren10]

18 minutes ago, bluebell said:

These people put me to shame.

I know, right! They are such great examples to me. 

[Darren10]

11 minutes ago, USU78 said:

And there's this reasonable expectation in 2 Timothy 4:

 

We needn't expect our fight to end after prayer, even heart-felt prayer ...  a reasonable person expects the fight  ...  the race  ...  to be a lifelong one.

And one God will ensure we win if we make the right choices. 

[Calm]

1 hour ago, Darren10 said:

 They have to point blank forget who they are...

I think it can be dangerous to phrase it like that.  Instead I would say recognize who they are and who they want most to become and what choices they need to make to bridge the gap.  I think those who think they should just "forget" or suppress their own attributes will find they make that aspect of themselves known in troublesome ways that are not as controllable as accepting one's attributes and actively working to adapt them to something better.

I know a family who were taught that anger/temper is to be ignored (someone can blow up right in front of their parents and they may go quiet, but no comment is made and life just goes on after the individual leaves the room)...I think the parents got the idea to not reward outbursts, that there would be less.  And there are, but there are also years of significant pain where the target of that anger doesn't have a clue what is going on because talking about it is off limits or the unpredictability of the outbursts creates fear in the grandchildren about doing something to trigger it not because they are afraid of their parent, but because they don't recognize them in that state or an inability to talk about the negative stuff going on in one's life so it just goes on and on rather than being dealt with and adapted into one's life in a healthy way.

Edited August 23, 2017 by Calm

[Calm]

same topic, but different discussion...just in case some have missed it.

http://www.mormondialogue.org/topic/69423-splitting-the-sky-meet-courtney-and-rachelle/

 

[poptart]

1 hour ago, cdowis said:

You may find this helpful.  He has specialized knowledge on this issue.

 

Should have said that I find the masonic ties attractive.  The grand master in Utah is a BYU grad.  Love how the church actually tries to get along.  meanwhile look at the Catholic church, still angry over what happened a long time ago, and it was kind of their own fault.