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Polygamy in the Celestial Kingdom

phaedrus ut

By phaedrus ut
in General Discussions

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VideoGameJunkie Grand Master

VideoGameJunkie

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, jkwilliams said:

Everyone here is biased, whether anyone pretends otherwise. The trick is to be honest and fair despite your biases. 

That's true. Honesty and being truthful is very important. Remember some of those who wind up in the Telestial Kingdom are liars and whoever loves and makes a lie. I never understood what the whoever loves and makes a lie means, but it warrants an eternity in the Telestial Kingdom.

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jkwilliams Grand Master

jkwilliams

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, ttribe said:

Okay, really?  First, if you think you have no bias, at all, you are fooling yourself.  Second, I operate under no illusion that anyone has any "respect" for me or my comments.

At to why I post here, that's not something I'm interested in turning into a discussion.  Suffice it to say, we all have our reasons and there is likely significant variation among all the posters on this board as to their/our reasons. Your opinion of my reasons are no more valid than my opinions of your reasons.  We're here, and until one or the both of us are kicked off this board, I suspect we'll be here for the foreseeable future.  If you find no value in anything I say, you are free to ignore me.  Such is the freedom of the Internet; no one can force you to care what I have to say.

For what it's worth, I totally don't respect you. ;)

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jkwilliams Grand Master

jkwilliams

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said:

That's true. Honesty and being truthful is very important. Remember some of those who wind up in the Telestial Kingdom are liars and whoever loves and makes a lie. I never understood what the whoever loves and makes a lie means, but it warrants an eternity in the Telestial Kingdom.

I think you're being too hard on ttribe. I'm the evil one, not him. 

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ttribe Grand Master

ttribe

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, VideoGameJunkie said:

That's true. Honesty and being truthful is very important. Remember some of those who wind up in the Telestial Kingdom are liars and whoever loves and makes a lie. I never understood what the whoever loves and makes a lie means, but it warrants an eternity in the Telestial Kingdom.

I investigate fraud as part of my professional duties; I think I have an idea on what the "loves and makes a lie means..."  There are many people who lie for profit and they love doing it.  It's what gives them a thrill.  It's sick, but it's real.

Just now, jkwilliams said:

For what it's worth, I totally don't respect you. ;)

Well, I knew that.

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VideoGameJunkie Grand Master

VideoGameJunkie

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, ttribe said:

I investigate fraud as part of my professional duties; I think I have an idea on what the "loves and makes a lie means..."  There are many people who lie for profit and they love doing it.  It's what gives them a thrill.  It's sick, but it's real.

Well, I knew that.

Thanks! I had no idea. And sorry about my post earlier. I'm trying to lose weight so I've been off sugar and low sugar is making me cranky right now. 

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ttribe Grand Master

ttribe

Posted
Posted
Just now, VideoGameJunkie said:

Thanks! I had no idea. And sorry about my post earlier. I'm trying to lose weight so I've been off sugar and low sugar is making me cranky right now. 

No worries...I have blood sugar issues, too.  Mine plummeted out of the blue this morning and I ran around the office trying to find some candy to keep me from becoming a raging jerk.

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Garden Girl Grand Master

Garden Girl

Posted
Posted
3 hours ago, ttribe said:

No worries...I have blood sugar issues, too.  Mine plummeted out of the blue this morning and I ran around the office trying to find some candy to keep me from becoming a raging jerk.

Try juice like orange juice.... as fast or faster than candy...

GG

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mfbukowski Grand Master

mfbukowski

Posted
Posted
On 5/23/2016 at 5:04 PM, Garden Girl said:

I too believe this... that our form of procreation is for this sphere... I think we get a clue from the way Adam was organized "in the garden" from the elements and his spirit put into his "body."  Even if the Garden story is allegorical, we can learn from it...

It was after he and Eve were banished to this dark and dreary world that sex became a factor.

GG

Ostler makes the point that the real fall for A&E was not eating the fruit- that was required for the plan- but when they "hid themselves because they were naked".  

For them personally, that was the moment they separated themselves from God. I think the objectification of seeing each other as "naked" instead of seeing themselves as brother and sister was the real change.  And ironically that was what was actually required for reproduction as we know it.  In hiding together they put their nakedness and all that goes with that perception of nakedness - "knowing" each other in an animal carnal way- ahead of the possibility of celestial reproduction which of course we do not understand.

They knew they needed each other to "replenish the earth" but the choice was to do it the Godly way or in the carnal way, and that moment of seeing themselves as "naked" marked the separation from God's way of doing things, and the pride of doing it their way rather than His way.

And of course God calls them on it- "Who told thee thou wast naked?" knowing full well the answer

I love the way God teaches us- asking questions he already knows the answer to in order to make us think about it.  Another is "Is man found on the earth?"   As if he didn;t know!!

But he wanted to teach them how to organize man- and so they did

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mfbukowski Grand Master

mfbukowski

Posted
Posted (edited)

deleted- error misread

Edited by mfbukowski
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Stargazer Grand Master

Stargazer

Posted
Posted
On 5/18/2016 at 8:39 AM, phaedrus ut said:

Something I've heard from many LDS couples, and something asked of me, is that the wife does not want any sort of polygamist relationship and she asks her husband to promise not to take another wife when they go to the Celestial kingdom.  One close friend of mine even went to her father and made him to promise not to take a polygamist wife.  Is this something you've discussed in your marriage? Is it unreasonable for someone to ask this of their husband or parent? 

 

Phaedrus 

Yeah, my late wife and I discussed the general question of plural marriage, and she agreed with me that if the Lord re-instituted plural marriage in mortality that we would be faithful to the principle.  This implies that we would be OK with it in the CK.

My current wife and her late husband discussed the exact same thing together and concluded that they would be obedient to the principle if the Lord re-instituted it.  This implies that they would be OK with it in the CK.

My current wife and I likewise discussed the possibility of plural marriage being re-instituted by the Lord in mortality, then we would be obedient.  We are not sealed together due to her prior sealing, so that's not a question between us.

Not that any of us would want to live the principle.  

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Stargazer Grand Master

Stargazer

Posted
Posted
19 minutes ago, mfbukowski said:

Ostler makes the point that the real fall for A&E was not eating the fruit- that was required for the plan- but when they "hid themselves because they were naked".  

For them personally, that was the moment they separated themselves from God. I think the objectification of seeing each other as "naked" instead of seeing themselves as brother and sister was the real change.  And ironically that was what was actually required for reproduction as we know it.  In hiding together they put their nakedness and all that goes with that perception of nakedness - "knowing" each other in an animal carnal way- ahead of the possibility of celestial reproduction which of course we do not understand.

They knew they needed each other to "replenish the earth" but the choice was to do it the Godly way or in the carnal way, and that moment of seeing themselves as "naked" marked the separation from God's way of doing things, and the pride of doing it their way rather than His way.

And of course God calls them on it- "Who told thee thou wast naked?" knowing full well the answer

I love the way God teaches us- asking questions he already knows the answer to in order to make us think about it.  Another is "Is man found on the earth?"   As if he didn;t know!!

But he wanted to teach them how to organize man- and so they did

You don't say, but it sounds like you agree with Ostler.  Whoever he is.

I find this theory completely unbelievable.  Adam and Eve were intended to bring children into being using "celestial reproduction"?  And the Fall occurred because of the nakedness recognition?  No way, Jose'.  The scriptures and every pronouncement of every GA that I have ever heard said that the Fall occurred due to partaking of the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil.  Ostler is completely wrong.

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Stargazer Grand Master

Stargazer

Posted
Posted
4 hours ago, VideoGameJunkie said:

That's true. Honesty and being truthful is very important. Remember some of those who wind up in the Telestial Kingdom are liars and whoever loves and makes a lie. I never understood what the whoever loves and makes a lie means, but it warrants an eternity in the Telestial Kingdom.

So, when the Nazis come to the door and ask if you're hiding Jews in your basement or attic, you must admit it?  And if you don't, you're going to the Telestial Kingdom?  

 

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VideoGameJunkie Grand Master

VideoGameJunkie

Posted
Posted
5 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

So, when the Nazis come to the door and ask if you're hiding Jews in your basement or attic, you must admit it?  And if you don't, you're going to the Telestial Kingdom?  

 

Well D&C says liars and whoever loves and makes a lie goes to the Telestial Kingdom. I asked what the 2nd part means.

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mfbukowski Grand Master

mfbukowski

Posted
Posted
59 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said:

My jets are cooled. I feel I explained my thoughts in a mature way. What's your thoughts on the subject?

I made a mistake- sorry- I deleted it but you caught it just before I guess

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mfbukowski Grand Master

mfbukowski

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, Tacenda said:

I think MFB might be a little cranky and might need a juice box. ;)

Yes mommy. ;)

The fact is I threw my back out and on major meds but it's not working.  GRRRR

But a juice box would be nice. :)    And a chocolate chip cookie while you're in the kitchen. :)

 

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Stargazer Grand Master

Stargazer

Posted
Posted
41 minutes ago, VideoGameJunkie said:

Well D&C says liars and whoever loves and makes a lie goes to the Telestial Kingdom. I asked what the 2nd part means.

Sorry, it seemed like you were making a blanket statement.  My bad.

My take on the part of "loves and makes a lie" is this: someone who makes up lies in order to deceive others, for whatever illicit reason, be it to steal from them, to induce them do things not in their interest, and to get gain not from their own efforts.  This would include even those who lie for what they think to be righteous reasons such as to oppose a religion they don't believe in.  An example of this last would be an evangelical Christian who makes up lies about the LDS Church in order to keep people from investigating it -- and the opposite, a Latter-day Saint who lies about evangelical Christianity for the same purpose.  Or similar purposes.  

I do feel that deception in and of itself is a neutral matter.  It's the intent that counts.  I know some will disagree.

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