Jump to content
Seriously No Politics ×

Brigham Young's statement on Sun People


Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, sunstoned said:

We are now in the twenty first century.  It is about time we put aside these nineteen century magic world views and superstitions.  If the church is going to survive, it will need to distance itself from such ramblings.  

When was the last time you sat in a formal Church setting, such as a class, a sacrament meeting or a conference, and heard someone discourse about hearsay accounts regarding what Joseph Smith supposedly said about moon men, or some off hand conjecture Brigham Young made about inhabitants of the sun?

I think the Church never did embrace such things. It's the anti-Mormons who dredge them up.

 

Link to comment

There is a difference between ignoring something and disavowing it.  The church is real good at ignoring things, until they come back around and byte them in the rear.  Much better to meet the crazy teachings head on and disavow them.  Yes, it would mean moving BY, JS and others down a level or so to mean mortals.  But in the long run it would be much heather for the church.  

I think the trouble is that if we start looking at past prophets as fallible men, then we might start seeing the current crop of leaders in the same light.  And once that happens, total control of the membership starts ebb. 

 

Link to comment
8 minutes ago, sunstoned said:

There is a difference between ignoring something and disavowing it.  The church is real good at ignoring things, until they come back around and byte them in the rear.  Much better to meet the crazy teachings head on and disavow them.  Yes, it would mean moving BY, JS and others down a level or so to mean mortals.  But in the long run it would be much heather for the church.  

I think the trouble is that if we start looking at past prophets as fallible men, then we might start seeing the current crop of leaders in the same light.  And once that happens, total control of the membership starts ebb. 

 

How can you disavow something that was never accepted in the first place? I'm quite certain the alleged comments about inhabitants of the sun or moon have never been embraced by the Church.

The FairMormon entry I quoted does a good job of putting this whole curiosity into historical context. That is sufficient to the moment.

Meanwhile, for those few who are going to get apoplectic (or, in the case of anti-Mormons, giddy with delight) over it, I can only hope that they, along with consumers of grocery-store tabloids, will one day get a life.

Link to comment
On 12/19/2015 at 5:24 PM, Tacenda said:

Very tall moon people.  

Depends on what you mean by "tall," shorty!

 

On 12/19/2015 at 6:22 PM, Bobbieaware said:

According to John"s account in the Book of Revelation, angels (celestial beings) are able to stand in the sun and withstand its tremendous light and heat. 

17 And I saw an angel STANDING IN THE SUN; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God. (Revelation 19)

But how long did the angel stand in the sun?

Mini Pearl tells the story about her slackjawed brother going into the blacksmith's shop. While the smith was beating out horseshoes, her brother picks up one of the ones that no longer glowed but were still hot. Screaming, he throws the horseshoe against the wall.

"Ha!" said the smith. "Burned ya, didn't it!"

Brother looks at him and said, "Naw, it just don't take me long to look at a horseshoe!"

 

 

 

 

Edited by Cold Steel
Link to comment
44 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

How can you disavow something that was never accepted in the first place? I'm quite certain the alleged comments about inhabitants of the sun or moon have never been embraced by the Church.

The FairMormon entry I quoted does a good job of putting this whole curiosity into historical context. That is sufficient to the moment.

Meanwhile, for those few who are going to get apoplectic (or, in the case of anti-Mormons, giddy with delight) over it, I can only hope that they, along with consumers of grocery-store tabloids, will one day get a life.

No one is giddy with delight Scott. Misrepresenting those who hold different opinions than you do is not a positive trait. Besides, you know as well as I do that anything uttered by the prophet or his apostles is embraced by the membership with no questions asked.  An example of this is the two earring talk. 

 

Edited by sunstoned
Link to comment
3 hours ago, sunstoned said:

We are now in the twenty first century.  It is about time we put aside these nineteen century magic world views and superstitions.  If the church is going to survive, it will need to distance itself from such ramblings.  

Maybe you should stop pretending we are somehow better than others because we live in a different centuries

Link to comment
12 hours ago, Sanpitch said:

I've read probably in the D&C that Brigham Young stated he thought people probably lived on the Sun, true or not, no matter.  In a discussion of evidence for the BofM this was written, I thought it funny:

"I understand the Polish Government is going to launch a Space ship to land on the sun so we should find out the truth of Brigham's belief once they land. Those of you who don't know anything and think they will burn up know nothing - they are going at night!"

No, it's not recorded in the D&C.  Never read much in there, I take it?

Possibly unrelated, but possibly triggered by the BY sun people thing, Eric James Stone's novella "That Leviathan, whom thou hast made" comes to mind.  This Nebula-award-winning story involves sun beings made of plasma, and the LDS congregation's branch president on the inside-the-sun station.  Unfortunately, you can't read the story except by buying the ebook version, but if you enjoy SF I am pretty sure you will enjoy this one.

Synopsis of the story: "Harry Malan is the president of a Mormon congregation on a station in the center of the Sun, where humans interact with "swales"--gigantic star-dwelling plasma beings. When a Mormon swale has a problem, Harry is determined to resolve it, even if it means confronting Leviathan, the largest swale."

Edited by Stargazer
Link to comment
JofD V13 Page 271  The seventh paragraph down.
 
"So it is with regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it; it was not made in vain. It was made to give light to those who dwell upon it, and to other planets; and so will this earth when it is celestialized. Every planet in its first rude, organic state receives not the glory of God upon it, but is opaque; but when celestialized, every planet that God brings into existence is a body of light, but not till then."
 
It's an off handed remark but at that time BY was taken serious and the JoD were considered to be Standard Works of the Church.
 
And
 

The Journal of Discourses deservedly ranks as one of the standard works of the Church, and every rightminded Saint will certainly welcome with joy every number (issue) as it comes forth.

President George Q. Cannon, Journal of Discourses, Preface, Volume 8.

Each successive Volume of these Discourses is a rich mine of wealth, containing gems of great value, and the diligent seeker will find ample reward for his labor. After the fathers and mothers of this generation have made them the study of their lives their children's children will find that they are still unexhausted, and rejoice that this Record has been handed down from their fathers to also aid them in following the way of life.

Apostle Orson Pratt, Preface. Volume 3.

It is impossible to give monetary value to the past volumes of this publication, ... Those who read the utterances of the servants of God, contained in this book, under the same influence by which the speakers were inspired, cannot fail to receive profit from the perusal.

President Joseph F. Smith, Preface, Volume 18.

We take great pleasure in presenting to the Saints and the world ... the Journal of Discourses, which they will find contains rich treasures of information concerning the glorious principles of Eternal Life, as revealed through God's anointed servants in these last days. All who read the discourses contained in this Volume are earnestly recommended to adapt them to their lives by practice, and we can confidently assure them that, in doing so, they are laying up a store of knowledge that will save and exalt them in the Celestial kingdom.

Apostle Albert Carrington, Journal of Discourses, Preface, Volume 15.

Ed to add: 

http://journalofdiscourses.com/
Edited by Sanpitch
Link to comment
13 hours ago, sunstoned said:

There is a difference between ignoring something and disavowing it.  The church is real good at ignoring things, until they come back around and byte them in the rear.  Much better to meet the crazy teachings head on and disavow them.  Yes, it would mean moving BY, JS and others down a level or so to mean mortals.  But in the long run it would be much heather for the church.  

I think the trouble is that if we start looking at past prophets as fallible men, then we might start seeing the current crop of leaders in the same light.  And once that happens, total control of the membership starts ebb. 

 

I want to deny all charges that I beat my wife and rob banks for a living. 

There is a point where this approach just causes more problems than it solves

Link to comment
On 12/20/2015 at 10:21 PM, sunstoned said:

No one is giddy with delight Scott. Misrepresenting those who hold different opinions than you do is not a positive trait. Besides, you know as well as I do that anything uttered by the prophet or his apostles is embraced by the membership with no questions asked.  An example of this is the two earring talk. 

 

Whatever their provenance or credibility, old-timey, off-hand comments regarding moon men and sun inhabitants have never been presented as binding upon the Latter-day Saints.

On the other hand, calling a halt to the sheer foolishness of puncturing or permanently marking up one's body was given as earnest counsel and teaching to the Latter-day Saints with the expectation that it be heeded.

Quite a difference, say I.

Edited by Scott Lloyd
Link to comment
13 hours ago, Russell C McGregor said:

"Total control of the membership?" You really have mastered your anti-Mormon slogans, haven't you?

We all know the prophets, past and present, were and are fallible men. That they are the fallible men whom God has chosen is a concept that simply eludes their fallible critics.

Which critics are so mind-numbingly stupid that they seem to imagine that if they can just convince us that the prophets are fallible, we'll throw the baby out with the bathwater and listen to them instead.

How dumb is that?

 

Desperately dumb, I should say.

 

Link to comment
On 12/20/2015 at 5:00 PM, JAHS said:

Actually they weren't original ideas of Smith or Young. At the time, the idea that people were living on the moon was being propagated by some of the contemporary scientists. In 1976 Patrick Moore, Director of the Lunar Section of the British Astronomical Association, wrote of William Herschel: "As an observer it is possible that he has never been equaled, and between 1781 and his death, in 1822, every honor that the scientific world could bestow came is way. His views about life in the Solar System were, then, rather surprising. He thought it possible that there was a region below the Sun's fiery surface where men might live, and he regarded the existence of life on the Moon as 'an absolute certainty."

 

Life is pretty resilient and adaptable to all kinds of environments. They didn't expect to find life on the sea floor near Valcano vents.  Yet there it is in abundance.

eco1.jpg

Edited by Zakuska
Link to comment

Brigham Young... Beleived Both Sun and Moon were inhabited.

"Who can tell us of the inhabitants of this little planet that shines of an evening called the moon? ...when you inquire about the inhabitants of that sphere you find that the most learned are as ignorant in regard to them as the ignorant of their fellows. So it is in regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it; it was not made in vain," (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 13, p. 217). 

Edited by Zakuska
Link to comment
2 hours ago, Zakuska said:

Brigham Young... Beleived Both Sun and Moon were inhabited.

"Who can tell us of the inhabitants of this little planet that shines of an evening called the moon? ...when you inquire about the inhabitants of that sphere you find that the most learned are as ignorant in regard to them as the ignorant of their fellows. So it is in regard to the inhabitants of the sun. Do you think it is inhabited? I rather think it is. Do you think there is any life there? No question of it; it was not made in vain," (Journal of Discourses, Vol. 13, p. 217). 

Are you sure he's wrong?  At least where the sun in concerned, it's not like we can check the surface.

Link to comment
20 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

Are you sure he's wrong?  At least where the sun in concerned, it's not like we can check the surface.

Duh....we'll just send a thermometer up with the Polish space craft and check the temperature of the surface. 

Link to comment
5 hours ago, Sanpitch said:

Duh....we'll just send a thermometer up with the Polish space craft and check the temperature of the surface. 

What good would that do?  How hot is too hot for celestial beings who are supposed to live on a sea of glass and everlasting burnings?

Inquiring minds what to know...

Link to comment
1 hour ago, Sevenbak said:

What good would that do?  How hot is too hot for celestial beings who are supposed to live on a sea of glass and everlasting burnings?

Inquiring minds what to know...

What? You don't think you can live in a 6000°C environment?

"The Sun's temperature, which reaches around 15 million degrees Celsius in its core, steadily decreases with distance from the core, falling to 6000°C at its 'surface'. Logically, it should therefore continue to decline in the atmosphere. Instead, it rises to about 10,000°C in the chromosphere, and exceeds a million degrees Celsius in the corona. So what source of energy can heat the atmosphere and maintain it at such high temperatures? For around a century, this question puzzled astrophysicists, all the more so as it relates to the origin of the solar wind that affects Earth."

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/06/150617091757.htm

Yeah, what source of energy would heat the Sun's Corona and maintain it at such high temperatures?

D&C 88:7

Link to comment
14 hours ago, PeterPear said:

What? You don't think you can live in a 6000°C environment?

"The Sun's temperature, which reaches around 15 million degrees Celsius in its core, steadily decreases with distance from the core, falling to 6000°C at its 'surface'. Logically, it should therefore continue to decline in the atmosphere. Instead, it rises to about 10,000°C in the chromosphere, and exceeds a million degrees Celsius in the corona. So what source of energy can heat the atmosphere and maintain it at such high temperatures? For around a century, this question puzzled astrophysicists, all the more so as it relates to the origin of the solar wind that affects Earth."

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/06/150617091757.htm

Yeah, what source of energy would heat the Sun's Corona and maintain it at such high temperatures?

D&C 88:7

Me, no.  Perhaps if and when my eyes are "as a flaming fire" I might be able to withstand the (ahem) refiners fire.

 

Link to comment
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...