filovirus Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 At the age of eight years, when we know good from evil, Satan tempts us. We are sinners and need Christ to overcome Satan and our evil nature, and to be forgiven for our sins. No one needs to be saved from Adams transgression, which I assume you believe is "original sin."Satan temps children under the age of 8. Those children are not held accountable for those sins. Christ's atonement covers them without the need for repentance. Link to comment
Tsuzuki Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 At the age of eight years, when we know good from evil, Satan tempts us. We are sinners and need Christ to overcome Satan and our evil nature, and to be forgiven for our sins. No one needs to be saved from Adams transgression, which I assume you believe is "original sin."Wouldn't knowing good from evil, by itself, make it harder for someone to tempt us? And as for anyone's "evil nature", I've seen no difference between someone with Christ and someone without Christ. It would seem to me that it was the serpent who was the real Savior. Link to comment
jkwilliams Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Satan temps children under the age of 8. Those children are not held accountable for those sins. Christ's atonement covers them without the need for repentance. And if we had an evil nature, we wouldn't need Satan to tempt us. 1 Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 You need to go to a monastery and not an internet discussion board (Trappist monks make some dang good cheese, bread, and beer, too!)Not a bad idea, actually. Maybe I could convert a few. I have been eating more red grapes and cheese lately than I should but it's not because I miss wine. it's not because I miss wineit's not because I miss wineit's not because I miss wineit's not because I miss wine 2 Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Something that never really made sense to me is that Mormonism doesn't believe in original sin, but still says we need to be saved from it. A "fortunate fall" does not need a Redeemer.I didn't need original sin to need redemption. Maybe you are perfect but I am not. 1 Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) Dang Beat me- to wit: At the age of eight years, when we know good from evil, Satan tempts us. We are sinners and need Christ to overcome Satan and our evil nature, and to be forgiven for our sins. No one needs to be saved from Adams transgression, which I assume you believe is "original sin." Edited October 22, 2015 by mfbukowski Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Wouldn't knowing good from evil, by itself, make it harder for someone to tempt us? And as for anyone's "evil nature", I've seen no difference between someone with Christ and someone without Christ. It would seem to me that it was the serpent who was the real Savior.Couldn't tell you about the temptation part- I have never experienced anything but being a total expert and getting tempted every minute of every day. Unfortunately I don't recall the serpent teaching much about morality or repentance or even kindness. Is that how you live your life? In emulation of the serpent? When do you get out of the joint? (I know you don't live that way....) Link to comment
sethpayne Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 "Actually"??What does that mean "leading you to Christ" and how can you know? Who is Christ and where does he live? Do you have his address? This is not an empirical quest There is only one guide and it is inside each of us Jesus himself gave us the key to this one, mfbukowski. Something about trees and fruit IIRC. Link to comment
Tsuzuki Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Unfortunately I don't recall the serpent teaching much about morality or repentance or even kindness. Is that how you live your life? In emulation of the serpent?What do you think the knowledge of good and evil is? Link to comment
Tony Frank Posted October 22, 2015 Author Share Posted October 22, 2015 Wouldn't knowing good from evil, by itself, make it harder for someone to tempt us? And as for anyone's "evil nature", I've seen no difference between someone with Christ and someone without Christ. It would seem to me that it was the serpent who was the real Savior. With or without Christ, a man will have an evil nature until he dies. Link to comment
jkwilliams Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 With or without Christ, a man will have an evil nature until he dies. In all my years as a Mormon, I've never been taught or believed that humans have "an evil nature." 2 Link to comment
JLHPROF Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) With or without Christ, a man will have an evil nature until he dies. Completely false.We may be imperfect and mortal, but there is a huge difference between that and evil. Edited October 22, 2015 by JLHPROF 2 Link to comment
JLHPROF Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 I want to get to the gate where Eloheim employs no servants I think when that happens you will be a member of the Eloheim. 1 Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 Jesus himself gave us the key to this one, mfbukowski. Something about trees and fruit IIRC.Yup.I certainly agree with that one. Link to comment
Tsuzuki Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 I think when that happens you will be a member of the Eloheim.The difference between me and you is that I believe that's already the case. Link to comment
mfbukowski Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 I think when that happens you will be a member of the Eloheim.Hmmm could, be but I think its "before" it is possible to get that far, that which doesn't make much sense since we are in a different time reference, maybe? There are keys implied that we will need before anyone gets that far imo. Resurrection could be one of them. I think we get the keys there Link to comment
Tsuzuki Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 There are keys implied that we will need before anyone gets that far imo.I've got those. Link to comment
Damien the Leper Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 (edited) Can the temple start using YHWH, please? Jehovah is such a bad translation. Edited October 22, 2015 by Valentinus 3 Link to comment
filovirus Posted October 22, 2015 Share Posted October 22, 2015 With or without Christ, a man will have an evil nature until he dies.The closest I can understand from this phrase is that we need to "put off the natural man". But that doesn't imply a "evil nature". Link to comment
hagoth7 Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I've got those.?!And please don't tell me it would take a 6 hour video to explain what you mean by that... 1 Link to comment
VideoGameJunkie Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I know where Jesus and Elohim live. Near Kolob. Where Kolob is I have no idea, but I want to get Matt Damon, put him in a rocket and see if he can reach Kolob. 2 Link to comment
Avatar4321 Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I know where Jesus and Elohim live. Near Kolob. Where Kolob is I have no idea, but I want to get Matt Damon, put him in a rocket and see if he can reach Kolob.With the number of times our government has had to send out rescue missions for matt Damon why would you think that's a good idea?Seriously though it's a shame we can't have an interesting topic that doesn't get side track with absurdity Link to comment
VideoGameJunkie Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 I'm also interested in hearing about the keys Tsuzuki already has. Link to comment
Tony Frank Posted October 23, 2015 Author Share Posted October 23, 2015 And if we had an evil nature, we wouldn't need Satan to tempt us. On the contrary, having an evil nature is why we must rely on Jesus Christ. The brother of Jared put it best when he was speaking to the Lord. "We know that thou art holy and dwellest in the heavens and that we are unworthy before thee; because of the fall our natures have become evil continually; nevertheless, O Lord, thou hast given us a commandment that we must call upon thee that from thee we may receive according to our desires." (Ether 3:2) Link to comment
JLHPROF Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 (edited) On the contrary, having an evil nature is why we must rely on Jesus Christ. The brother of Jared put it best when he was speaking to the Lord. "We know that thou art holy and dwellest in the heavens and that we are unworthy before thee; because of the fall our natures have become evil continually; nevertheless, O Lord, thou hast given us a commandment that we must call upon thee that from thee we may receive according to our desires." (Ether 3:2) You shouldn't take every poetic turn of phrase to be literal truth. Hyperbole, metaphor, and other literary tools are all through scripture.(And since this is coming from a scriptural literalist you can make your own judgement...). I mean, that Book of Revelation could be real scary if every word was literal. Edited October 23, 2015 by JLHPROF 1 Link to comment
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