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Charleston And Stories We Tell Ourselves


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After a busy week, I have some down time to think about things that take time to think about. 

 

The events in Charleston cause of all of us to reflect upon our faith and core beliefs. We ask why and have trouble coming up with answers that satisfy us. A group of good people gathered to study the Word of God fall victim to the senseless exercise of free agency by another. Though legally an adult, those of us that have raised boys know 21-year olds can be as lost as many teenagers. He is responsible and will pay the price, but we wonder if he also a partial victim of hate spread by others. A tragedy for all involved.

 

These situations cause us to ask difficult questions and we often tell ourselves "stories" to help us mentally cope. The story I tell myself is that while some people may be protected by God for special reasons, most of us are going to find ourselves subject to consequences of the free agency of others, including an untimely death. I also tell myself, that while I place a lot of importance on the duration of mortal life, God does not. I tell myself that this life is one brief experience in an eternity of experience and that while I may make plans for the future, the only really important thing is today, because tomorrow may not come. 

 

I'm actually an optimistic person, but also like to view things as they really are.

 

I wonder what "stories " other people tell themselves to absorb these types of events. May "stories" is the wrong word, but I don't know what else to call it.

 

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Mass killers may be insane but they are not necessarily stupid. They generally pick a soft target like a church or a school or a theatre where there is little chance of being shot. They tend to avoid police stations or, with one exception I know of, military compounds. They look for fame and media attention, and they get it, again and again. However, they are but a bee sting compared to the mass killers of history who slaughtered thousands if not millions. What ' story ' can we make up for those monsters?

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Today's instantaneous and worldwide news flow does throw these events in our face. It seems these types of events this are occurring more often, but  a lot of that is today's information age. Larger and more horrific acts of violence have occurred over thousands of year. It all begs the question of who's in charge of this mess...but with little answers. 

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I don't understand the interplay between terrible events that happen as a result of man's inhumanity to man, those which happen as a result of living in a fallen world, what God intervenes to prevent, and what He chooses to allow.  I can only have faith that, in the long run, as Paul wrote, "All things work together for the good of them that love God"—all things, not just the "good" things or the things we understand, but all things.  I can only have faith that God allows (or intervenes to prevent) horrible things based on what best suits his inscrutable purposes (inscrutable to the mortal mind, anyway).

 

As I've said so many times before, so often, we cannot choose our circumstances: all we can choose is how we react to them.

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Living through the sixties,,I am so,o.o sad.  I thought that this stuff could be over.  I know that there will always be people who in their minds have "this cause" but color me blue..gray or something.  I am sad that this country hasn't evolved enough to raise a generation of people who can make beautiufl pictures without crayons.

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Living through the sixties,,I am so,o.o sad.  I thought that this stuff could be over.  I know that there will always be people who in their minds have "this cause" but color me blue..gray or something.  I am sad that this country hasn't evolved enough to raise a generation of people who can make beautiufl pictures without crayons.

You're right that one incident like this is too many, but to imply that "we" haven't learned anything since then is a mistake, I think.  Yes, there are still blatant racists among us, but such attitudes used to be both much more prevalent and much more mainstream than they are now.  Now, people with these attitudes are quickly marginalized by society's mainstream.

 

No, we still ain't where we could be, we still ain't where we should be, we still ain't where we oughta be, but thank goodness we ain't where we was.

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Mass killers may be insane but they are not necessarily stupid. They generally pick a soft target like a church or a school or a theatre where there is little chance of being shot. 

 

Mass killers are insane and stupid. They generally don't care about their lives, the Washington Post reported that Roof was thinking of killing himself. 

Most mass killers do kill themselves.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2015/06/20/what-we-know-so-far-about-charleston-church-shooting-suspect-dylann-roof/

 

 

. They tend to avoid police stations or, with one exception I know of, military compounds.

 

http://abcnews.go.com/topics/news/eric-frein.htm

Edited by TheSkepticChristian
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The best story for me is the one that affirms that all the horrors and injustice of life and the world will be made right by the Atonement, and that--before that--the gospel is intended not just for life after death but for the onset of eternal life now, while still in mortality.

 

The most touching thing to me about the Charleston massacre was the pictures of the victims, they looked like they were living that life. From my point of view the countenance of Christ shone from their faces.

 

So far I have no other "lesson" from this horror, but I'll try to keep those faces in my mind.

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I don't think anyone says we're helpless as a nation against these, but it is true that we cannot collectively prevent all these events. Individually, people do indeed do things that prevent them, as recently seen in Garland, Texas.

On another note, it's not quite accurate to judge America by comparing to Europe or many other countries. Europe is still recovering from mass killings of millions of innocent civilians at home and that changes perspectives.

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I don't think anyone says we're helpless as a nation against these, but it is true that we cannot collectively prevent all these events. Individually, people do indeed do things that prevent them, as recently seen in Garland, Texas.

On another note, it's not quite accurate to judge America by comparing to Europe or many other countries. Europe is still recovering from mass killings of millions of innocent civilians at home and that changes perspectives.

Garland is a bad example of the type. It was deliberately trying to provoke a violent reaction. They succeeded. Everyone involved was a moron.

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Garland is a bad example of the type. It was deliberately trying to provoke a violent reaction. They succeeded. Everyone involved was a moron.

Other countries are not good comparisons to America.

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If we are messed up enough that other nations cannot be compared to us and that we should expect lots of shootings that raises a lot more questions.

Think about Europe. I live there, my neighbors still have a WW2 bunker that the village built in their front yard. Heck, where I live used to BE Germany and now it's France.

People here still have grandparents who knew people killed en masse in genocide, who remember other villagers turning each other in to the Nazis and then living side-by-side after the war. The hell of war crushed Europe and it's still in recovery.

So, my point is, if we want to be as safe as Europe and Japan and other countries, having a genocide among their own on their soil was the price. I'm saying that the price for the attitudes in other countries may be more than we've ever paid in mass shootings.

Edited by Meadowchik
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Think about Europe. I live there, my neighbors still have a WW2 bunker that the village built in their front yard. Heck, where I live used to BE Germany and now it's France.

People here still have grandparents who knew people killed en masse in genocide, who remember other villagers turning each other in to the Nazis and then living side-by-side after the war. The hell of war crushed Europe and it's still in recovery.

So, my point is, if we want to be as safe as Europe and Japan and other countries, having a genocide among their own on their soil was the price. I'm saying that the price for the attitudes in other countries may be more than we've ever paid in mass shootings.

I do not believe this at all. The World War Two generation is old and dying and our shootings are not done by the elderly. Japan and a lot of Europe is still deeply racist. They just do not talk about it as much as people in the States do.

I think it has more to do with people in the States being frustrated with their lives and a culture that idolizes the power of the gun.

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I do not believe this at all. The World War Two generation is old and dying and our shootings are not done by the elderly. Japan and a lot of Europe is still deeply racist. They just do not talk about it as much as people in the States do.

I think it has more to do with people in the States being frustrated with their lives and a culture that idolizes the power of the gun.

I'm not talking about old people, but collective memory, and it pervades laws and culture. I know that the UK and France both made major gun control changes because of the world wars.

Think about it...do you really think all the attacks and loss on home soil can happen without having a profound impact for generations?

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I'm not talking about old people, but collective memory, and it pervades laws and culture. I know that the UK and France both made major gun control changes because of the world wars.

Think about it...do you really think all the attacks and loss on home soil can happen without having a profound impact for generations?

I think maybe we need to pass similar gun control changes modified to fit circumstances here.

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I guess the other great lie is, 'this only happens in the USA'.  It happens everywhere.  There was one case a few years ago in Norway? or Sweden, where some idiot killed 69 people.

And there was just a recent convert to Islam pilot who killed everyone on his plane by crashing the plane.  Where, Germany?

dc

 

 

MODERATOR: We do not allow political discussions on the board. 

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I guess the other great lie is, 'this only happens in the USA'.  It happens everywhere.  There was one case a few years ago in Norway? or Sweden, where some idiot killed 69 people.

And there was just a recent convert to Islam pilot who killed everyone on his plane by crashing the plane.  Where, Germany?

dc

The "report" that Andreas Lubitz was a recent convert to Islam has been discredited. Please see here: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/warrenthrockmorton/2015/03/31/was-the-germanwings-flight-9525-pilot-a-muslim-convert/

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Gun control?  You don't know what gun control is.

Passing a law won't make crazy people not do crazy things.

dc

 

A Brit I know recently pointed out that the 3D printer basically makes gun control obsolete.

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