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Does anyone else out there feel as though Marriage is overrated but also feel that you are obligated to get married because you don't want to end up in hell for all eternity?

Okay, I know we don't really teach that there is a hell as most people understand it; rather that hell is being cut off from the presence of the Lord. Which incidentally I don't want to have happen to me but frankly I see marriage as being vastly overrated. Your poor, you fight all the time, you constantly have to make up and have children who grow up to write a book about how you screwed up their life.

As for me I lost my interest in marriage a long time ago, and frankly I don't give a (you know what) about Sex. Frankly I don't see how you can be a righteous man when you are having sex, I don't care if she's your wife I still see sex as an obscene evil.

Yes I have issues, and frankly I am lazy and selfish, but so are a lot of people these days.

But back to the matter at hand, marriage seems to be hell on earth yet to avoid being cut off from God we have to be married. It seems rather odd to me, has anyone else dealt with this before or is it just me?

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Does anyone else out there feel as though Marriage is overrated but also feel that you are obligated to get married because you don't want to end up in hell for all eternity?

Okay, I know we don't really teach that there is a hell as most people understand it; rather that hell is being cut off from the presence of the Lord. Which incidentally I don't want to have happen to me but frankly I see marriage as being vastly overrated. Your poor, you fight all the time, you constantly have to make up and have children who grow up to write a book about how you screwed up their life.

As for me I lost my interest in marriage a long time ago, and frankly I don't give a (you know what) about Sex. Frankly I don't see how you can be a righteous man when you are having sex, I don't care if she's your wife I still see sex as an obscene evil.

Yes I have issues, and frankly I am lazy and selfish, but so are a lot of people these days.

But back to the matter at hand, marriage seems to be hell on earth yet to avoid being cut off from God we have to be married. It seems rather odd to me, has anyone else dealt with this before or is it just me?

You could always go strictly by the bible where it says there is no marriage given in heaven. And I hardly think you're bound for hell if you don't marry. Just follow the first two commandments and you'll do all that is required, IMO. Edited by Tacenda
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My dear Enigma...

I am going to take you at your word that your post is legitimate. If so, I feel really sorry for you because you obviously didn't have the benefit of seeing "good marriages." Your statement that in marriage you're "poor," "fight all the time," and your kids grow up to blame you for ruining their lives is so far from the reality that I know as marriage that I can't imagine how you must have grown up. And that if married you must have had a lousy one.

My husband wasn't perfect, but I can say we had a wonderful marriage... he was a terrific person and treated me like a queen. I won't go on and on extolling all his virtues, but I truly miss him and the relationship we shared, and I have such memories of 38 years with this man... and I know he waits beyond the veil for me, and we will be eternal companions because of the sealing blessings. And I know many, many others who had similar marriages. I'm just sorry you obviously did not.

GG

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A marriage is not overrated, what you describe is a bad marriage which isn't really a marriage at all.

Well it does not help that my Job in the Army is dealing with people who are having problems. And even then I see a lot and I mean a lot of unhappy marriages, not to mention my mom and dad have never really been happily married, nor my sisters and well I think you can see where I am coming from.

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You could always go strictly by the bible where it says there is no marriage in heaven. And I hardly think you're bound for hell if you don't marry. Just follow the first two commandments and you'll do all that is required, IMO.

Again Tacenda, you misunderstand and mistate Church doctrine... and thus are giving inaccurate advice to someone who is obviously troubled.

GG

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...and frankly I don't give a (you know what) about Sex. Frankly I don't see how you can be a righteous man when you are having sex, I don't care if she's your wife I still see sex as an obscene evil.

Dare I say that might be part of the problem? This is not healthy in a marriage, for either partner, nor is it church doctrine, in fact, far from it. Complete fidelity means more than just the lack of it's opposite.

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Again Tacenda, you misunderstand and mistate Church doctrine... and thus are giving inaccurate advice to someone who is obviously troubled.

GG

I guess I didn't know that wasn't church doctrine. I thought that being unwed was ok and you aren't sent to hell. My hubby corrected me and said you have the millenium to marry. I didn't realize the seriousness of the need to marry, I've been a member for forty three years. What's the matter with spending eternity as an angel?
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Well it does not help that my Job in the Army is dealing with people who are having problems. And even then I see a lot and I mean a lot of unhappy marriages, not to mention my mom and dad have never really been happily married, nor my sisters and well I think you can see where I am coming from.

Are you a Chaplan?
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I guess I didn't know that wasn't church doctrine. I thought that being unwed was ok and you aren't sent to hell. My hubby corrected me and said you have the millenium to marry. I didn't realize the seriousness of the need to marry, I've been a member for forty three years. What's the matter with spending eternity as an angel?

Nothing, if that's all you want... and I do know someone very dear to me that only aspires to that... to be a ministering angel, or whatever way she can be of service to Heavenly Father without being married. But for me, I desire further blessings with my dear husband as his eternal companion...

GG

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Are you a Chaplan?

Thankfully, no! I am a Chaplain Assistant, and I know quite a few Chaplain Assistants and fellow soldiers who bitterly resent their spouses, men and women alike. When you are a Chaplain Assistant you are a shoulder for people to cry on, (or at least I am) or someone they can vent to. Heck I even know Chaplains who hate their wives.

But about everyone in my family including extended family has either been divorced or is un-happy in their marriage. It wasn't always like this mind you. When I was a teenager, and and young man I desprately wanted the love of a woman, but time and life have not only hardened my heart but caused me to loose my disire for companionship of any kind. I have no friends nor do I want any anymore. I have been mistreated and betrayed enough!

Mind you I don't dislike women or anything, I think women are wonderful people (accpet the ones in the army) I just don't want to be involved with one anymore. But I'm scared because I don't want to be cut off at the last day because I chose never to get married. But I see so much hate and spite between men and women these days that I say "forget it!" "I'll stay a virgin recluse for the rest of my life thanks."

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Does anyone else out there feel as though Marriage is overrated

No, I feel it is underrated.

but also feel that you are obligated to get married because you don't want to end up in hell for all eternity?

No. I got married because I wanted to, because I was (and still am) in love with the person I married. I also made a lot of sacrifices in order to get married.

As for me I lost my interest in marriage a long time ago, and frankly I don't give a (you know what) about Sex. Frankly I don't see how you can be a righteous man when you are having sex, I don't care if she's your wife I still see sex as an obscene evil.

A ridiculous attitude, honestly. Even if you are against sex for procreation, your view would have it that God commanded men and women to engage in obscene evil.

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Why do certain people have the notion that not being married means you will be separated from God and not be able to enter celestial glory? And why does this mistaken notion so often go unchallenged? Anyhow, based on your post it's apparent that you've either never been married (based off a very superficial and limited view) or you were in a very terrible marriage.

It seems that, while not necessarily the norm, but certainly not abnormal, people get married where one or both of the spouses aren't committed to a relationship or are immature or selfish, then when the relationship falls apart they feel that they 'did what the church asked' and it didn't work out. It's just unfortunate that the church gets slammed on both sides of the issue -- that they're requiring too much of people and not allowing people to 'fall in love' with whoever they fall in love with, or 'the church' pushed them into an unhealthy marriage.

The last paragraph isn't really addressed to you, just tangential comments loosely pertaining to the subject.

Edited by Judd
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It is very difficult from your perspective to get a balanced view of life.Policemen see the worst 5% of humanity and see a large number of others at their worst moments. From that they tend to harden themselves and that colors all the rest of their view. Given your situation it is not an unusual attitude to chuck it all under the bus. I hope that you can find some venue where you see the good in people more often to balance out .

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That is a sweet quote, I need to remember it.

I found it! I kinda remembered it wrongly but still applicable!

"Pleasure usually takes the form of "me" and "now," while joy is "us " and "always."

Neal A Maxwell, The Smallest Part, p 23

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Hello Enigma..

Well, your career choice places you in a position where you see a majority of problematic marriages and situations...

My prayer for you is that you will take this to the Lord in prayer... ask him to help you heal your heart that you may be open to finding a good woman... and there are maaany out there looking for a good man... to share your life. Those couples who truly live the gospel, including the men who live and honor their priesthood, are the ones who find the lasting and cherished relationship in their marriage. It is my prayer that you will be so blessed... it's worth the effort to seek and find.

And I would suggest that part of your healing of heart would include some professional counseling in regard to your attitude about sexual relationships within marriage. I agree with Volgadon that the marriage relationship is commanded of God...

GG

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Hello Enigma..

Well, your career choice places you in a position where you see a majority of problematic marriages and situations...

My prayer for you is that you will take this to the Lord in prayer... ask him to help you heal your heart that you may be open to finding a good woman... and there are maaany out there looking for a good man... to share your life. Those couples who truly live the gospel, including the men who live and honor their priesthood, are the ones who find the lasting and cherished relationship in their marriage. It is my prayer that you will be so blessed... it's worth the effort to seek and find.

And I would suggest that part of your healing of heart would include some professional counseling in regard to your attitude about sexual relationships within marriage. I agree with Volgadon that the marriage relationship is commanded of God...

GG

Thank you!

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Hello Enigma..

Well, your career choice places you in a position where you see a majority of problematic marriages and situations...

My prayer for you is that you will take this to the Lord in prayer... ask him to help you heal your heart that you may be open to finding a good woman... and there are maaany out there looking for a good man... to share your life. Those couples who truly live the gospel, including the men who live and honor their priesthood, are the ones who find the lasting and cherished relationship in their marriage. It is my prayer that you will be so blessed... it's worth the effort to seek and find.

And I would suggest that part of your healing of heart would include some professional counseling in regard to your attitude about sexual relationships within marriage. I agree with Volgadon that the marriage relationship is commanded of God...

GG

I do not want anyone to think that I regret becoming a Chaplain Assistant, because really I don't, after having a long talk with my mom I realized that at the heart of my problem is fear. From the time that I was very young I have failed at so many things, things go wrong for me on an almost daily basis and after 25 years of that I am mortally afraid of failing at marriage.

Because failing at marriage means divorce and all the pain and sorrow I have seen for so many others. My other problem is my aversion to sex, and just for giggles I'm male, just so you know. I have very good reasons for viewing sex with abhorrence, reasons few would understand, and I'm not going to go into what they are. Yes I know that it's completely irrational to see sex as evil when it is kept in its proper place and time but....my case is complicated. If I could (and I mean still attain the highest degree of glory) I would have myself surgically castrated so that I never had to have those feelings ever again.

Yes I know I'm jacked up, but I think it's fair to say I'm also scarred. Take this as you will.

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Does anyone else out there feel as though Marriage is overrated but also feel that you are obligated to get married because you don't want to end up in hell for all eternity?

I've never been married. Too young. But, let me give you a piece of advice anyways, that I have sort of discovered from watching others; marriage is what you make of it. If you want it to be great, you can make it great, if you want it to be horrible, you can make it horrible. Sure, the other person can throw things off, but not too many can reject a fully dedicated person. It's hard to throw them off; to throw off someone who is everything that is good. So be that person, and your marriage will proceed far better than you'd think. Then again, I'm young, so I don't really know too much; I haven't finished the process yet myself. But that's the piece of advice I have learned from others.

Okay, I know we don't really teach that there is a hell as most people understand it; rather that hell is being cut off from the presence of the Lord. Which incidentally I don't want to have happen to me but frankly I see marriage as being vastly overrated. Your poor, you fight all the time, you constantly have to make up and have children who grow up to write a book about how you screwed up their life.

Being single doesn't separate you from the presense of the Lord (there are single people in the celestial, just not the highest level in the celestial). What does is being unwilling to follow the commandments of the Lord. Are you unwilling to follow his commandments?

As for me I lost my interest in marriage a long time ago, and frankly I don't give a (you know what) about Sex. Frankly I don't see how you can be a righteous man when you are having sex, I don't care if she's your wife I still see sex as an obscene evil.

Why do you think marriage is about that? Having children, yes, I can see that. But that other thing? Not at all. What a righteous marriage is about is service and dedication. If it isn't, there are things to learn. The Lord doesn't want you to think of your spouse as an object; he wants you to think of her as your eternal partner. So it has been taught in church, indeed.

Yes I have issues, and frankly I am lazy and selfish, but so are a lot of people these days.

Well then fix it. We who follow the Lord can't afford to be lazy and selfish. We must be better than that =). Let's not be lazy and selfish, but instead be serviceable and productive.

But back to the matter at hand, marriage seems to be hell on earth yet to avoid being cut off from God we have to be married. It seems rather odd to me, has anyone else dealt with this before or is it just me?

Why is marriage hell on earth though? I think that's just one perspective... perhaps we can change that?

Edited by TAO
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I used to have similar concerns to you about marital intimacy. What finally got me over it was when I learned that Jewish law required men to give their wives intimacy a certain number of times each week varying by how hard the husband worked. A lawyer, for example, had to do it more often than a farmer. I don't know why that worked for me, but it did.

As for marriage. I failed to keep my marriage together, but at the same time, I've seen older couples like President and Sister Hinckley, who were still madly in love after so many years. They give me hope that marriage as an institution is still a good thing.

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I do not want anyone to think that I regret becoming a Chaplain Assistant, because really I don't, after having a long talk with my mom I realized that at the heart of my problem is fear. From the time that I was very young I have failed at so many things, things go wrong for me on an almost daily basis and after 25 years of that I am mortally afraid of failing at marriage.

Why do we fall? So that we might learn to pick ourselves up.

If you try and fail, and you learn something, you are not at fault. But if you are given the opportunity to try something which is right, and you don't, you perhaps might be faulted for not trying. So take a step of faith... you need to hope, and pray that you won't fail. And if you do, realize, that it's one step in an eternal process, that will ultimately leave you very happy... and married. Those who seek their entire lives, and have not found yet... well... I have a feeling God will not retain from them what they have sought. For as they knock, it shall be opened unto them as God wills it to be.

Because failing at marriage means divorce and all the pain and sorrow I have seen for so many others.

How much sorrowful will you be though, to learn what happiness you missed for not trying? I think that will be more bitter than failing... not trying, and realizing what you missed.

My other problem is my aversion to sex, and just for giggles I'm male, just so you know. I have very good reasons for viewing sex with abhorrence, reasons few would understand, and I'm not going to go into what they are. Yes I know that it's completely irrational to see sex as evil when it is kept in its proper place and time but....my case is complicated. If I could (and I mean still attain the highest degree of glory) I would have myself surgically castrated so that I never had to have those feelings ever again.

No I understand. Actually, while I wouldn't say my feelings go as far as you, I really disapprove of lustful feelings. REALLY DISAPPROVE. I have my own reasons for it as well. But you must realize, the union isn't really for lust... that's not why God designed it. He didn't design it for us to lust on others. So what did he design it for? Well, the obvious one, is children. And children are a great thing; a wonderful thing; a beautiful thing. So, let me ask you, can you control your own feelings for the children? Can you get over your love-hate aversion with it for those wonderful little blessings of joy that will come in your life? Yes you can!

Now, the prophets have also spoken concerning the other reasons... but I'd suggest you consider their writings, and pray a lot about it, rather than take advice from me. After all, I'm too young to be married right now =).

Yes I know I'm jacked up, but I think it's fair to say I'm also scarred. Take this as you will.

Your not jacked up. Your just worried. Everyone is scared a bit. Especially us Mormons, who tend to be the hearts of innocence, in a sense. Deep down inside, there are a lot of us who just want good things to happen. It's scary taking this step. But it's the one God wanted us to take. And we must trust him, as children trust him, for deep down, we are children, just following his lead. Follow the prophet... yes... but also, follow the Savior. =)

Know this; we are all in this together!

Edited by TAO
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