blooit Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 By chance, my stake is one of the stakes in the church piloting the program. I've been reviewing it, and I have to say - WOW! What a great change. I have been a teacher for years, and work as a superintendent now. I must say that the church has really got the learning process figured out. I am beyond impressed.My only concern (which I am sure will be addressed by church leaders) was that the program encourages leaders to counsel with parents about what should be taught. This is a great idea, but it didn't take 20 minutes before YM/YW leaders were talking about "weekly curriculum coordinating meetings" with parents and visiting homes. At some point we'll need to make sure this doesn't become another excuse for more meetings. One of my favorite parts is the emphasis on Youth being the center of the meeting, and not lecturing them. It's about a personal testimony of Jesus Christ (which our EV friends understand very well). I could ramble on for a while - but suffice it to say that in my humble opinion, a lot of good will come from this change in curriculum. 1
Brother Pete Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 By chance, my stake is one of the stakes in the church piloting the program. I've been reviewing it, and I have to say - WOW! What a great change. I have been a teacher for years, and work as a superintendent now. I must say that the church has really got the learning process figured out. I am beyond impressed.My only concern (which I am sure will be addressed by church leaders) was that the program encourages leaders to counsel with parents about what should be taught. This is a great idea, but it didn't take 20 minutes before YM/YW leaders were talking about "weekly curriculum coordinating meetings" with parents and visiting homes. At some point we'll need to make sure this doesn't become another excuse for more meetings. One of my favorite parts is the emphasis on Youth being the center of the meeting, and not lecturing them. It's about a personal testimony of Jesus Christ (which our EV friends understand very well). I could ramble on for a while - but suffice it to say that in my humble opinion, a lot of good will come from this change in curriculum.Do you have more details you can share?
Bikeemikey Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 Sounds exciting - how about some example content.
Traela Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 My stake is starting in July. After looking at the materials, I can see what they're trying to do, but I can't say I'm terribly excited yet. First, the YM/YW and the Sunday School have the same lesson outline- lots of opportunity for stepping on toes, and worse, for the kids to get bored by the second class because they've already sat through an hour of the same stuff. And I've always liked that SS and YW, Priesthood and RS have seemed to have separate purposes: SS teaches the doctrine, the others teach the application.Which brings me to my second concern. As a youth Sunday School teacher I've found that even the 16/17 class members don't know the scriptures very well. Some stories they don't recognize at all yet! (Even those who go to Seminary.) I'm not sure that depriving them of another opportunity to go through the Scriptures in a systematic way is really a good thing.But I will do my best to accomplish what TPTB are going for.
juliann Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 My ward is piloting this as well but I have no idea what it is about. Feedback appreciated..... 1
nutshell Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 I'm also interested in this new program. Focusing on the youth sounds good!
blooit Posted June 17, 2012 Author Posted June 17, 2012 My stake is starting in July. After looking at the materials, I can see what they're trying to do, but I can't say I'm terribly excited yet.First, the YM/YW and the Sunday School have the same lesson outline- lots of opportunity for stepping on toes, and worse, for the kids to get bored by the second class because they've already sat through an hour of the same stuff. And I've always liked that SS and YW, Priesthood and RS have seemed to have separate purposes: SS teaches the doctrine, the others teach the application.Which brings me to my second concern. As a youth Sunday School teacher I've found that even the 16/17 class members don't know the scriptures very well. Some stories they don't recognize at all yet! (Even those who go to Seminary.) I'm not sure that depriving them of another opportunity to go through the Scriptures in a systematic way is really a good thing.But I will do my best to accomplish what TPTB are going for.Not trying to disagree, I just... disagree The theme is the same for SS and YM/YW, but the lessons are entirely different. In fact, deacons may give a completely different lesson than the teachers. It is based on the teacher's inspiration and the needs of the individual class. As always, there is room for failure, but the potential for quality teaching seems to good to me.I would like to feel I am a good teacher, and I have always felt very restricted by the current system. I feel like this one gives me the opportunity to "teach and learn by the spirit."
blooit Posted June 17, 2012 Author Posted June 17, 2012 The entire focus is on personal conversion and applying what we have learned. Duty to God and Personal Progress with be incorporated right into the lessons instead of being separate programs. Children will have a lot of input on what is taught, and teachers make the final decision on what lesson is given based on their impressions and the needs of their students. The focus will be on open discussion rather than lecture. Cliff's Notes version - but all I can do right now.As a high school teacher and administrator, I watched many LDS youth leave the church. Not one took the detour because they didn't know the gospel. In fact, many of them knew it better than I. Rather, they left because what they knew never penetrated deeper than their mind. I have cried for years that conversion must be our focus, and this program does that IMHO. 1
nutshell Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 The entire focus is on personal conversion and applying what we have learned. Duty to God and Personal Progress with be incorporated right into the lessons instead of being separate programs. Children will have a lot of input on what is taught, and teachers make the final decision on what lesson is given based on their impressions and the needs of their students. The focus will be on open discussion rather than lecture. Cliff's Notes version - but all I can do right now.Wow, this does sound like a much different focus. Customizing lessons based on teacher inspiration after contact with parents and input from students ... I wish our ward was involved in this pilot
Buzzard Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 Which brings me to my second concern. As a youth Sunday School teacher I've found that even the 16/17 class members don't know the scriptures very well. Some stories they don't recognize at all yet! (Even those who go to Seminary.) I'm not sure that depriving them of another opportunity to go through the Scriptures in a systematic way is really a good thing.But I will do my best to accomplish what TPTB are going for.I was an early morning Seminary teacher long ago. Within a week, you could spot the kids whose families held home evenings. Because they knew the scriptures. If they don't get it at home, SS, YM/YW, and/or Seminary won't help much. If they get the foundation at home, those programs are just the icing on the cake.Of course, exceptions exist. We all know the upstanding members who came from inactive families, but most of them either had a great role model at church or were self-motivated. But as a rule, that stint as a Seminary teacher really opened my eyes as to what makes the difference in kids lives.
cinepro Posted June 17, 2012 Posted June 17, 2012 (edited) Which brings me to my second concern. As a youth Sunday School teacher I've found that even the 16/17 class members don't know the scriptures very well. Some stories they don't recognize at all yet! (Even those who go to Seminary.) I'm not sure that depriving them of another opportunity to go through the Scriptures in a systematic way is really a good thing.I've mentioned before that in my current position as a youth Sunday School teacher (17/18yo), I have been astounded by the lack of knowledge about the scriptures and Church history. If I ask a question about even the most basic subjects, I'm lucky if one or two students even have a guess.I think I've done a good job in starting to fill in those gaps, but it does make me wonder if the Church even cares if the members know the difference between Mosiah1 and Mosiah2 or that the Ammon in Mosiah 7 isn't the same guy that "chopped the arms off". I've taken great pains to make sure everyone in the class knows exactly what is going on in the Book of Mormon during the lessons, and the kids seem to really enjoy knowing this stuff. They are especially good at using the index now to answer questions like "How many Almas are in the Book of Mormon?"None of them knew anything about who the Mulekites or Jaredites were either (as far as knowing what time frame they appear in, and how they relate to the Lehites). So it's been fun to see them putting those pieces together too. Edited June 17, 2012 by cinepro
CV75 Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 Wow, this does sound like a much different focus. Customizing lessons based on teacher inspiration after contact with parents and input from students ... I wish our ward was involved in this pilotIt's great this got whatever extra push it needed -- I've been doing this for many years as I thought the preamble to the lesson manuals permitted this flxibility.
Bikeemikey Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 (edited) Part of the reason there is this failure to educate well, in my opinion, is that the calling of Sunday school president is one of the most under-performing callings in the church. In every ward I have been in the Sunday school presidency does nothing but track attendance, if they do that.I would be curious to know if Sunday school presidents in other wards are doing any training with teachers etc?Does it really take 3 priesthood holders set apart and called of god to track Sunday school attendance?Also with the wealth of amazing women teachers in the chrich why not make the Sunday school presidency a non gender specific calling? Edited June 18, 2012 by Bikeemikey
Matthew J. Tandy Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 But does it address Polygamy, Polygny, Adam-God, Moutnain Meadow Massacre, and other items of such importance to living a Christ like life today? ;-)In seriousness though, it sounds great! 1
rpn Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 (edited) Youth presidencies have long been supposed to determine the timing of the lessons based on their inspiration. It is part of their keys of presidency. And when they use those keys magnificent things happen withe the youth as one of our posters (Hamba Tuhan) described several years ago. Sounds like they are just making it clearer so the adults mess it up less, with this version. Edited June 18, 2012 by rpn
nutshell Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 Also with the wealth of amazing women teachers in the chrich why not make the Sunday school presidency a non gender specific calling?They tend to do a bang-up job in the Primary, why not the SS presidency?
blooit Posted June 18, 2012 Author Posted June 18, 2012 But does it address Polygamy, Polygny, Adam-God, Moutnain Meadow Massacre, and other items of such importance to living a Christ like life today? ;-)In seriousness though, it sounds great!Joking aside - the post I made before talked about how one of the emphases was dealing with areas of controversy - If I understand correctly - Yes - these issues will be dealt with to a greater degree than before.
David T Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 Quite interested in learning more of the specifics on this. Thanks for the report!
Duncan Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 I've mentioned before that in my current position as a youth Sunday School teacher (17/18yo), I have been astounded by the lack of knowledge about the scriptures and Church history. If I ask a question about even the most basic subjects, I'm lucky if one or two students even have a guess.I think I've done a good job in starting to fill in those gaps, but it does make me wonder if the Church even cares if the members know the difference between Mosiah1 and Mosiah2 or that the Ammon in Mosiah 7 isn't the same guy that "chopped the arms off". I've taken great pains to make sure everyone in the class knows exactly what is going on in the Book of Mormon during the lessons, and the kids seem to really enjoy knowing this stuff. They are especially good at using the index now to answer questions like "How many Almas are in the Book of Mormon?"None of them knew anything about who the Mulekites or Jaredites were either (as far as knowing what time frame they appear in, and how they relate to the Lehites). So it's been fun to see them putting those pieces together too.two Mosiah's? oh, man I have to read that part again!
Hamba Tuhan Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 And when they use those keys magnificent things happen withe the youth as one of our posters (Hamba Tuhan) described several years ago.I'm glad to know you actually read my now-missing posts, rpn!As a coincidence but also a follow up, we had stake general priesthood meeting last night, and two of the speakers were young men from our ward, both of them soon to leave on missions (one in August and one still awaiting his call). The second of them was our sole active deacon when I was called as YM presidenct seven years ago. In his talk, he spoke about how he saw his callings, first as deacons quorum president and then as teachers quorum president, as 'largely symbolic', a matter which he said he and I did not 'see eye-to-eye on'. Then he talked about how he actually started to realise how serious I was about his leadership whilst he was a teacher and the experiences he'd had reaching out to less-active members of his quorum.One of those formerly less-active members was the other young man on the stand with him. He hadn't been active his entire previous life, but he received his endowment the first of the month, and I was back in the temple with him this past Saturday morning. His younger brother is our current teachers quroum president, and his mum and dad are both now active again. His mum was in the temple with him for his endowment, and we're hoping his dad will have his recommend again before the son leaves on his mission.In the congregation was another of the young men brought back to activity by the efforts of our former TQP. Because of a stake mixup, he wasn't sustained to receive the Melchizedek Priesthood last night, but he should be sustained at stake conference in August. This young man was attending with his 30-something brother who, inactive since he was 14, received the Melchizedek Priesthood in February (along with both young men who spoke).This is some of what happens when we teach our youth to take their leadership callings seriously. 1
Scott Lloyd Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 (edited) Joking aside - the post I made before talked about how one of the emphases was dealing with areas of controversy - If I understand correctly - Yes - these issues will be dealt with to a greater degree than before.How deeply are they dealt with, and is there some flexibility allowed for local discretion? I'm all for inoculation and all that, but it occurs to me there may be varying levels of interest, need, desire to learn, etc. I would compare it to teaching kids about sex. Yes, they need to understand the whole thing eventually, but it seems wisest, rather than unfolding the entire panorama all at once, to do it a bit at a time according to age, maturity, need to know, ability to process, prerequisite knowledge, etc. I question whether someone who can't intelligently define the distinction between the four books of Nephi should be hit with Adam-God theory or blood atonement. Or to be given a chart of the different First Vision accounts when they haven't yet read Joseph Smith-History in the Pearl of Great Price. Edited June 18, 2012 by Scott Lloyd 1
David T Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 (edited) Or to be given a chart of the different First Vision accounts when they haven't yet read Joseph Smith-History in the Pearl of Great Price.I still would love, and enthusiastically sustain the directly-from-JS accounts being canonized. I don't see any thing that would be lost from doing so, and very much to gain. Edited June 18, 2012 by David T
Deborah Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 It's great this got whatever extra push it needed -- I've been doing this for many years as I thought the preamble to the lesson manuals permitted this flxibility.Ditto. When I taught youth that was my approach. We had great discussions.
Deborah Posted June 18, 2012 Posted June 18, 2012 Part of the reason there is this failure to educate well, in my opinion, is that the calling of Sunday school president is one of the most under-performing callings in the church.In every ward I have been in the Sunday school presidency does nothing but track attendance, if they do that.My son is SS President and we all moaned silently when he was called for the reasons you stated. But he really has magnified his calling and is very involved in the classes and often ends up subbing when teachers don't show up and don't get subs. Since he taught Seminary for years, it's not a challenge but he does a lot more than take attendance.
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