Hello From Seraphim32

[Seraphim32]

Peace and blessings to you all.

I am a mid twenties man from Idaho who grew up LDS and I have come to this site in hopes of finding a place where I can respectfully discuss Mormon history, ethics, and theology. I look forward to future dialogues.

I noticed that "sexual" topics are discouraged here. Would this include discussion about artificial contraception? I ask because I am looking to write a paper on the history of artificial contraception in the LDS faithm and would love to receive some insight on the topic.

thanks.

[Ares]

Welcome- please keep the discussion at a PG level (no graphic details) and it will be permitted. Thanks!

[boblloyd91]

Welcome! I'm pretty new here too. I really like the icon on your id, is it orthodox?

[Storm Rider]

Welcome! I'm pretty new here too. I really like the icon on your id, is it orthodox?

I had the same thought when I first saw it. Great choice and welcome.

[Seraphim32]

It is indeed. Eastern Christianity is very close to my heart.

[kolipoki09]

Peace and blessings to you all.

I am a mid twenties man from Idaho who grew up LDS and I have come to this site in hopes of finding a place where I can respectfully discuss Mormon history, ethics, and theology. I look forward to future dialogues.

I noticed that "sexual" topics are discouraged here. Would this include discussion about artificial contraception? I ask because I am looking to write a paper on the history of artificial contraception in the LDS faithm and would love to receive some insight on the topic.

thanks.

Well you're in luck. I happen to also be in my mid-twenties, from Idaho, with an avid interest in Mormon history, ethics, and theology.

Those interests have brought me here very often, though as of recently I haven't had much time for it. I graduate from BYU-Idaho in two weeks, then I'm headed off to grad school at Idaho State.

If you're Eastern Orthodox, do you by chance happen to know Greek? I'm still in the learning process, but with a good lexicon I can make my way through most of the New Testament without much difficulty. Accordance has been a lifesaver for me.

If you hang around long enough, you'll find that MDD offers a wide-variety of opinions and posters with unique backgrounds. There have been plenty of former Latter-day Saints and non-Mormons who have stuck around here for years. As long as you avoid politics and outright bashing Mormonism, you shouldn't have too much of a problem navigating your way around this place.

Once again, welcome to MDD.

[Seraphim32]

Well you're in luck. I happen to also be in my mid-twenties, from Idaho, with an avid interest in Mormon history, ethics, and theology.

Those interests have brought me here very often, though as of recently I haven't had much time for it. I graduate from BYU-Idaho in two weeks, then I'm headed off to grad school at Idaho State.

If you're Eastern Orthodox, do you by chance happen to know Greek? I'm still in the learning process, but with a good lexicon I can make my way through most of the New Testament without much difficulty. Accordance has been a lifesaver for me.

If you hang around long enough, you'll find that MDD offers a wide-variety of opinions and posters with unique backgrounds. There have been plenty of former Latter-day Saints and non-Mormons who have stuck around here for years. As long as you avoid politics and outright bashing Mormonism, you shouldn't have too much of a problem navigating your way around this place.

Once again, welcome to MDD.

Thank you for the welcome. I very much frown upon the bashing of other religions, except of the radical flavor (i.e. westboro baptist) and even then I do not bash them. I only feel sad for them.

I have no particular denomination at this time in my life. Through my studies I have been drawn most to the LDS faith and the Eastern Orthodox faith. If I end up anywhere it will likely be one of these two places.

I know a little Greek, but I have much yet to learn.

[Garden Girl]

Peace and blessings to you all.

I noticed that "sexual" topics are discouraged here. Would this include discussion about artificial contraception? I ask because I am looking to write a paper on the history of artificial contraception in the LDS faithm and would love to receive some insight on the topic.

thanks.

Interesting... what prompts you to choose this particular topic?

Welcome to the Board... lots of good people here, with good topics of discussion. The moderators do a good job of keeping discussions moving and civil...

from the beautiful central Oregon coast... GG

[Seraphim32]

Interesting... what prompts you to choose this particular topic?

Welcome to the Board... lots of good people here, with good topics of discussion. The moderators do a good job of keeping discussions moving and civil...

from the beautiful central Oregon coast... GG

It was sparked when I read Humana Vitae by Pope John Paul II, and then began conversing with a Roman Catholic professor. The RCC has a very well established philosophy for their position on why artificial contraception is forbidden. I have heard the LDS faith is neutral regarding this topic, and wanted to understand whether this was due to a developed philosophy, or not. In relation to this inquiry I am looking for a good argument that one could use to condone the use of artificial contraception while still seeing homosexual acts as wrong.

[Libs]

Hi Seraphim..welcome to the board!

I'm trying to understand what the use of artificial contraception has to do with "homosexual acts"..?

I, too, love your user pic! The Eastern Orthodox tradition is very interesting. Really quite different from the Western traditions.

[KevinG]

I am looking for a good argument that one could use to condone the use of artificial contraception while still seeing homosexual acts as wrong.

This is a non scholarly response but it may help guide your research. Look at sources for LDS belief on:

-The purpose of intimacy being 1) procreation and 2) strengthening the bonds of marriage.

-The definition of eternal marriage and the family unit as the basic unit of God's kingdom. (Marriage between a man and a woman unless polygyny is ordered by God for the purposes of building His kingdom on earth.)

-Teachings on the blessings of children coupled with not limiting our families as long as we can care for them reasonably.

All of these together help me understand the role of contraception as a tool to plan our families without restricting them unnecessarily.

[Nathair/|\]

It was sparked when I read Humana Vitae by Pope John Paul II, and then began conversing with a Roman Catholic professor. The RCC has a very well established philosophy for their position on why artificial contraception is forbidden. I have heard the LDS faith is neutral regarding this topic, and wanted to understand whether this was due to a developed philosophy, or not. In relation to this inquiry I am looking for a good argument that one could use to condone the use of artificial contraception while still seeing homosexual acts as wrong.

FWIW, in my opinion, it's because we don't have any revelation on it. At least I've never heard of any and you can take it as a general rule that the church doesn't stake out official positions without revelation.

[Stargazer]

FWIW, in my opinion, it's because we don't have any revelation on it. At least I've never heard of any and you can take it as a general rule that the church doesn't stake out official positions without revelation.

There is an official position on the subject, actually. The newest edition of Handbook 2 (used to be called Church Handbook of Instructions) is available online and is freely downloadable from the church website. In chapter or section labeled "21: Selected Church Policies and Guidelines" you will find the following:

21.4.4 Birth Control

It is the privilege of married couples who are able to bear children to provide mortal bodies for the spirit children of God, whom they are then

responsible to nurture and rear. The decision as to how many children to have and when to have them is extremely intimate and private and

should be left between the couple and the Lord. Church members should not judge one another in this matter.

Married couples should also understand that sexual relations within marriage are divinely approved not only for the purpose of procreation,

but also as a way of expressing love and strengthening emotional and spiritual bonds between husband and wife.

The exact form of contraception, if a couple chooses to use such, is not addressed, except for sterilization, which is strongly discouraged:

21.4.15 Surgical Sterilization (Including Vasectomy)

The Church strongly discourages surgical sterilization as an elective form of birth control. Surgical sterilization should be considered only

if (1) medical conditions seriously jeopardize life or health or (2) birth defects or serious trauma have rendered a person mentally incompetent

and not responsible for his or her actions. Such conditions must be determined by competent medical judgment and in accordance with law.

Even then, the persons responsible for this decision should consult with each other and with their bishop and should receive divine confirmation

of their decision through prayer.

[Seraphim32]

I'm trying to understand what the use of artificial contraception has to do with "homosexual acts"..?

Contraceptive sex is non-procreative. Homosexual sex is non-procreative. What I am seeking is the LDS argument/ justification for why non-procreative sex is condoned in heterosexual marriages, but not homosexual marriages in the LDS faith. It obviously doesn't stem from natural law philosophy or categorical imperative, so perhaps it is based on consequentialism?

[Seraphim32]

Contraceptive sex is non-procreative. Homosexual sex is non-procreative. What I am seeking is the LDS argument/ justification for why non-procreative sex is condoned in heterosexual marriages, but not homosexual marriages (which I realize don't exist) in the LDS faith. It obviously doesn't stem from natural law philosophy or categorical imperative, so perhaps it is based on consequentialism?

[thesometimesaint]

Seraphim32:

Welcome to the Glass Menagerie.

I'm 60 years old. The last 40 of them as a convert LDS. As you can tell I've been on this MB practically from its beginning.

[Calm]

Contraceptive sex is non-procreative. Homosexual sex is non-procreative. What I am seeking is the LDS argument/ justification for why non-procreative sex is condoned in heterosexual marriages, but not homosexual marriages in the LDS faith. It obviously doesn't stem from natural law philosophy or categorical imperative, so perhaps it is based on consequentialism?

As stated by others, this part of the handbook contains the justification for non procreative sex:

Married couples should also understand that sexual relations within marriage are divinely approved not only for the purpose of procreation, but also as a way of expressing love and strengthening emotional and spiritual bonds between husband and wife.

------

This limits sexual intimacy for whatever purpose to a husband and wife. The Church does not justify its position on homosexuality on anything save that not to actively engage in such behaviour has been defined as sinful by God, iow it is a commandment.

Edited December 10, 2011 by calmoriah