What doesn't "Mormon" mean?

[Guest Son of Zelph]

The following is a letter by Joseph Smith written in response to allegations that the word Mormon was derived from the greek term "mormo" which has negative connotations. Although I included the entire letter, the last few lines are where i'd like to focus the attention on.

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Editor of the Times and Seasons:

SIR:

[asciikerr]

    The error I speak of is the definition of the word "Mormon." It has been stated that this word was derived from the Greek word mormo. This is not the case. There was no Greek or Latin upon the plates from which I, through the grace of the Lord, translated the Book of Mormon. Let the language of the book speak for itself. ..

The name Lucifer is also in the BOM

How dare you have us searching around for the Greek Word Mormo...the Nerve, the inpudence, the inhuman way of having us exert effort in search of the reason behind this post. Is this what Mormo means!? I think this one may get overlooked "BIG TIME!" Who else is ready for the weekend?

In Greek mythology, Mormo was a goddess who bit bad children, said to have been a consort of the goddess Hecate.

The name was also used to signify a female vampire-like creature in stories told to Greek children by their nurses to keep them from misbehaving.

[tubaloth]

Just for others

[Guest Son of Zelph]

"Hence, with the addition of more, or the contraction, mor, we have the word MORMON; which means, literally, more good."

Last I checked, "more" is English. English More+Egyption Good (mon) =More good/Mormon.

[tubaloth]

Oh I see. Thanks for pointing that out. See if this helps.

The Prophet further says:

"We say, from the Saxon, good; from the Dane, god; the Goth, goda; the German, gut; the Dutch, goed; the Latin, bonus; the Greek, kalos; the Hebrew, tob, and the Egyptian, mon. Hence, with the addition of more, or the contraction, mor, we have the word Mormon, which means literally, more good."

Here we have the interesting information that the first part of the word is an abbreviation of the English adverb "more," and that the second part is the Egyptian adjective "mon." In other words, the Prophet found, on the plates, as a proper noun, a compound word meaning, literally, "better," and, under the influence of the Holy Spirit, he solved the problem of transliterating it, by translating the first part into English and copying the second part, and making of the two, one word, half English and half Egyptian. This, we admit, is an unusual literary procedure, but we have an instance of it in our Bible, where a place called Maaleh-acrabbim (Josh. 15:3) is also called "The Ascent of Akrabbim," (Num. 34:4.) Here half of the name is translated into English and the other half is a foreign word. See also Gen. 23:2 and 35:27, where Hebron is called, in the first passage, Kirjath-Arba, and in the second, "The City of Arbah," the first half of the name being translated into English and the second being left untranslated. This, then, is how the word Mormon originated.

And it means "more good"; that is "better."

The reference of the Prophet, in this connection, to the Bible would indicate that the good expressed in the word is the same as that which we call "good news," or "gospel," and that Mormon, therefore, means one who is the bearer of "good tidings."

It is probable that the mon in "Mormon" is akin to the mon or men in the Egyptian Amon or Amen. Dr. E. A. Wallis Budge, (The Gods of the Egyptians, Vol.. 2, p. 2) says that Amen is from a root men "to abide, to be permanent, eternal." Mon or men (the vowel is indifferent) would, then, mean "good" in the sense of permanency, just as nefer means "good" in the sense of physical beauty. We gather this from what Champollion (Precis du Systeme Hieroglyphique des Anciens Egyptiens, p. 91) on the authority of Eusebius says, viz., that the divinity which takes the name Amen and Kneph or Noub, alternatively, was by the Greeks called Agathodaimon, and that Nero, when assuming a divine title, called himself Neo-agathedaimon. Aga-thos is, of course, the Greek word for "good," and it must have been suggested by the Egyptian men or mon.

It is a very interesting fact that many American languages, perhaps most of them, form their comparatives and superlatives by the use of the adverbs "more" and "most." In the Aztec, "better" is ocahiqualli, which means, literally, "more good." In the Otomi language "better" is nra nho, which means "more good." In the Maya, the comparative is formed by affixing the last vowel of the adjective with an "l" added or by simply affixing the particle il. For instance, from Tibil, a "good thing," u tibil-il, a "better thing" is formed.2573

May we not ask, "What is the explanation of the singular fact that the Prophet Joseph seems to have had knowledge of how comparatives are formed in some of the principal American languages?"

(George Reynolds and Janne M. Sjodahl, Commentary on the Book of Mormon, edited and arranged by Philip C. Reynolds, 7 vols. [salt Lake City: Deseret Book Co., 1955-1961], 2: 326.)

[Guest Son of Zelph]

wow. I must say, apologetics is truly an art. I guess any confounded explanation is easier to accept for a Mormon than the simple truth.

[juliann]

wow. I must say, apologetics is truly an art. I guess any confounded explanation is easier to accept for a Mormon than the simple truth.

Silly. And it took you how many years to figure this out? I think we have been confused ever since we started putting vegetables in jello.

[kolobian]

I think we have been confused ever since we started putting vegetables in jello.

amen.

[Bill Hamblin]

My Dear Professor Peterson,

Some of these poor fellows don't seem to realize that Joseph Smith was joking; he was, in fact, teasing the anti-More-goods just like we do on occasion. Too bad they lacked emoticons in nineteenth century fonts. It would have made getting the joke a lot easier for the humor-impared anti-More-goods.

Your obedient servant

Professor Hamblin

[TrespassersW]

Dr. Hamblin,

Oh, I'm afraid you've missed the point entirely. There is no such thing as "humor" in Mormon history. There is no tongue-in-cheek. There is no irony, jest, or hyperbole of any sort. There were also never any misunderstandings or miscommunication of any sort. Every word ever penned by anyone not overtly hostile to the Mormons must be interpretted in the strictest sense possible. Mormons are not human, you see. They are brainwashed, child-abusing, conniving, self-aggrandizing dupes of the hive-mind in SLC. Their every motive is sinister. Their every action is ridiculous. Their every word is an effort to manipulate you, deceive you, and control you.

It is with this enlightened understanding of Mormons that we must approach the study of all things LDS.

Now, I must go. I'm overdue for a rendesvouz with the Danites. One of the wives from my secret harem has gone missing again...

[Matthew J. Tandy]

Hmm... just to point out a bit of missed trivia here, Joseph never said that was an inspired translation of the meaning of the name. No where does it appear that he asked God and He said "Yes Joseph, here is the breakdown:..." What does show is the common practice of Joseph during that time period to try and exercise his studies of Greek, Hebrew, Latin, German and Egyptian. He was working off of what he knew, and he defintely got it a bit better than trying to relate it to "mormo the kid biter"!

Joseph was using scholarly knowledge available to him. Today we have different views on what it means. Since no revelation was received on the matter, it will always be speculation since the language itself was lost.

In other news (not trying to derail the thread, but semi related) I was just reading in the paper today how Wal-Mart is going to be building a big store right near the pyramids near Mexico city right on a known archeological site!!! What makes this even worse is that all the anthropologists and archeologist are saying that the site belongs to a little known civilization whose name and culture is completely unknown.:-( Now, I am definetely not suggesting that the site belongs to Book of Mormon people, but I am alarmed that history of any kind is being destroyed before we know anything of it really. Very sad.:-(

I think I linked those two thoughts because of the unknown civilaztions thing.:-P

[A Random Catholic]

"We say, from the Saxon, good; from the Dane, god; the Goth, goda; the German, gut; the Dutch, goed; the Latin, bonus; the Greek, kalos; the Hebrew, tob, and the Egyptian, mon. Hence, with the addition of more, or the contraction, mor, we have the word Mormon, which means literally, more good."

Here we have the interesting information that the first part of the word is an abbreviation of the English adverb "more,"

I think that would be an

[Guest Son of Zelph]

Thank you random catholic for pointing out the absurdities of this particular lingustic tapdance.

[Bill Hamblin]

I'm afraid you've missed the point entirely. There is no such thing as "humor" in Mormon history. There is no tongue-in-cheek. There is no irony, jest, or hyperbole of any sort. There were also never any misunderstandings or miscommunication of any sort. Every word ever penned by anyone not overtly hostile to the Mormons must be interpretted in the strictest sense possible. Mormons are not human, you see. They are brainwashed, child-abusing, conniving, self-aggrandizing dupes of the hive-mind in SLC. Their every motive is sinister. Their every action is ridiculous. Their every word is an effort to manipulate you, deceive you, and control you.

Sorry, I slipped out the MORG mind-control nexus for a moment there. Not to fear; I have been successfully reintegrated.

[noel00]

Those "mormons" use to inhabited the area of the North Eastern USA,

http://www.audubon.org/bird/BoA/F44_G1a.html

It seems there were a group of "mormons" inhabiting that part of america - the New York Limited Theory

[Zeta-Flux]

Bill and Dan,

Why do you think Joseph was joking?

Thanks,

Zeta-Flux

[TrespassersW]

Random:

Can anyone think of other examples of abbreviations that make the root word only 25% shorter in written form and no shorter in spoken form?

I've often seen JUNE abbreviated JUN. Is that close enough?

[Drevan]

Blah blah blah, blah blah blah...anti mormon, blah blah blah blah blah, anti momron.

bout the only thing this thread is about.

[Guest Son of Zelph]

Bla bla bla, covering my eyes to keep the truth out. <sigh> and mormons wonder why they're considered a cult.

[John Russell]

This is the first time I have ever seen someone take that quote as a serious discourse on the derivation of the name Mormon. From the first time I read it, it was apparent to me that Joseph Smith was being facetious. He had a very keen sense of humor and loved to twit his critics on occasion -- this letter to the Times and Seasons is a classic twit.

[Drevan]

Bla bla bla, covering my eyes to keep the truth out. <sigh> and mormons wonder why they're considered a cult.

WHy waste my time trying to argue with the wall. That's about how intelligent and thought provoking your topics and your post are. I would accomplish more talking with the wall.