Lds Women Down 80%?

[jskains]

Note, I try not to take much the SLC Tribune says seriously when it comes to the Church since they hate us anyways... But....

According to some articles about recent changes to LDS singles wards here in Utah, the inactivity rate of LDS women between 18 to 30 is 80%?

Is that true?

JMS

[BCSpace]

Would that be single women 18-30? Do you have a link or a reference or a quote?

Having served in various wards and stakes in the USA, my anecdotal report is that the overall inactivity rate (by Sacrament meeting attendance) is usually around 50%. The percentage of those members who hold a current temple recommend is typically around one third.

[Mike Reed]

Note, I try not to take much the SLC Tribune says seriously when it comes to the Church since they hate us anyways... But....

According to some articles about recent changes to LDS singles wards here in Utah, the inactivity rate of LDS women between 18 to 30 is 80%?

Is that true?

JMS

No. It is not true. The SLT lied because they hate you.

I think they've tapped your phones too. Have you looked outside your window lately?

[krose]

No. It is not true. The SLT lied because they hate you.

Not only that, but they will cancel your subscription if they discover you are LDS. They don't want your Mormon money.

[Duncan]

I have seen that number before on a blog, IIRC someone asked Sister Elaine Dalton, then newly called to the YW General Presidency, how she was going to help YW stay active when 80% weren't active at the 18-30 age range-basically whatever you do statistically only 1/5 will stay active. Here it is,

http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/04/07/where-have-all-the-young-women-gone/

[Ceeboo]

No. It is not true. The SLT lied because they hate you.

I think they've tapped your phones too. Have you looked outside your window lately?

Peace,

Ceeboo

[Scott Lloyd]

I have seen that number before on a blog, IIRC someone asked Sister Elaine Dalton, then newly called to the YW General Presidency, how she was going to help YW stay active when 80% weren't active at the 18-30 age range-basically whatever you do statistically only 1/5 will stay active. Here it is,

http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/04/07/where-have-all-the-young-women-gone/

According to this link, the actual verbiage used was "as many as 80 percent" (emphasis mine).

The phrase "as many as" is an example of weasel words. What is meant by "as many as 80 percent"? It could be 80 percent, or it could be something less than that.

So in response to Mike Reed's and krose's sarcastic rejoinders, I would say at first glance, no, the interviewer/writer didn't lie per se, but perhaps did fall into the all-too-common journalistic pattern of vague sensationalism.

[Duncan]

According to this link, the actual verbiage used was "as many as 80 percent" (emphasis mine).

The phrase "as many as" is an example of weasel words. What is meant by "as many as 80 percent"? It could be 80 percent, or it could be something less than that.

So in response to Mike Reed's and krose's sarcastic rejoinders, I would say at first glance, no, the interviewer/writer didn't lie per se, but perhaps did fall into the all-too-common journalistic pattern of vague sensationalism.

That is interesting, thanks for the heads up!

[Scott Lloyd]

That is interesting, thanks for the heads up!

My pleasure.

We need to remember to look critically at critical claims.

[Duncan]

My pleasure.

We need to remember to look critically at critical claims.

this is true!

[Mike Reed]

The phrase "as many as" is an example of weasel words.... So in response to Mike Reed's and krose's sarcastic rejoinders, I would say at first glance, no, the interviewer/writer didn't lie per se, but perhaps did fall into the all-too-common journalistic pattern of vague sensationalism.

Vague sensationalism, as opposed to explicit sensationalism (ie. "Weasle words"). Should we consider your "perhaps" a weasle word too?

FWIW... you may also want to consider the following:

I'm not sure if this is the proper place to bring this up, but some have said that many weasels strongly object to the term "weasel words" as it presents their species in an unfavourable light based on false negative stereotypes and prejudice. There is a general Consensus among both the Mustelid Council of Europe (MCE) and North American Coalition for the Social Progress of Weasels, Ferrets and Ermines (NACSPWFE) that this term is outdated, inaccurate and unfair to weasels and their kin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Avoid_weasel_words

[BookofMormonLuvr]

I have seen that number before on a blog, IIRC someone asked Sister Elaine Dalton, then newly called to the YW General Presidency, how she was going to help YW stay active when 80% weren't active at the 18-30 age range-basically whatever you do statistically only 1/5 will stay active. Here it is,

http://bycommonconse...ung-women-gone/

I don't know that the article actually helped your case. It basically said to see the real numbers we have to look at natural born members and American converts. Since more then half the membership resides outside of the United States, I think taking their numbers into consideration is vital.

[Duncan]

I don't know that the article actually helped your case. It basically said to see the real numbers we have to look at natural born members and American converts. Since more then half the membership resides outside of the United States, I think taking their numbers into consideration is vital.

My case was that I have heard of that number before ala that blog post!

[jskains]

No. It is not true. The SLT lied because they hate you.

I think they've tapped your phones too. Have you looked outside your window lately?

Hmmm... And I keep wondering what drives me from taking you as a "critic" seriously.....

JMS

[Scott Lloyd]

Vague sensationalism, as opposed to explicit sensationalism (ie. "Weasle words").

I don't agree my application of the term weasel words in this instance is sensationalism of any sort. In fact, I'd call "as many as" a textbook example of the definition.

Did you catch the derivation in the Wikipedia link? Weasel words comes from the notion of a weasel sucking eggs. Weasel words are devoid of meaning, just as a sucked egg is devoid of content. "As many as 80 percent" — It sounds alarming upon first hearing, but what real meaning does it have? Ergo, vague sensationalism.

Should we consider your "perhaps" a weasle word too?

No.

FWIW... you may also want to consider the following:

I'm not sure if this is the proper place to bring this up, but some have said that many weasels strongly object to the term "weasel words" as it presents their species in an unfavourable light based on false negative stereotypes and prejudice. There is a general Consensus among both the Mustelid Council of Europe (MCE) and North American Coalition for the Social Progress of Weasels, Ferrets and Ermines (NACSPWFE) that this term is outdated, inaccurate and unfair to weasels and their kin.

Ah, the joys of political correctness.

[Scott Lloyd]

My case was that I have heard of that number before ala that blog post!

And thanks to Duncan's link, we learn the actual verbiage used: "as many as 80 percent of" as opposed to "80 percent of".

[bookofmormontruth]

Does 80% strengthen or reignite your former testimonies? Or does it just strengthen your testimony out of the Church?

If the former, let's stick with the 80% figure so when can we expect you all back?

In all seriousness, why are ex-Mormons, apostates and the likes so fixated on inactivity rates? I don't know, maybe it is the same feeling when faithful members see conversion rates every 6 months, it is a nice feeling, but really doesn't affect my testimony one way or the other. Maybe in contrast it just helps reconfirm your poor and wrong decision?

[BookofMormonLuvr]

Does 80% strengthen or reignite your former testimonies? Or does it just strengthen your testimony out of the Church?

If the former, let's stick with the 80% figure so when can we expect you all back?

In all seriousness, why are ex-Mormons, apostates and the likes so fixated on inactivity rates? I don't know, maybe it is the same feeling when faithful members see conversion rates every 6 months, it is a nice feeling, but really doesn't affect my testimony one way or the other. Maybe in contrast it just helps reconfirm your poor and wrong decision?

Ooo, which one am I?

I think its mostly to show a kink in the "fastest growing church in the world" "Daniel's rock filling the earth" claims of veracity. And, perhaps, to show that it is not a small offended group becoming disaffected, but a rather large chunk of membership.

[elguanteloko]

In all seriousness, why are ex-Mormons, apostates and the likes so fixated on inactivity rates? I don't know, maybe it is the same feeling when faithful members see conversion rates every 6 months, it is a nice feeling, but really doesn't affect my testimony one way or the other. Maybe in contrast it just helps reconfirm your poor and wrong decision?

Don't you feel kind of... you know, inaccurate when you make such ludicrous generalization? It's fine if you don't but next time you see it done against a group you hold dear to don't complain.

[elguanteloko]

Ooo, which one am I?

I think its mostly to show a kink in the "fastest growing church in the world" "Daniel's rock filling the earth" claims of veracity. And, perhaps, to show that it is not a small offended group becoming disaffected, but a rather large chunk of membership.

The non-Mormon group is growing faster, though. It should be kind of hard for us non(or ex)-Mormons to see your Church as a threat when we look at the numbers.

[Scott Lloyd]

The non-Mormon group is growing faster, though. It should be kind of hard for us non(or ex)-Mormons to see your Church as a threat when we look at the numbers.

Why should you see the Church of Jesus Christ as "a threat" in any case? What are you afraid of?

[Bernard Gui]

The non-Mormon group is growing faster, though. It should be kind of hard for us non(or ex)-Mormons to see your Church as a threat when we look at the numbers.

The scriptures clearly describe the Church as small in number but spread throughout the world. That is exactly what is happening. So, what's the problem?

Bernard

[elguanteloko]

Why should you see the Church of Jesus Christ as "a threat" in any case? What are you afraid of?

I wouldn't. Read the comment I responded to.

[elguanteloko]

The scriptures clearly describe the Church as small in number but spread throughout the world. That is exactly what is happening. So, what's the problem?

Bernard

There isn't one. That was my point.

[BookofMormonLuvr]

The non-Mormon group is growing faster, though. It should be kind of hard for us non(or ex)-Mormons to see your Church as a threat when we look at the numbers.

Yeah, I thought I wouldn't ever have to address this again, but I guess not...

I am a former member of the LDS Church who is now in the Restorationist RLDS Movement (not to be confused with Community of Christ). My multitude of posts and the links in my sig line should have made that clear.