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Something Repulsive


Daniel Peterson

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Well, it's different, but not very much different from the fact that the scriptures attribute natural disasters to God's hand/punishment and that we LDS view these attributions as object lessons and the fulfillment of prophecies. In addition, we LDS often speak of the opportunity personal disasters present for conversion; the person is now humble and ready to accept the gospel or be reactivated etc.

So I find it inconsistent in general that we should be repulsed by anyone speaking about natural disasters as possibly being a warning or a punishment or that one's suffering can lead to Christ.

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Well, it's different, but not very much different from the fact that the scriptures attribute natural disasters to God's hand/punishment and that we LDS view these attributions as object lessons and the fulfillment of prophecies. In addition, we LDS often speak of the opportunity personal disasters present for conversion; the person is now humble and ready to accept the gospel or be reactivated etc.

So I find it inconsistent in general that we should be repulsed by anyone speaking about natural disasters as possibly being a warning or a punishment or that one's suffering can lead to Christ.

What's even more incredible is that I find myself agreeing with the gist of what BCSpace is saying. It raises an even more interesting question - this girl is convinced that she has had her prayer answered; how can we be certain that she is wrong, any more than we are certain that we are right when our prayers are answered?

It should go without saying, the whole notion of asking God to cause earthquakes makes me queezy, and rejoicing in the destruction is sickening, so if this discussion degrades, I will bow out.

H.

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Even though I can understand what she is saying, it's hard not to look like a a heartless idiot when being thankfull that other people are suffering, regardless of what blessings may come of it.

If SHE was the one who was suffering from the earthquake, her words would not sound so bad. Being thankful when trials happen to other people is hard to pull off with any kind of compassion.

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It's nice to pray for Atheists, but being happy about the Earthquake makes me want to smack her one.

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But...if this is to be taken seriously, why Japan? Why not sink California (can you imagine the utter social chaos unleashed if this had hit Long Beach and Los Angelas?) or hit Iran with an iron-nickle meteorite?

Why not inundate Cuba or North Korea? Why not China?

The point is, from our human perspective, we have (without direct revelation) not the slightest idea what such disasters mean or are intended to convey, from God's perspective. We are called to suffer with those who suffer, and mourn with those that mourn, and that is as far as we can go theologically under such conditions.

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Furthermore, this woman does not have the gift of the Holy Ghost and has no authority whereby she can possibly make such claims independent of legitimate Priesthood authorization for such statements (which she has no access to lest she repents and is baptized for the remission of sins by one having such authority, receives the Holy Ghost and embarks upon the life process of endurance to the end).

I've noticed this kind of, what I would call "spiritual presumption" in evangelical protestants both from a distance and up close for many, many years, and it leaves a strange and unpalatable taste in my mouth, no matter how many times I encounter it.

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Turns out she's just an athiest troll.

Now that's a little repulsive.

I have a much easier time understanding sincere people who say stupid things than i do deceptive people who just say things to cause contention.

Is the world too peaceful for these people? Not enough anger? Not enough distrust and need to spread a little bit more? :P

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Turns out she's just an athiest troll.

Really...well, then *I* pray that her first video goes viral, and her recant is never found, and she suffers the fate of an internet fool who shows her face and says moronic things and is refused employment and education opportunities.

That's my prayer.

H.

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... Is the world too peaceful for these people? Not enough anger? Not enough distrust and need to spread a little bit more? :P

Whether the intent is to foment anger or distrust, it's beyond dispute that such people do think there's too much belief in the world in what they would call ridiculous things.

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As someone who spent four hours on a tsunami "watch"... then a "warning"... and finally being evacuated for three more hours, I cannot imagine after viewing the terrible devastation that anyone could feel gladness in such an event, no matter how misguided or wrong in their thinking. I live 1/2 block to the beach.

I sat up and watched the local news and finally the fire dept drove up and down my street with sirens and whistles whooping, the loudspeaker blaring it was time to evacuate. I grabbed Bob, my cat, put him in his carrier... (I had already put my 72-hr kit and other supplies in my van) and so off I went to higher ground. I chose to go up the highway a couple miles to a resort called Salishan that sits up in the hills overlooking the Bay/ocean. As I rounded the curve here were fire trucks with the crews out directing cars into the parking lot to wait it out. I felt safe, and a commaraderie with the other people as we waited. Finally after a couple hours when it was determined that the waves were not a threat I was able to return home but told not to go onto the beach for several more hours.

As I've watched the subsequent news films of Japan, my heart has gone out to those people. The mind can hardly take in that type of devestation. There is a dangerous fault zone off of the Oregon coast, and it's not a matter of "if" we have a similar occurence, but "when." The last big quake on the fault was 300 years ago... We are due any time. Our warning systems worked great for the tsunami... but there is no preparation for an earthquake...

from the beach... safe and sound... GG

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Perhaps what I see here is an anomaly....how can a disaster be what one prayed for? First of all, we live on an unstable planet that is prone to earthquakes and tsunamis, hurricanes, tornadoes, and all kinds of weather phenomena.

Did anyone wish harm upon Japan? If so, why? And why is the mess there an answer to prayer? HOW?

I'm sorry, but I sure do not remember asking God to mess up Japan. Did I miss something?

Blessings,

Blossom

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Glenn Beck seems to say the earthquake in Japan could be a message from God. Plate tectonics had nothing to do with it. Pat Robertson said Katrina was some punishment from God. Did the people in Chile and Christchurch deserve their fate? Why did God create a planet with such an unstable area? If he created (from prexisting material) the earth surly he would have got some ideas from his Father about planet construction.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/14/glenn-beck-japan-earthquake-god_n_835573.html

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For the non-believing such events like this, usually galvanize their thinking that God is unjust in allowing such suffering. Then a video like this makes the person making it become such a stumbling block to the same individuals whom they seek to reach from ever wanting to be a Christian. If one Mormon made such a video, it would launch a 1,000 threads in an attempt to taint all Mormons. I would like to thank you for posting it, but my heart is broken for this young lady. But the truth of such things is a reminder of why many of us have rejected things like this and embraced the truth of the Latter-day gospel.

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Well, it's different, but not very much different from the fact that the scriptures attribute natural disasters to God's hand/punishment and that we LDS view these attributions as object lessons and the fulfillment of prophecies. In addition, we LDS often speak of the opportunity personal disasters present for conversion; the person is now humble and ready to accept the gospel or be reactivated etc.

So I find it inconsistent in general that we should be repulsed by anyone speaking about natural disasters as possibly being a warning or a punishment or that one's suffering can lead to Christ.

What's even more incredible is that I find myself agreeing with the gist of what BCSpace is saying. It raises an even more interesting question - this girl is convinced that she has had her prayer answered; how can we be certain that she is wrong, any more than we are certain that we are right when our prayers are answered?

It should go without saying, the whole notion of asking God to cause earthquakes makes me queezy, and rejoicing in the destruction is sickening, so if this discussion degrades, I will bow out.

Does reading the scriptures then, make you queasy? For example Helaman 10:6, 11:1-11.

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Does reading the scriptures then, make you queasy? For example Helaman 10:6, 11:1-11.

Intuitively, there is something different about watching someone give thanks for widespread death and destruction that occurs in my lifetime, and reading a 1500-year-old story that may or may not have occurred to a people that may or may not have existed.

H.

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Glenn Beck seems to say the earthquake in Japan could be a message from God. Plate tectonics had nothing to do with it. Pat Robertson said Katrina was some punishment from God. Did the people in Chile and Christchurch deserve their fate? Why did God create a planet with such an unstable area? If he created (from prexisting material) the earth surly he would have got some ideas from his Father about planet construction.

Thank you, Noel-eeeewww. Evidently you and the video maker are kindred spirits: both of you are eagerly exploiting the suffering and death of others to score cheap polemical points against your ideological targets.

While you're jeering at your snide misrepresentations of LDS theology, I suggest you keep in mind the old adage: "People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones." How does your creedal theology explain earthquakes?

Isn't it true that, according to your theology, God, being "sovereign," directly causes everything that happens?

Isn't it true that, according to your theology, God saw the latest earthquake before anything was even created? That, in fact, that earthquake has been continuously before Him forever?

Isn't it true that, according to your theology, God created each individual in a conscious, rational, free act of creation?

Doesn't that mean that, according to your theology, God intentionally created each person who died in the earthquake and tsunami so that they could be a casualty of that disaster?

And doesn't it further mean that God caused the earthquake and tsunami to occur explicitly to kill those individuals and cause the suffering that is still going on?

And before you get indignant about my post, Noel-eeeewww, just remember: you opened this door. Are you happy with where it leads?

Regards,

Pahoran

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