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GOD or GODS


alofano

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Hello Brothers and Sisters,

It came to mind in one of the missionaires talks that LDS has many GODS and we, if worthly, may become one. It sounded interesting to me as I WANT TO BE A GOD ! However, after reading Isaiah 43:10 : "Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me", I'm confused. Can anyone here enlighten me ? I thank you for your responses in advance and may GBU.

NB.: second post as I do not know what happened to the first.

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Hello Brothers and Sisters,

It came to mind in one of the missionaires talks that LDS has many GODS and we, if worthly, may become one. It sounded interesting to me as I WANT TO BE A GOD ! However, after reading Isaiah 43:10 : "Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me", I'm confused. Can anyone here enlighten me ? I thank you for your responses in advance and may GBU.

NB.: second post as I do not know what happened to the first.

Ask your self this, "How can there be man Gods/gods inlight of that passage in Isiah"?

It is a serious question and if you do answer it you might learn something.

The answer is not "there is only one God/god". So be prepared to think outside the box here.

Is is another thread were this was recently discussed.

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Ask your self this, "How can there be man Gods/gods inlight of that passage in Isiah"?

It is a serious question and if you do answer it you might learn something.

The answer is not "there is only one God/god". So be prepared to think outside the box here.

Hello and thanks for your reply. Can you please explain in details what you mean by "So be prepared to think outside the box here". Would you be kind enough to please spell it out for me as english is not my main language.

PLUS, what was meant by ... Isaiah wasn't a monotheist ?

Thanks again and please excuse my ingorance in the subject.

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Isaiah wasn't a monotheist.

Or, if it helps any, I reckon you don't have to take the angry exilic rants of second Isaiah as being authoritative over the sum of all other (monolatrist) prophet writings.

Sometimes it's easier to overlook a verse instead of having to overlook several prophets.

Edit:

PLUS, what was meant by ... Isaiah wasn't a monotheist ?

That he wasn't a monotheist. Whoever penned second Isaiah seemed to want to make the gods that all previous prophets acknowledged suddenly disappear, but as history shows, he didn't succeed in that attempt right away as the popular folk religion (that some redactors tried to erase from the Bible) continued on for some time.

At least that’s this feller’s uneducated opinion.

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It came to mind in one of the missionaires talks that LDS has many GODS and we, if worthly, may become one. It sounded interesting to me as I WANT TO BE A GOD ! However, after reading Isaiah 43:10 : "Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me", I'm confused. Can anyone here enlighten me ?

The context of the Isaiah set is that there are no other Gods created for the Hebrews to worship as this is all directed at their worship of idols. And the Bible clearly also teaches the deification of man which shows how other Gods are made. For example:

Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Philippians 2:5-6

Christ thought it. We should think it too.

To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.

Revelation 3:21

We will have the same power and authority as God.

For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ: Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to esubdue all things unto himself.

Philippians 3:20-21

We will have the same body as God.

etc.etc.

The scriptures even speak of our divine potential in the Psalms 82:6/John 10:34-36 set. That we are gods does not mean "human judges", but real and divine Gods else the comparison in John 10 doesn't work.

To top it all off, the proper interpretation of the Isaiah 40-45 set I orginally spoke of is validated in the NT wherein we see that while there are many real and divine Gods, we need only concern ourselves with one...

As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one. For though there be that are called gods, whether in heaven or in earth, (as there be gods many, and lords many,) But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are dall things, and we by him

1 Corinthians 8:4-6

Notice also the separation of Jesus Christ from the Father here (subordinationism). They are both Gods, but it is the Father who is our God. Hebrews 1 also clearly distinuguishes the Being of the Father from the Being of the Son. And even Jesus Christ, who is a God (Jehovah) has said that he himself has a God...

Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

John 20:17

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Deut. 10:17 For the Lord your God is God of gods, and Lord of lords, a great God, a mighty, and a terrible, which regardeth not persons, nor taketh reward:

Josh. 22:22 The Lord God of gods, the Lord God of gods, he knoweth, and Israel he shall know; if it be in rebellion, or if in transgression against the Lord, (save us not this day,)

Ps. 136:2 O give thanks unto the God of gods: for his mercy endureth for ever.

Dan. 2:47 The king answered unto Daniel, and said, Of a truth it is, that your God is a God of gods, and a Lord of kings, and a revealer of secrets, seeing thou couldest reveal this secret.

Dan. 11:36 And the king shall do according to his will; and he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god, and shall speak marvellous things against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the indignation be accomplished: for that that is determined shall be done.

Is God a God of false gods?

Or is He a God of true gods?

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Hello and thanks for your reply. Can you please explain in details what you mean by "So be prepared to think outside the box here". Would you be kind enough to please spell it out for me as english is not my main language.

PLUS, what was meant by ... Isaiah wasn't a monotheist ?

Thanks again and please excuse my ingorance in the subject.

Be prepared to think out side of what looks like the obvious or first thought.

Also Iasiah didn't beleive in just one God. That is waht monothesism means. Belief in one God and a belief that only one God/god exsists.

I posted a link to another thread that hashed all of this out.

Here it is again.

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Is God a God of false gods?

Or is He a God of true gods?

That is the relevant question to ask.

If God is God of false gods that makes no sense. Why say it if He is. And the logical conclusion is that God must be false to if he is God of false Gods.

If on the other hand He is God of true gods, that has some serious implications that go against the Isiah proof text. It also supports the LDS interpretaion of 1Cor 8:4-6

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Hello Brothers and Sisters,

It came to mind in one of the missionaires talks that LDS has many GODS and we, if worthly, may become one. It sounded interesting to me as I WANT TO BE A GOD ! However, after reading Isaiah 43:10 : "Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me", I'm confused. Can anyone here enlighten me ? I thank you for your responses in advance and may GBU.

NB.: second post as I do not know what happened to the first.

I would like to thank everyone who has replied in good faith. It is always good to chat with good hearted people. Thank you for making me understand the issue a little better.

It is not in my nature to do this but I will take exception ... too bad there is always a rotten apple in the bushel. Nackhadlow, one word of advice ... think, ponder and hold your tongue before replying nonsense, even on internet. If you are a member you should listen to consule and if you are not gbu.

Love, Andy

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Hello Brothers and Sisters,

It came to mind in one of the missionaires talks that LDS has many GODS and we, if worthly, may become one. It sounded interesting to me as I WANT TO BE A GOD ! However, after reading Isaiah 43:10 : "Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me", I'm confused. Can anyone here enlighten me ? I thank you for your responses in advance and may GBU.

NB.: second post as I do not know what happened to the first.

I discuss Isaiah and monotheism on my blog here. Feel free to post any comments.

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Hello and thanks for your reply. Can you please explain in details what you mean by "So be prepared to think outside the box here". Would you be kind enough to please spell it out for me as english is not my main language.

PLUS, what was meant by ... Isaiah wasn't a monotheist ?

Thanks again and please excuse my ingorance in the subject.

It would be helpfull for yourself to maybe indulge into extensive research of the "BIBLE" and check out the "rest of the story". We do not by any means make the claim to ever be separated or independant of "GOD" in any manner; there is one God and only one God above all spirits, worlds,creation, e;t;c....In the bible Jesus said himself that we "are Gods". The bible also tells us we can become "one" with him as he and his son are "one".

Jesus prayer to his father.. That they may become one as; as thou, father are in me, and i in thee, that "they" ALSO may be one in us. e;t;c.... And the glory that thou gavest me I have given them; there is sssooo much more than i have the time or the patience to write at this time, but anyway the holy bible has all one needs to understand fully and to accept the very realities of this knowledge we as l.d.s know to be true; sure it is a very complex issue that canott be perfectly explained in an email or message, it requires study research and prayer, but its all there for the asking. :P

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I apologize if I misspoke. In the last couple of days, there's been SEVERAL new threads created in a shot-gun manner covering many subjects that are currently being discussed, and are located in the archives. The authors of those posts have shown they don't have a desire to learn, but just to heckle. Your opening post was very similar to many of those ("I happened to come across in my innocent search for truth that the Mormons teach [inset doctrine here], but in this verse the Bible contradicts it!!!!), and my remark was a commentary on this situation.

I also noticed that from other posts, you say you've been investigating the Church since 1997. And you also earlier made this shotgun post:

My question is ... where was the SPIRIT when Mark Hoffman duked the Presidancy ?

My question is ... where was the SPIRIT when LDS scam artists of the church fool other faithfull members ?

My question is ... why do LDS shy anyway from tough questions and play the "pretend I didn’t hear you" game ?

My question is ... why are there so many wolves among the floke ?

My question is ... why do Bishop and High priests turn a blind eyes to wolves members ?

My question is ... what was "that" I felt on that Nov. 1997 ?

My concern is that ... this Church is of "God" is what is claimed or this Church is of the Devil !

My concern is that I am scared to be with and without "this" Church !

My question is ... why would the"TRUE" Church of God scare me !

Again, maybe your intentions are pure, and maybe they're not. Either way, name-calling isn't appropriate, and I apologize.

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I discuss Isaiah and monotheism on my blog here. Feel free to post any comments.

alofano,

I would definitely take the opportunity to ask Maklelan questions about ancient Israelite beliefs/practices if you have any (and if you don't have any... make up some questions :P ).

You'd be hard-pressed to find someone more knowledgeable in this neck of the woods in regards to this topic (at least that's currently posting).

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IMHO: God will always be our God (the Father), so we wont have other Gods, even though we will be gods too... probably to somenbody else. Like Jesus said, he is doing ONLY what he saw Fther do...

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Another aspect of this topic that may interest some is the fact that many biblical scholars believe Yahweh and El were originally conceived of as two separate deities. Yahweh was considered one of the sons of El. I discuss that here, but if you want a more general look, I recommend Mark Smith's Origins of Biblical Monotheism or John Day's Yahweh And the Gods And Goddesses of Canaan.

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