"faith Of Our Fathers"

[consiglieri]

This thread is in juxtaposition to that dealing with "Amazing Grace."

Unlike "Amazing Grace," which is not in the LDS hymnal, "Faith of Our Fathers" did make the cut.

I have long been surprised by its presence, inasmuch as it teaches being true to a faith simply because it was endorsed by one's ancestors.

I can't sing it without being reminded of Joseph Smith's comment that the traditions (read "faith") of the fathers are the very chains and shackles and fetters of hell.

So I propose a straight across trade--Let's put "Amazing Grace" where "Faith of Our Fathers" is currently.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[Lightbearer]

This thread is in juxtaposition to that dealing with "Amazing Grace."

Unlike "Amazing Grace," which is not in the LDS hymnal, "Faith of Our Fathers" did make the cut.

I have long been surprised by its presence, inasmuch as it teaches being true to a faith simply because it was endorsed by one's ancestors.

I can't sing it without being reminded of Joseph Smith's comment that the traditions (read "faith") of the fathers are the very chains and shackles and fetters of hell.

So I propose a straight across trade--Let's put "Amazing Grace" where "Faith of Our Fathers" is currently.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

I guess it is all in how you look at it. Since I was born into the Church to convert parents, I can relate to that song very well. It is the "faith of our fathers" not "faith of the fathers." Following the "foolish traditions" of their fathers such as the decendants of Laman and Lemuel is quite different from Nephi following the faith of his father Lehi. When I sing that hymn I think more along the lines of "turning the hearts of the children to their fathers" those that had in this life or through proxy will have the faith of the restoration of the Gospel, instead of inheriting the lies of some of the apostate "Christian fathers" which were not correct.

[Garden Girl]

Hi consiglieri...

I have the same thought as Lightbearer... I got out the hymnal and read the verses, and it reminds me of having the same strong faith in the principles of the restoration... "through the truth that comes from God"...

But I vote for adding Amazing Grace anyway...

The Garden Girl

[LifeOnaPlate]

This thread is in juxtaposition to that dealing with "Amazing Grace."

Unlike "Amazing Grace," which is not in the LDS hymnal, "Faith of Our Fathers" did make the cut.

I have long been surprised by its presence, inasmuch as it teaches being true to a faith simply because it was endorsed by one's ancestors.

I can't sing it without being reminded of Joseph Smith's comment that the traditions (read "faith") of the fathers are the very chains and shackles and fetters of hell.

So I propose a straight across trade--Let's put "Amazing Grace" where "Faith of Our Fathers" is currently.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

First, I like "Faith of Our Fathers" better than Amazing Grace.

Second, my father was LDS. He is the first to teach me the gospel, so I see no trouble in having a father in the gospel.

Is there anything doctrinally unsound in the song lyrics? For some reason the LDS.org page of hymns isn't loading for me; does anyone know what scriptural references are listed on that hymn page?

[consiglieri]

First, I like "Faith of Our Fathers" better than Amazing Grace.

Second, my father was LDS. He is the first to teach me the gospel, so I see no trouble in having a father in the gospel.

Is there anything doctrinally unsound in the song lyrics?

In my humble opinion, yes.

It teaches that the sine qua non for determining religious beliefs is to look to those espoused by our fathers.

I see this as not only doctrinally unsound, but the lyrics of hell set to music . . . and made famous by Bing Crosby.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[Garden Girl]

LOaP... the scriptural references listed on the page are:

1 Tim 6:12

Jude 1:3

Garden Girl

[consiglieri]

LOaP... the scriptural references listed on the page are:

1 Tim 6:12

Jude 1:3

Garden Girl

I think that, in the interest of fairness, an additional scriptural reference should be made to D&C 123:7-10.

D&C 123: 7 It is an imperative duty that we owe to God, to angels, with whom we shall be brought to stand, and also to ourselves, to our wives and children, who have been made to bow down with grief, sorrow, and care, under the most damning hand of murder, tyranny, and oppression, supported and urged on and upheld by the influence of that spirit which hath so strongly riveted the creeds of the fathers, who have inherited lies, upon the hearts of the children, and filled the world with confusion, and has been growing stronger and stronger, and is now the very mainspring of all corruption, and the whole earth groans under the weight of its iniquity.

8 It is an iron yoke, it is a strong band; they are the very handcuffs, and chains, and shackles, and fetters of hell.

9 Therefore it is an imperative duty that we owe, not only to our own wives and children, but to the widows and fatherless, whose husbands and fathers have been murdered under its iron hand;

10 Which dark and blackening deeds are enough to make hell itself shudder, and to stand aghast and pale, and the hands of the very devil to tremble and palsy.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

[Doctor Steuss]

I want Rock Lobster added to the hymnal.

[bluebell]

But if the word 'faith' in the hymn means faith in Christ-then it is not doctrinally unsound.

Plus, the D&C reference speaks of the evils of the 'creeds' of the fathers-which does not automatically translate to 'faith' of the fathers if one is using faith in a biblical sense and not, like we do in this age, to refer to a particular denomination of Christianity.

[consiglieri]

But if the word 'faith' in the hymn means faith in Christ-then it is not doctrinally unsound.

Plus, the D&C reference speaks of the evils of the 'creeds' of the fathers-which does not automatically translate to 'faith' of the fathers if one is using faith in a biblical sense and not, like we do in this age, to refer to a particular denomination of Christianity.

I do not necessarily disagree with your reasoning, bluebell.

It seems to me that, using that reasoning, we should not jettison "Faith of Our Fathers" from the hymnal for the same reason we should not object to the inclusion of "Amazing Grace."

What do you think?

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

I want Rock Lobster added to the hymnal.

Is that a dish?

The hymnal is not a menu, you know.

[bluebell]

I do not necessarily disagree with your reasoning, bluebell.

It seems to me that, using that reasoning, we should not jettison "Faith of Our Fathers" from the hymnal for the same reason we should not object to the inclusion of "Amazing Grace."

What do you think?

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

I'm not very fond of amazing grace though i think it can be described as 'great' because of the impact it has had on Christianity-

however, i really don't care if it's in the hymnbook or not. If some day it shows up, then i'll bear singing it like i do so many other hymns that i don't personally like but that i sing often in church.

[Lightbearer]

I do not necessarily disagree with your reasoning, bluebell.

It seems to me that, using that reasoning, we should not jettison "Faith of Our Fathers" from the hymnal for the same reason we should not object to the inclusion of "Amazing Grace."

What do you think?

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

Is that a dish?

The hymnal is not a menu, you know.

If the First Presidency were to approve "Amazing Grace" that would be fine with me. As for "Rock Lobster" it has been played at many singles dances I have attended in my single days. Maybe they could even include another dance favorite like "Shout"?

[Bill “Papa” Lee]

This thread is in juxtaposition to that dealing with "Amazing Grace."

Unlike "Amazing Grace," which is not in the LDS hymnal, "Faith of Our Fathers" did make the cut.

I have long been surprised by its presence, inasmuch as it teaches being true to a faith simply because it was endorsed by one's ancestors.

I can't sing it without being reminded of Joseph Smith's comment that the traditions (read "faith") of the fathers are the very chains and shackles and fetters of hell.

So I propose a straight across trade--Let's put "Amazing Grace" where "Faith of Our Fathers" is currently.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

I would imagine that it refers (not when wriiten, but as we see it) The early "fathers" (Apostles) in the original Church.

Pa Pa

[Drewm777]

It depends on how you define "fathers." If by fathers we mean Adam, Noah, Melchezedek, Israel, Lehi, etc then that's great. If it means Laman, Lamuel, Cain, that's a different story