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Posts posted by TAO_2

  1. 9 hours ago, Calm said:

    Sticking one’s nose into others’ business out of curiosity is not a perq of being a Bishop.

    True.  However, I'm not so sure that it's outside of a Bishop's jurisdiction to ask questions that are of a spiritual nature so to say.

    Mmm... okay, this is a pretty lame example I'm using but... as an example, the temple interview questions don't ask you about if your pray or read your scriptures.   But I don't think that those would be out of bounds for a bishop to ask about, so to say, maybe even if he wasn't prompted to.  Those things are just part of being a bishop and all the things he can ask about aren't necessarily written down.

    On the other hand, there are definitely issues a bishop should stay out of, and the church has had to make some of those pretty clear (such as how married couples deal with sex).  So there are certainly limits to it.

  2. On 8/13/2021 at 5:27 PM, Fether said:

    Had a somewhat heated discussion today with some friends. Someone said “If it isn’t part of the temple recommend questions, we don’t need to follow it”. I argued that there are plenty of principles of the gospel that someone can slide by on and still go to the temple.

    As a personal example, I shared that I don’t think I’ve kept the Sabbath day holy since I got home from my mission five years ago. on Sundays, I’ll often watch about 30 minutes or so of youtube in the morning, and on rare occasion I’ll even play an hour or so of video games. My wife is out of town so I will definitely be playing video games this Sunday. I also tend to have my thoughts focused on work since I am a bit of a workaholic. If I share this with the bishop (which I plan to in a few months when I renew my recommend), I guarantee you he will say “wow bro fether, you are so cool for worrying about this. Because you are so cool, I’ll give you a recommend”. After which I will go the next 2 years without truly keeping the sabbath day holy. 

    My question is not “am I worthy?” my question is this. Should Bishops be more strict on who goes to the temple, or should they continue to give the leeway they are often known for giving?

    I think your right somewhat, but in a sense, it isn't fully the Bishop's job to check for other things unless he feels prompted to (or just wants to really, I guess).

    The temple recommend questions are the Lord's designated interview for the temple.  However, the purpose of this life is to grow to be a being more and more like the Savior.  In that sense the temple is not just a goal, but a waypoint that we pass through on the way to an even more important goal.  There's more we need to do to receive eternal life.  And it's not meet for us to be commanded in all things (I feel a bit hypocritical saying this because I'm sure a stubborn person that the Lord has to command more than he probably should need to).  So just because it isn't listed, doesn't necessarily mean we should do something.

    On the other hand, a lot of these things more personal matters are mainly dictated by personal revelation and communicating with God.  For example, as you mentioned, for one person, God might tell them that playing games on Sunday isn't wise.  For other people, he may say that it's alright.  I think the important thing to do there is to be open enough to the Spirit that you feel comfortable that your walking okay in the Lord's sight.  That's not always easy, but yeah.  So maybe there are unlisted things that we probably ought to be obeying before going to the temple.  On the other hand... we should be praying to know these things for ourselves, so we can go, knowing that the Lord feels we are prepared and ready (and I don't expect that to be always consistent, sometimes the Lord may say 'I know you don't feel prepared, but you need to go the temple right now'.  So yeah... really I guess the Lord just wants us to talk to him, or something like that).

    Just my two cents.

  3. 6 minutes ago, The Nehor said:


    • believes racism is present in every aspect of life, every relationship, and every interaction and therefore has its advocates look for it everywhere

    I would prefer to just ask smac or the article writer to CFR that one line. They analyze things and look for it but the idea that advocates spend their whole lives searching for it everywhere? No.


    • cannot be satisfied, so it becomes a kind of activist black hole that threatens to destroy everything it is introduced into

    This is like complaining that feminists will never be satisfied until they have equality. Well, duh, yeah, that is kind of the objective. Being satisfied partway there is a form of surrender to a tolerable level of racism.

    Okay, I think that's fair, I do think the article was too certain with it's statements.  When you claim big things like everywhere, and all the time, it's very difficult to justify a statement.  But if you removed the absolutism in these statements, what are they trying to say?  Do the statements have some value if you remove the absolutism?

  4. 3 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

    That is not critical. It is a strawman.

    It is here is what they believe: (long list of stuff they don’t believe)

    I stopped there. If that is the quality of the vetting you do with articles I am just going to assume the rest is trash.

    If you don't mind... I'm gonna CFR you here.  Can you please demonstrate that they don't hold these views?

    I'm pretty sure you can... but I think that you'll get a much better discussion if you provide those examples.

    Thanks, and hope your having a good day.

  5. On 8/9/2021 at 12:56 PM, poptart said:

    Lost my copy years ago, decided to try the app, wow they put a lot of work into that thing.  Is there a pc version?  Don't feel like reading on my phone.  I'm old school hence why I've always stuck with physical copies.  I kind of despise new tech and it's social media friendly trappings.  That being said, I'll say it again wow the Gospel library app is neat! Lots of cool colors and pictures plus guides.

    There's an app on the Microsoft store for windows 10.  Otherwise just use the web browser.

  6. On 8/9/2021 at 3:52 PM, juliann said:

    I have a friend with an autistic child who loves Pokemon. She draws Pokemon in her class. The bishop informed my friend through the Primary President that someone had complained and the child is not to draw Pokemon instead of the approved activities. First, how to you tell an autistic child not to draw what they are fascinated with when nothing comparable is given as a substitute. Second, this seems petty and mean, not to mention a refusal to accomodate special needs children.

    Is anyone familiar with any rules, regulations, etc., that could help? 

    Hey Juliann,

    Others have written pretty much what I would say in regards to rules and regulations.  I have Asperger's, which is semi-related to Autism.  I don't particularly remember having a harder time being still in church than other boys, but I definitely could have had a hard time and just not be remembering.  We do get one-track mind sometimes.

    In this case, what I'd probably do is first have your friend talk to the bishop.  Try to be as kind as possible in doing so, there's a chance he doesn't fully understand the situation.  Explain what will occur if the child is not allowed to draw (your friend should have a few experiences with this, and so should be able to relate the difficulty of it).  It's possible the bishop just doesn't know about how difficult it is, and it wouldn't be the greatest to embarrass him if that's the case (and sometimes, us men can be kinda dense).  Worst case you can bring up the rules mentioned in other posts.

    If he says no, you can decide whether or not you want to go to to the stake president.  Hopefully it doesn't come to that though.

    Just make sure your friend is frank with the Bishop.  Sometimes people just aren't aware, so you have to explain pretty carefully.

    Hope it works out for both of you. :)

  7. 12 hours ago, InCognitus said:

    The Called to Share channel on Youtube shared this video yesterday, and it does a great job of contrasting a clip from The Chosen with scenes from the First Vision:

    What Would You Do If God Did Something You Felt Contradicted the Bible?

    Most Latter-day Saints have encountered the attitudes portrayed in the video from people of other faiths.  But I've also run into some very ridged interpretations of scripture from members of the church (and I'm not exempting myself from that assessment), which is why I altered the title of the video (from "Bible" to "Scriptures") when creating the title of this thread.

    What would you do if God did something that you felt contradicted your interpretations of the scriptures?   I suppose the real question that always arises is, did God really do whatever it is that seems to be a contradiction?  And how would we know?

    Any thoughts on this, or the video itself?

    So... Elder Bednar actually addressed this when he visited my mission.  Basically, he talked about the very rare conditions that this happens, talking about the account where Nephi slays Laban.

    He roughly said that such situations are very rare, but when they happen the Spirit will give you a very specific reason for not keeping the general commandment.  With Nephi, you'll notice the Spirit gives him one.  This is a pattern of sorts.

    I think he was wise to suggest caution in these sort of situations.  It's very easy at times to misunderstand the Spirit, and so it's good to ponder and listen for a specific reason, and to pray for confirmation.  This is not a very usual experience.

  8. 22 hours ago, Fair Dinkum said:

    * I am aware of and acknowledge that there is a lot of speculation among believers that Celestial family members will be aloud to make visits to their family members serving out their eternal sentences in the lower kingdoms.  But I could find nothing official to support this speculation.

    I can't find it explicitly mentioned, but there is this, in the subsection about the terrestrial kingdom:  https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/ensign/2005/04/messages-from-the-doctrine-and-covenants-the-three-degrees-of-glory?lang=eng

    There's also the few quotes about mothers helping their wayward children into eternal families, which I think you would find interesting.

  9. On 6/27/2021 at 9:01 AM, Tacenda said:

    During a wakeful night, couldn't sleep because of worrying, I considered just taking myself to say Canada or anywhere out of the US. Thinking maybe a service type of thing for a couple of years. Then I thought of my children/husband/responsibilities and how would that go over. I see Senior missionary couples that go on LDS missions for 18 months and no one thinks anything of it. I always thought I'd do that one day, but that ain't happening. If I was single I'd hope I was able to do what you're thinking of doing.  It's the politics, the daily shootings, and the future that makes me want to leave and find greener grasses.

    I know this is a bit late, but... I did wish to comfort you.

    So most of these things still existed a while back... it's just that social media has expanded their reach a bit.  Furthermore, social media tends to amplify things so the noisiest 2% speaks for the other 98%.  Things are definitely not as bad as they seem.

    I got to spend some time up in Wyoming a few years back, and people were remarkably friendly.  There was a few people out on loan farms who were more the 'leave me alone' type, but most everyone treated each other like neighbors and family.  I think news and social media makes the world seem a lot worse than it really is.  It's just that all the niceness is very silently done.

    Just my two cents.  Hope your having an awesome day!

  10. This is going to sound weird, but which state are you in?  Currently in California here and from what I understand, at least where I'm at, they are having trouble with too many vacancies.  That may have changed really recently though, not sure.

    I'm glad you got it, and I'll keep those who didn't in my prayers.

    Hope things continue to go well for you and your family.

  11. 11 hours ago, IndyBelle said:

    I'm new here, I'm not sure if this topic aligns with other topics here, because it's something about the church that I'm struggling with. I've been struggling with a few things, but this one is really eating at me today, so here I am. I'm in some LDS Facebook groups, but I didn't feel comfortable posting there. So hi! Teenage convert (13 years ago), married, 4 kids.


    Does anyone struggle with the church being so family-centered, and yet they ask one or both parents to leave their family duties to help with church activities/callings all the time? 
    The whole four years my husband was in dental school, which is challenging enough for a young family, he was YM President. We went from 1-3 babies during the duration of his calling — that’s how long he was in it. And during that time he never missed an event. He was going to mutual every week and staying after for hours, doing Boy Scouts activities, camp outs once a month, sometimes week-long camp outs, going to church early, staying at church late, driving kids to church dances, chaperoning dances, dropping what he was doing to give someone a ride, the list goes on as many of you know. I look back on that time and think, wow. We were stretched so thin because of church during an already stressful time in our lives. And anytime I’d try to put my foot down and say, “No, not this time. I really need you helping me with the kids today.” He felt like he was letting everyone down by helping me, so he would choose the calling. It drove me nuts.
    Fast forward to him now having a stake calling as YM secretary, and it’s youth conference this weekend. After already coming home late from work every day this week, and me having mental breakdowns and anxiety attacks (something new and scary for me to navigate. I recently had baby #4, and never felt like this before), he went straight from work to attend the conference yesterday and didn’t come home until after midnight, and was up this morning at 6 to go again and won’t be back until 6 tonight. He felt like he’d me letting them down if he helped me.
    It’s just super hard for me to be literally crying out for help for years now, and our family comes second to church stuff.
    Feelings of resentment are really stirring up, and I don’t want to feel that way towards the church. I know service is important. I know. But why is it so often prioritized over families?
    Again, sorry if this is not in line with the purpose of this forum. 😳

    Heya, we are glad to have you here, and this is a perfect place to ask.

    So, just so you know, Church official policy is that you put family first.  Period.

    I'm going to tell you a story, not as a firm rule, but as an example of how this principle played out.

    On my mission, I met a couple who hardly came to church.  He wanted to, but she was super people shy, and so they didn't go.  He struggled with it, but his top priority was to support his wife.  Ultimately, something was worked out where he came in the building while she sat out in the car, and they both got the sacrament.  Because we as missionaries talked to him, she got a better impression of us, and didn't shy away from us as much when we talked to her later.

    Now I'm sure it would have been better had she made it in the church building to partake of the sacrament, but she wasn't at that point yet.  And her husband, being considerate, accommodated her.  I'm sure there are other situations where there would need to be more weight put on church activity (for example, someone shouldn't ask a spouse to not believe or else, or the likes), but there are many times where some church things will need to be put second.

    Anyways... it's okay to turn down a calling.  It's okay to tell your husband that YOU need more time with him.  Your family is part of your calling after all, and it's super important!  It's okay if you both don't do quite as much 'church calling' stuff if it helps your family function better, and maintains your sanity.

    That doesn't mean drop everything probably - church callings really do build us up in ways we can't understand.  I heard from a wise bishop once that said that the Lord calls bishops when they are unqualified, and the moment they get qualified, he releases them.  It's the same with other callings in the church.  So if you have the time and energy, and want the blessings that come from a calling, receive it.  If you or your family are felling frayed at the ends (like you are now), it may be best to pray about it, and consider saying no at this time.  Talk to the Lord about it in prayer with your hubby, and figure out what works best for your family.

    As for how to talk about it with your husband... I have this same issue with my wife... and the best way my wife helps me realize this is just by talking about it gently with me and letting me know how much I am needed by her at home.  So I would suggest expressing this to your husband, kindly, but also very thoroughly, about how you are feeling frayed.  Help him to understand how you are feeling.  He loves you, I'm sure.  He may feel a bit unsure of what to do, and a bit sad, as you have said.  But it's important you let him know how you feel, in the least.  Don't accuse him, but do let him know how you feel.  Perhaps others have good advice on this front, but that's what I'd give.

    I wish you the best.

    P.S.  Also take a look at Rain's post.  It's some good stuff.

  12. 7 hours ago, The Nehor said:

    Numbers I last saw showed that teens were statistically more likely to suffer cardiovascular harm from getting Covid than they were to suffer an adverse vaccine reaction. That was after accounting for how rare it is for a teen to have a severe case.

    For those who are interested, here's the full report:  fda.gov/media/150054/download

    And here are the numbers (about 0.002%):

    Age group     Doses          Crude   Expected  Observed 
                  Administered   rate    cases     cases
    12–15 yrs     134,041        22.4     0–1      2 
    16–17 yrs     2,258,932      35.0     2–19     79
    18–24 yrs     9,776,719      20.6     8–83     196
  13. I got to watch Wonder Woman 1984 yesterday, and I thought it was actually really good.

    I had heard weird things about it going in, and that it was a bit overly political... but after watching it, I've gotta say the rumors were pretty wrong.

    I found the moral of the story to be pretty awesome and refreshing, and it tied in the gospel a lot.  A lot of talk about gratitude, satisfaction with what one has, and being honest with oneself.  It was really good.

    I don't think the action scenes played out as well, but I don't mind that so much.

  14. 22 minutes ago, Calm said:

    Do we get to see the cat again?  https://www.mormondialogue.org/profile/16930-tao/

    Do you want me to ‘report’ your situation?  The mods may be able to change your old email listed on the older account to your new one....I am assuming you need to recover your password.

    Sure, that'd be fine.  It's either 1 of two issues (1) I may have swapped the accounts email to an email account I don't have access to or (2) the account was deactivated in some way.  I'd be glad to have the old account, but if the mods don't want to, that's fine too.  I'm probably not going to participate a whole ton but jump in just occasional :).

    Yeah, I'll see if I can get the cat up... although I might switch up which cat.  I've gotta look around :D.

    Thanks so much!

  15. On 5/18/2021 at 5:06 PM, T-Shirt said:

    Yes, the fall was the plan.  However, I believe, Adam and Eve's disobedience was not the plan.  God did not want them to disobey Him, but He allowed them to, and if they did, His plan would still work.  When He said, "I forbid it...", He meant it.  I believe the plan was for Adam and Eve to be be taught and after sufficient instruction and after they had sufficiently matured, God would have instructed they to partake of the fruit to bring about the fall.  In mortality, we have things that are forbidden for a time and then, at a certain point, these same forbidden things not only become acceptable, they become encouraged.  For example, turning on and using a stove, driving and sexual relations.

    There are a few reasons that I believe this.  The first is that I have never been able to accept the belief that God would very strongly forbid something while at the same time, secretly, not really mean it and hope Adam and Eve would disobey, and then punish them for disobeying Him, when all along they actually did what He wanted them to do.  This just doesn't work in my simple mind, so I had to find a different explanation.  One day, in the temple, it came to me.  Something in the film stood out to me.  When God asks Lucifer what he was doing, he said he was doing that which had been done in other worlds, specifically, giving the fruit to Adam & Eve.  Immediately God curses Lucifer and Lucifer gets angry about it.  This doesn't make any sense, except in a certain context.  If what had been done in other worlds was a serpent giving the fruit to Adam and Eve, Lucifer would have understood that he would be cursed for it, as it had happened before, so why would he get angry if all the other Lucifer's, presumably, had been cursed, as well?  I thought on this and then I realized, in other worlds, it wasn't Lucifer giving the fruit to Adam and Eve, it must have been God.  Lucifer was just trying to jump the gun and spoil the plan, but God had already accounted for this possibility.  It was a perfect plan that would have worked, regardless of the choice Adam and Eve made.  I believe God would have preferred that they had been obedient and thereby had been fully prepared for the eventual day when He would have given them the fruit.


    14 minutes ago, mfbukowski said:

    Interesting idea

    Heya, TAO here.  It's been a while.

    Something interesting I heard a while ago from an Institute teacher while I was in school - some rabbis believe the correct way to interpret the story is that God said 'Don't eat the fruit yet'.  I think this sort of fits with what you guys are thinking, not fully, but just thought I'd leave it here for the time being.

    Hope you both are having a wonderful Sunday :).


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