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provoman

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Everything posted by provoman

  1. I think he had a good point with that part of his presentation.
  2. One night 1978 the world went to sleep under the belief and teachings that the Priesthood was restricted, the next morning people woke up Deseret News Headline (Friday, June 9, 1978) "LDS Church extends priesthood to all worthy male members" Things happen overnight without the knowledge or input from those who are not the leadership. Given that common claims of first hand account of people speaking directly to the HCO and given the lack of repudiation of said claims by HCO. And "dating means different things" and "case by case basis review" are very suggestive that BYU Provo will not tak
  3. My not so learned opinion, the Constitution applies to Government actors, the 1st Amendment Freedom of speech/expression does not apply to actions taken by private entity, nor does it apply to private property owners restricting conduct on their private property.
  4. I also do not think leadership out side of BYU associated wards or wards with no BYU student have paid much attention to the issue. As best I can tell, the current General Handbook does not address "homosexual behavior" as did CHI 2 21.4.6. I tend to agree with the many statements that a clarification will come from Church Leadership.
  5. I do not agree, I do not even think the BYUs can agree (there is a picture of BYU I v BYU P cheerleaders online, and BYU I are almost fully clothed except for a little bit of ankle and BYU P cheerleaders have traditional outfits. There is also this recording of a alleged BYU I Administrator who states along the lines of "Well BYU Provo made that change for them it does not apply to BYU Idaho" @rockpond also this from BYU I The Board of Trustees of BYU-Idaho requires every student attending the university to have an annual ecclesiastical endorsement. This will be completed by t
  6. The "press release" for the General Handbook mentions a pdf, though who knows maybe they mean a pdf is the format of the app. Yes, the search function on the website does not permit searching ONLY the General Handbook. There is a video on the church website on how to search in the app. The Gospel Library app does not work for me, as in, it crashes at startup.
  7. Not understanding the chaos at a ward/stake level as a HCO "policy" does not create a standard for the Church.
  8. Tomorrows meeting will be interesting. Some comments on another point out the BYU is not the Church but BYU does claim to follow the Church standards. I think the meeting will confirm what everyone has been saying ... on/off campus dating is not a per se violation of BYU rules. I think it may also cover that BYU does not speak for ones Ecclesiastical Leaders. General Conference will be interesting.
  9. 32.6.2.2 and 38.6.5 would and those sections use "may be required" concerning a "membership" council. But you might be right some Bishop could argue that the General Handbook does not preclude full participation by a same-sex couple married or not.
  10. Ah, understand. As same-sex marriage is not within the Law of Chastity, then I think that would preclude things.
  11. Do you have a reference that same sex married couples can be given callings?
  12. Has anyone found a pdf for the new General Handbook?
  13. Good question. I do not think the absence of a first hand confirmation negate what other have claimed.
  14. Your post is interesting, as there more information available and attributed to HCO in favor of same-sex dating, than there is available and attributed to BYU/HCO that informs that same-sex dating remains prohibited, I am not saying same-sex is accepted at BYU campuses because there are so many articles claiming it as truth. And given the numerous "I was told by *insert name* from HCO" that gay dating is ok, and almost nothing attributed to HCO to rebut, I would say this is not a "bungled" message.
  15. Live a chaste and virtuous life, including abstaining from any sexual relations outside a marriage between a man and a woman. And separately: any other conduct or action inconsistent with the principles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and the Honor Code is not permitted.
  16. I think, and based on what peppermint patty and others have stated, dating, kissing, holding hands between couples is not an automatic loss of endorsement. And on a case by case basis (BYU tweet) conduct of couples will be reviewed and determinations will be made as to whether the conduct violated standards.
  17. Isn't the issue about what "sexual relationships" means?
  18. Thank you for letting us know about paraphrasing.
  19. I have no reason to believe Kitchen is a liar either. However Kitchen [president of Affirmation] said he spoke to the Honor Code Office on Thursday morning, and officers told him that they'll allow same-sex student couples to kiss, hold hands and date. They'll also no longer accept tips from other students or ecclesiastical leaders about "homosexual behavior" on campus, Kitchen said -- it'll all be self-reported. The bold part is not quoted and attributed as Kitchen's own words, so either poor editing on the part of CNN or the CNN journalist put into his own words what Kitchen said.
  20. Kitchen is not quoted in the CNN article regarding what is claimed to have been told to him. As for more clarification...I am beginning to think BYU should just leave it were it is. People will date, people may approach the HCO office....each will be a case by case basis. We will hear/read unattributed anonymous statements about "Unnamed person at HCO said...." With it case by case basis similar cases will, I suspect, be addressed differently and outcomes will be different. So while we are confused in terms of our discussions online, those affected can always approach the HCO.
  21. Full docket text for document 97:Minute Entry for proceedings held before Magistrate Judge Dustin B. Pead: Status Conference and Motion Hearing held on 2/20/2020 re [91] MOTION to Compel Production and Memorandum in Support filed by Corporation of the President of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, The, [94] *SEALED DOCUMENT* SEALED MOTION*SEALED DOCUMENT* SEALED MOTION filed by McKenna Denson. After hearing from the parties, Plaintiffs Motion for Mediation is GRANTED. The court will refer this matter to Magistrate Judge Romero to conduct a settlement conference within the next 6
  22. Ah good point about the solicitation, for some reason I thought HI PD was charging her with that.
  23. That is alarming to me from a Constitutional standpoint 18-401. DESERTION AND NONSUPPORT OF CHILDREN OR SPOUSE. Every person who: (1) Having any child under the age of eighteen (18) years dependent upon him or her for care, education or support, deserts such child in any manner whatever, with intent to abandon it; (2) Willfully omits, without lawful excuse, to furnish necessary food, clothing, shelter, or medical attendance for his or her child or children, or ward or wards; ..... Does Idaho have any evidence of abandonment or willful omits to provide?
  24. Yes I think endowment wording would change. As pointed out plural spouse is legal in some countries, same-sex marriage is legal in some countries, so for me it makes sense to reword to God's law.
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