294 replies to this topic

[LDS4EVER]

Paul Osborne, on Mar 16 2005, 07:08 AM, said:

Johnny,

You told me that the Father doesn�?¢â?¬â?¢t have a body. Do you think he is an individual Man as Jesus is when he appears to his saints? You asked me to show you in the Bible that God the Father has a body.

Rev 1:17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

1. St. John saw the Lord (Jesus)
2. St John bowed before the Lord
3. The Lord laid his hand upon St John

Conclusion:

The Lord Jesus has a hand


Rev 5:7 And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne.

1. Jesus is in heaven
2. St. John and the angels were watching
3. The Father was holding a book
4. Everyone saw the Father holding a book
5. No one was worthy to open the book but Jesus only
6. Jesus walked over to the throne
7. Jesus took the book out of the hand of the Father
8. Everyone saw Jesus take the book

Conclusion:

The Father has a hand and therefore he has a body - he is "a Man".

Paul O

Paul you naughty boy. You should know better then to use fact and bible scriptures. Those things melt their brains. Johnny already can't decide if Jesus is God.

[Paul Osborne]

LDS4EVER, on Mar 16 2005, 09:51 AM, said:

Paul you naughty boy. You should know better then to use fact and bible scriptures. Those things melt their brains. Johnny already can't decide if Jesus is God.

I know, I'm a bad boy. But I mean well.  

Johnny,

1. Was the Father ruling the heavens when Jesus was a little baby?
[ ] yes  [ ] no

2. Did the angels in heaven get to see the Father when Jesus was a little kid on planet earth?
[ ] yes  [ ] no

3. What did the Father look like? How did he sound when he spoke to the angels?
_____________________________
_____________________________
_____________________________

4. Is it possible that he was �?¢â?¬�??a Man�?¢â?¬�? like it says in the Bible?

[ ] yes  [ ] no

Paul O

[Zakuska]

Rev 1:17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

Wow Paul... he has feet too!

[Paul Osborne]

Zakuska, on Mar 16 2005, 12:20 PM, said:

Rev 1:17 And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:

Wow Paul... he has feet too!

Feet? I don�?¢â?¬â?¢t know that you can say that. It all depends on how you interpret the Bible. God may have arms, hands, and legs �?¢â?¬â?? but to say he has feet could be construed as a private interpretation.

Besides it was just a vision �?¢â?¬â?? an illusionary idea.



Paul O

[Zakuska]

Ah... I got ya.  A smoke and mirrors.  Parlor trick!  

[Paul Osborne]

Zakuska, on Mar 16 2005, 01:15 PM, said:

Ah... I got ya.�??�?  A smoke and mirrors.�??�?  Parlor trick!�??�? 

The word of God says:

�?¢â?¬�??The LORD is a man of war: the LORD is his name�?¢â?¬�?

This means he is A MAN.

Ezek 1:26 And above the firmament that was over their heads was the likeness of a throne, as the appearance of a sapphire stone: and upon the likeness of the throne was the likeness as the appearance of a man above upon it.

God is a man and his beauty is beyond description. The prophets tried to explain his glory by using examples - but how hardly could they convey his glory. His eyes are more beautiful than diamonds and his skin is more lovely than gold, etc.

Paul O

Edited by Paul Osborne, 16 March 2005 - 11:25 AM.

[Zakuska]

Perhaps he's a inter-galactic phosforescent jelly fish?  

[Paul Osborne]

Zakuska, on Mar 16 2005, 01:48 PM, said:

Perhaps he's a inter-galactic phosforescent jelly fish?  

The Bible makes it clear that God is not like mortal man but he is omnipotent and perfect. He is not a Man that lies but is a personification of truth.

I suppose that those who reject the testimony that God is a Man can be open to the suggestion that he is some sort of glorified animal creature.

What do you think, Johnny?

Paul O

[emaughan]

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Perhaps he's a inter-galactic phosforescent jelly fish?

But then John would have fallen at his - I mean its - pseudopods, or tenticals.

[Zakuska]

I always was told that he was some cloud of light thingy that filled the imensity of space but yet little enough to dwell in your heart.

He'd be crushed by my left ventrical.  

[William the Conqueror]

Zakuska, on Mar 15 2005, 11:34 PM, said:

Never once that I am aware of is Christ called God while here on the earth.  He is always refered to as Lord or is called a man. (ie God who became man Who became God and will make men gods)  He emptied himself of God hood to become a man.

'...before Abraham was I AM...'  book of John

Titus  1:3,4
Titus  2:13

John 20:28  '...my Lord and my God'

These are a few and I don't have the wherewithal to get my Stong's analytical.

This from the New King James translation, so unless your JST has changed them (and that is more than a remote possibility), your bible will read the same.

[Zakuska]

WC:

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'...before Abraham was I AM...' book of John

When Christ told Abraham this was he on the earth?    

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John 20:28 '...my Lord and my God'

Christ was ressurected... of course he was God.  

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Titus 1:3,4

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Titus 2:13

Again Christ was a ressurected being when he comissioned his Apostles to preach to the world.

Timing is everything.

[Paul McNabb]

William the Conqueror, on Mar 16 2005, 05:46 PM, said:

These are a few and I don't have the wherewithal to get my Stong's analytical.

This from the New King James translation, so unless your JST has changed them (and that is more than a remote possibility), your bible will read the same.

Just to make it clear, William, Latter-day Saints use the standard King James Version of the Bible as their standard version for church services and classes, with individuals often using many other translations for their personal study.  The JST is not canonized scripture.  LDS use the JST to learn Joseph Smith's interpretation and comments on some Bible verses and some Bible narratives. The standard Bible that is published by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is the King James Version with some of the JST information in footnotes and in a brief appendix.

You probably don't need to specify non-JST in the discussion.

[William the Conqueror]

Zakuska, on Mar 16 2005, 04:03 PM, said:

WC:

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'...before Abraham was I AM...' book of John

When Christ told Abraham this was he on the earth?    

Quote

John 20:28 '...my Lord and my God'

Christ was ressurected... of course he was God.  

Quote

Titus 1:3,4

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Titus 2:13

Again Christ was a ressurected being when he comissioned his Apostles to preach to the world.

Timing is everything.

After I posted that I knew how you would respond and I was right in every detail.

So I thought what should I ask him when he refutes my verses?

And this thought came to me:  Was He only a man as He died on the cross?

If yes when did He become God again - at the resurrection?

The answer to the I AM verse is:  Yes Christ was on the earth when He talked to Abraham at the Oaks of Mamre.

Now my question to you:  If He wasn't claiming Deity when he told this to the Jews (in the book of John), why did they want to stone him?  Hint: the answer is in the following passages- chapter 10.

Oh by the way, timing is everything, because we don't have that many days on earth before judgement.  Read Psalms 90.

No need for eye rolling pal, you had better start looking up from your knees.

[emaughan]

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After I posted that I knew how you would respond and I was right in every detail.

Then why post?

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Was He only a man as He died on the cross?

Oooo Oooo - Let me answer!
No He was not only a man.  Christ is Jehova the creator of the physical universe - that is LDS doctrine   (see no rolly eyes).  Zakuska pointed out that to die He for us He had to take on mortality.  Can God die?  I think you and Zakuska may not be communicating well.  Such a shame as Zakuska is such a nice person.

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If He wasn't claiming Deity when he told this to the Jews (in the book of John), why did they want to stone him?

Again let me! Let me!
Christ was telling the Jews that he was Jehova - that is why they got as mad as a pack of antiMos during general conference.

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No need for eye rolling pal, you had better start looking up from your knees.

Boy - I really feel the Christ like love in that sentence.  Maybe you should head Gamaliel's advice.