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MustardSeed

Happiness

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

Are members of this church the happiest people in the world? 

Only if they happen to be at Disneyland when you ask them. 
Depends on your definition of "happy" and "people".  It's all relative to each  person's personality and situation. 
 

Edited by JAHS

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24 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

Are members of this church the happiest people in the world? 

If not they should be.  No other organization of people has a better or more complete understanding of the "plan of happiness" (aka the gospel of Jesus Christ) than the organization known generally as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints.

So if there are some members of our Church who are not the happiest people on this planet, then they should get with the program.  Or seek medical attention if they're just having some sort of medical problem.

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I think it’s arrogant and alienating to claim ownership of happiness over other beliefs. 

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7 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

I think it’s arrogant and alienating to claim ownership of happiness over other beliefs. 

I remember my YSA Bishop told us we can't be happy until we're married (like as if was some physical impossibility) well you don't walk into the Temple-unhappy, then 30 minutes later walk out and you're all of a sudden happy and an ordinance changed all that. I say now, if you aren't happy being single then you won't be happy being married, it's just too much pressure to put on someone to make someone else happy.

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

I think it’s arrogant and alienating to claim ownership of happiness over other beliefs. 

Yeah me too.  Everybody who knows how to be happy knows how to do it.  The only people who aren't happy are the ones who don't know how to do it.

Edited by Ahab

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5 hours ago, MustardSeed said:

Are members of this church the happiest people in the world? 

Statistical measures of happiness are not consistent, so not sure how to determine it as a fact. Have to define happiness in a concrete way that everyone agrees upon and then do tons of studies with that measure, imo, to test for the happiest people in the world imo.

There is research that show Saints rate high for some measures of happiness, others not so good.  All subject to interpretation about what they imply.

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*channeling Pharell*

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12 hours ago, Duncan said:

I remember my YSA Bishop told us we can't be happy until we're married (like as if was some physical impossibility) well you don't walk into the Temple-unhappy, then 30 minutes later walk out and you're all of a sudden happy and an ordinance changed all that. I say now, if you aren't happy being single then you won't be happy being married, it's just too much pressure to put on someone to make someone else happy.

It would explain a lot.

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16 hours ago, MustardSeed said:

Are members of this church the happiest people in the world? 

As a group, possibly not.  

But was there not a Pew research survey done at some point that took note of various religious groups and their outlooks?  I seem to recall something like that being discussed here.

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7 hours ago, sunstoned said:

Not even close.  A new report says more than a third of adults in some Utah communities are suffering from depression.

https://www.sltrib.com/news/2019/08/14/some-utah-communities/

Well, if the Trib says so, it must be the case.

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15 hours ago, Ahab said:

If not they should be.  No other organization of people has a better or more complete understanding of the "plan of happiness" (aka the gospel of Jesus Christ) than the organization known generally as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints.

So if there are some members of our Church who are not the happiest people on this planet, then they should get with the program.  Or seek medical attention if they're just having some sort of medical problem.

I can't decide if you're being facetious or serious.  Your last sentence coincides nicely with @sunstoned's mention of an article in the SL Trib about depression.

I happen to agree with the sentiment that a testimony of the "plan of happiness" should provide a degree of happiness.  I feel a great deal of comfort in believing strongly that I will be reunited with my loved ones who have passed on, and that my despair over my individual failings will be remedied through Christ's atonement.

There is, on the other hand, some apparent comfort in some atheists' minds over their believe that when they are dead there will not be any "self" to worry about such things and it will all go finally away.  And that the Universe will eventually decay into heat death and literally nothing will matter in the end.  I guess that could give some people happiness -- though I confess I don't see how.  To each his own.

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13 hours ago, Duncan said:

I remember my YSA Bishop told us we can't be happy until we're married (like as if was some physical impossibility) well you don't walk into the Temple-unhappy, then 30 minutes later walk out and you're all of a sudden happy and an ordinance changed all that. I say now, if you aren't happy being single then you won't be happy being married, it's just too much pressure to put on someone to make someone else happy.

An interesting opinion your YSA bishop had.  In a way he had a point.  I've seen people who were desperately unhappy in their marriage.  I had one of those, and divorce was a relief.  However, the next two marriages were net generators of happiness.  I don't like being single.  Even my bad marriage was better than being single in many ways.

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This accusation of being "best" in anything is odd and full of fear. "I don't want to hurt your feelings so I cannot say - 'this is true.'" It is rubbish and simple. It is as if humans are incapable of identifying universal truths. 

The reason the Church states it is the Church of Jesus Christ is because it actually is the Church of Jesus Christ. It does not matter if you are a Muslim, a Buddhist, or a Baptist - this is the declaration we make to the world. Also, we freely acknowledge that Jesus is the Christ for all people in all lands. He is not the Savior of just Christians, but for all mankind.

These claims of being the happiest?  Gads, who knows or who cares. I agree with the statement that if not, then we should be. We should understand that even as we overcome with challenges and trials, we still know the sweet name of Jesus Christ and what he has done for us to fill our hearts with joy and gratitude. 

The saints know pain, heartache, and at times due to our own humanity, despair, but the saints also know the Savior and our Father.

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3 hours ago, Storm Rider said:

This accusation of being "best" in anything is odd and full of fear. "I don't want to hurt your feelings so I cannot say - 'this is true.'" It is rubbish and simple. It is as if humans are incapable of identifying universal truths. 

The reason the Church states it is the Church of Jesus Christ is because it actually is the Church of Jesus Christ. It does not matter if you are a Muslim, a Buddhist, or a Baptist - this is the declaration we make to the world. Also, we freely acknowledge that Jesus is the Christ for all people in all lands. He is not the Savior of just Christians, but for all mankind.

These claims of being the happiest?  Gads, who knows or who cares. I agree with the statement that if not, then we should be. We should understand that even as we overcome with challenges and trials, we still know the sweet name of Jesus Christ and what he has done for us to fill our hearts with joy and gratitude. 

The saints know pain, heartache, and at times due to our own humanity, despair, but the saints also know the Savior and our Father.

Del

 

Edited by MustardSeed

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3 hours ago, Storm Rider said:

These claims of being the happiest?  Gads, who knows or who cares. I agree with the statement that if not, then we should be. We should understand that even as we overcome with challenges and trials, we still know the sweet name of Jesus Christ and what he has done for us to fill our hearts with joy and gratitude. 

Over the decades it is common for me to read of nonLDS who make the observation that members are frequently smiling, being cheerful, friendly, congenial, engaging, etc.  Does that equate to greater sense of happiness?  I am inclined to say so.  After all,  Jesus said for us to be of good cheer.  Even in the midst of tribulations.

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27 minutes ago, longview said:

Over the decades it is common for me to read of nonLDS who make the observation that members are frequently smiling, being cheerful, friendly, congenial, engaging, etc.  Does that equate to greater sense of happiness?  I am inclined to say so.  After all,  Jesus said for us to be of good cheer.  Even in the midst of tribulations.

For what it’s worth, when we visited Poland with our missionary son about 20 years ago, the people were still recovering from the oppression of the Soviet occupation. Walking through the streets of several cities, very few would smile or even make eye contact. A noticeable exception were the members of the Church we met. They were radiant.

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7 hours ago, longview said:

Over the decades it is common for me to read of nonLDS who make the observation that members are frequently smiling, being cheerful, friendly, congenial, engaging, etc.  Does that equate to greater sense of happiness?  I am inclined to say so.  After all,  Jesus said for us to be of good cheer.  Even in the midst of tribulations.

If there is a disagreement between us, it is measured i degrees. Are LDS generally perceived as happy people? I think the consensus is yes.  However, I would never say they are the happiest people on the earth. First, I don't know all the people on the earth. Second, the definition of what happy is and looks like that is universal is highly subjective. 

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On 10/9/2019 at 10:54 AM, MustardSeed said:

Are members of this church the happiest people in the world? 

I don't know how such a thing could be measured.  And beyond that, for those invested in the idea that we are, I would ask, what would the designation even mean?  Was Christ the happiest person on the earth when He was alive?  Based on the general definition of the term, I would guess that He probably would not have qualified.

Discipleship is hard, and often comes with trials.  Lehi described his life after leaving Jerusalem until his death as a time of tribulation.  Paul spent most of his time after conversion in jail or shipwrecked.  When the scriptures talk about wickedness never being happiness, they are talking about after mortality, not during it.

(not to say that followers of Christ will not have joy or be happy, even really happy.  But even evil people are happy some of the time. ).

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You can actually appear happy while being depressed. LDS are very good at appearance.

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8 hours ago, Recurrence said:

You can actually appear happy while being depressed. LDS are very good at appearance.

I find this is very true anecdotally. 

 

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Happiness is one over-rated and a somewhat ambiguous state of being.  Happy compared to what?  To who?  When?  how long?  Who cares?   

I remember going door to door as a missionary and at the time it was recommended more than anything we emphasize the plan of happiness, hoping someone opened the door, felt a bit dreadful or bored and wanted some change (we called that God preparing them).  I hated sitting there while my companion, perhaps the most miserable and least happy person I knew, was trying to convince people they could be happier by joining the Church and living the true gospel.  I don't think it really hit me so clearly when I was wondering around with companions who weren't so miserable.  

I read Pres Eyring's conference talk about being happy and was reminded of the dreadful state of mind that came with being a believer.  Not sure how people do it.  But likely many take pills or sit in misery, as pointed out earlier.    

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I do believe that being involved in the church and having the gospel makes MY life much better than if I decided not to have it.

I would have more fun without it, but with it there is much less drama and more friends and more awareness of my value and purpose.  So that's good.  Happiness?  I think that's debatable as to whether my happiness is due to church or due to my attitude.

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