Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
SettingDogStar

The New WoW Question

Recommended Posts

50 minutes ago, SettingDogStar said:

Per the update 

11. Do you understand and obey the Word of Wisdom?”

The new way this is worded ignores anything about Coffee and Tea and is pointing directly at the revelation itself. 

So, I’d like your thoughts, is iced coffee, tea, and beer back in the table? Is Starbucks about to have a large influx of Mormons getting their cold coffee chops on? Or no? 

I joke, but seriously. What do you think? Is it just a simple reword or does it have implications?

Nothing is fool proof.  Meaning there will (always) be some fool who thinks he understands something but who really doesn't understand it as it should be understood, 

And obey?  Obey what? What they think they understand?  Who among us doesn't obey what he/she thinks he/she understands?

If you understand the Word of Wisdom to mean it's okay to drink soda pop like Dr. Pepper every day at 10, 2 and 4 along with a big bag of potato chips AND THEN actually do that to show you obey the Word of Wisdom, pffftt, what can I say,  you will probably still be able to get a temple recommend.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
2 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:
4 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Green tea would be included as well, since it is tea. The only difference is that black tea has been oxidized, like an apple or avocado cut open and left on the counter. There has been no exemption given by the Church for the consumption of green tea. 

Yes, but why wouldn't hot cocoa, postum, pero/caro, herbal tea, etc?

Yes green tea should be avoided too. The idea is to not take anything into our bodies that would be harmful or addictive. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
4 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

Yes, but why wouldn't hot cocoa, postum, pero/caro, herbal tea, etc?

Those things are neither tea nor coffee — not even “herbal tea,” which is a misnomer. 

Share this post


Link to post
51 minutes ago, SettingDogStar said:

Per the update 

11. Do you understand and obey the Word of Wisdom?”

The new way this is worded ignores anything about Coffee and Tea and is pointing directly at the revelation itself. 

So, I’d like your thoughts, is iced coffee, tea, and beer back in the table? Is Starbucks about to have a large influx of Mormons getting their cold coffee chops on? Or no? 

I joke, but seriously. What do you think? Is it just a simple reword or does it have implications?

I think the use of "understand and obey" might help people settle on whether they pin their integrity on understanding or on rationalization before saying they obey.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Those things are neither tea nor coffee — not even “herbal tea,” which is a misnomer. 

Utter nonsense.  (Not you, the interpretation of hot drinks).  No basis in science or religion.

Edited by JLHPROF

Share this post


Link to post
2 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

Utter nonsense.  (Not you, the interpretation of hot drinks).  No basis in science or religion.

While I don’t drink either, I honestly believe it was originally in reference to the temperature and not the drink itself. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, CV75 said:

I think the use of "understand and obey" might help people settle on whether they pin their integrity on understanding or on rationalization before saying they obey.

Yes. 
 

And if someone in the course of an interview should say he does not understand the Word of Wisdom, the priesthood leader would explain it consistent with what I’ve quoted from “True to the Faith,” and it would then be binding on the member to comply. 

Edited by Scott Lloyd

Share this post


Link to post
14 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

How do we as members actually define "the Word of Wisdom"?  That question alone provides a lot of insight.

 

1 minute ago, SettingDogStar said:

While I don’t drink either, I honestly believe it was originally in reference to the temperature and not the drink itself. 

It doesn't matter if your answer to my question above is "whatever the leaders tell me it is".

It only matters what the revelation actually means if your to my question above is "whatever God said it is".

Share this post


Link to post
Just now, JLHPROF said:

 

It doesn't matter if your answer to my question above is "whatever the leaders tell me it is".

It only matters what the revelation actually means if your to my question above is "whatever God said it is".

Agreed.

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Yes. 
 

And if someone in the course of an interview should say he does not understand the Word of Wisdom, the priesthood leader would explain it consistent with what I’ve quoted from “True to the Faith,” and it would be binding on the member to comply. 

Not if they understand that interpretation to be in error.

Share this post


Link to post
6 minutes ago, JLHPROF said:

Utter nonsense.  (Not you, the interpretation of hot drinks).  No basis in science or religion.

If Church leaders, acting in the authority of their callings, are not entitled to interpret scripture for the Church at large, then who is? Certainly not you. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)
10 minutes ago, CV75 said:

I think the use of "understand and obey" might help people settle on whether they pin their integrity on understanding or on rationalization before saying they obey.

Usually it isn’t rationalization though. The revelation itself allows for beer and iced drinks. It would be more of a misunderstanding the current interpretation of the verses.

Edited by SettingDogStar

Share this post


Link to post
3 minutes ago, SettingDogStar said:

While I don’t drink either, I honestly believe it was originally in reference to the temperature and not the drink itself. 

Based on the evidence from some studies, the WHO has concluded that drinking hot beverages (anything about 149°F) is linked to a higher risk for esophagus cancer. 
 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, JLHPROF said:

Not if they understand that interpretation to be in error.

Harboring such an understanding — and acting on and promoting it — I would think would be grounds for denial of the temple recommend. 

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, JAHS said:

Based on the evidence from some studies, the WHO has concluded that drinking hot beverages (anything about 149°F) is linked to a higher risk for esophagus cancer. 
 

Which is why I really think the Lord was referencing the Temp itself. He knows what tea and coffee are, he could have specified.

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, JAHS said:

Based on the evidence from some studies, the WHO has concluded that drinking hot beverages (anything about 149°F) is linked to a higher risk for esophagus cancer. 
 

It would be great if we could understand this whole coffee thing better.  

But, since it's been such an identifying characteristic to be a member of the church of Jesus Christ of latter day saints to NOT drink coffee, I'm fairly certain that it will be a cold day in satans lair that we will be given the green light. 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
2 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Harboring such an understanding — and acting on and promoting it — I would think would be grounds for denial of the temple recommend. 

Yes, you would think that.

Share this post


Link to post
4 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

If Church leaders, acting in the authority of their callings, are not entitled to interpret scripture for the Church at large, then who is? Certainly not you. 

The fact that they have contradicted themselves and interpreted it very differently over the years is decent proof that they don't actually have more revelation on the subject, just personal interpretation of the verses. Not to say that they're giving bad advice or that it won't be healthy but just because they, including the Prophet, interpret a scripture does not mean he's right. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
4 minutes ago, JAHS said:

Based on the evidence from some studies, the WHO has concluded that drinking hot beverages (anything about 149°F) is linked to a higher risk for esophagus cancer. 
 

Which would then extend beyond a single herbal plant never identified in any revelation.

Share this post


Link to post
9 minutes ago, SettingDogStar said:

While I don’t drink either, I honestly believe it was originally in reference to the temperature and not the drink itself. 

If your understanding of "hot drinks" in the WoW applies to the heat of drinks and not to the drinks themselves then logically you should also abstain from any drink or liquid that is as hot as those drinks usually are, like hot broths and soups and hot chocolate.

Do you do that?  If  you do then you may qualify now for your very own temple recommend!  Apply today!  Offer void where prohibited.

Share this post


Link to post

President Joseph F. Smith taught that the Lord did not insist on strict compliance to the Word of Wisdom in the early years in order to allow a generation addicted to noxious substances some years to discard bad habits. That was nice of Him to do that.  No such luck for us since we have been taught all along not to imbibe. 

Share this post


Link to post
10 minutes ago, Ahab said:

If your understanding of "hot drinks" in the WoW applies to the heat of drinks and not to the drinks themselves then logically you should also abstain from any drink or liquid that is as hot as those drinks usually are, like hot broths and soups and hot chocolate.

Do you do that?  If  you do then you may qualify now for your very own temple recommend!  Apply today!  Offer void where prohibited.

or hot enchiladas.  

or hot stew.

 or hot s'mores.

Point is, everyone is going to have their own beliefs.  You do you.  I think the new question offers flexibility.  If you believe something, you'd better live it, regardless of what it is.

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, JAHS said:

I think the wording invites the opportunity to help the person understand what it means. The way I understand it
No alcohol (includes beer)
No tobacco (smoking or chewing or anything like unto it)
No hot drinks (interpreted as being hot  black coffee or black tea)
And today we include some addictive drugs 

Other than that it left to individual interpretation.

The Church recently clarified to include Green Tea as well.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Yes. 

And if someone in the course of an interview should say he does not understand the Word of Wisdom, the priesthood leader would explain it consistent with what I’ve quoted from “True to the Faith,” and it would be binding on the member to comply. 

I think the wording of the questions certainly invites clarification (if sought), and it is still incumbent on the respondent to understand or rationalize, and answer with integrity.

58 minutes ago, SettingDogStar said:

Usually it isn’t rationalization though. The revelation itself allows for beer and iced drinks. It would be more of a misunderstanding the current interpretation of the verses.

We can't really say what it usually is. Some will rationalize that understanding and rationalizing are the same thing. Some don't understand either and go with their gut. But the revelation itself is read by each individual in our own lifetime and understood or rationalized accordingly, which in large part includes current prophets' teachings to inform that understanding. A lack of integrity is not always immediately recognized, but it will come back to haunt us, while good faith will lead to a correct and increased understanding over time.

Edited by CV75
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
2 minutes ago, CV75 said:

But the revelation itself is read by each individual in our own lifetime and understood or rationalized accordingly, which in large part includes current prophets' teachings to inform that understanding.
A lack of integrity is not always immediately recognized, but it will come back to haunt us, while good faith will lead to a correct and increased understanding over time.

So you're saying that a Saint today can only really understand the Word of Wisdom in light of current prophetic teaching?
And that to say you are obeying it (the revelation) but not obeying the current prophetic teaching shows a lack of integrity and good faith?

Did I understand correctly?

Share this post


Link to post
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...