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Thoughts on conference

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Posted (edited)
4 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Should be easy for any woman to understand what kind of relationship she would need to be okay with if she is married to or about to get married to a man who has already been married to another woman and is sealed to her for time and eternity, too.

It's like, what, did she not realize that the other wife would be reunited to her husband, too?  Or does she think that she won't be able to get along with another woman of celestial glory in heaven?

Sure. 

I love it when men say that in order to be worthy to enter the celestial kingdom we need to be happy about sharing our spouses. 

A little sensitivity, like “ I am a male and can only imagine how impossible it must seem to fathom such a thing as willingly sharing your spouse in every way. I trust God loves you and will make everything ok.” can go a long way in these conversations. 

 

Edited by MustardSeed
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2 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I agree, but what's inappropriate for one won't be for another.  It's subjective.  I know latter-day saint parents that I'm sure are mad that Elder Uchtdorf spoke favorably of Harry Potter and LOTR.  They believe that Harry Potter (and anything that mentions magic) is very inappropriate for kids.  :) 

(and I'm not saying that rockpond's concerns are equal to parents that don't want their kids having anything to do with Harry Potter.  I'm only saying that parents disagree about what is appropriate for what age group all the time.  It's difficult to charge anyone speaking to millions of people in many different cultures to ensure they don't say anything any parent anywhere in the world won't agree is appropriate)

I agree with this.  As my wife and I discussed it on Saturday night, we were wondering why they don't have the Women's Session be 12 years old and up.  There should be a session where more adult topics can be discussed without primary age children present.

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5 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Should be easy for any woman to understand what kind of relationship she would need to be okay with if she is married to or about to get married to a man who has already been married to another woman and is sealed to her for time and eternity, too.

It's like, what, did she not realize that the other wife would be reunited to her husband, too?  Or does she think that she won't be able to get along with another woman of celestial glory in heaven?

In the Church we all talk about how our goal is to return to our Father in heaven to live with him, whether we are single or married, and if all who are heirs of celestial glory can live in his house I would think we would be able to get along in any house we live in as long as it is in the celestial realm of heaven.

The degree to which you show empathy for the concerns of others is truly inspiring!  (my post should be read with the maximum amount of sarcasm intact)

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5 minutes ago, bluebell said:

I agree, but what's inappropriate for one won't be for another.  It's subjective.  I know latter-day saint parents that I'm sure are mad that Elder Uchtdorf spoke favorably of Harry Potter and LOTR.  They believe that Harry Potter (and anything that mentions magic) is very inappropriate for kids.  :) 

(and I'm not saying that rockpond's concerns are equal to parents that don't want their kids having anything to do with Harry Potter.  I'm only saying that parents disagree about what is appropriate for what age group all the time.  It's difficult to charge anyone speaking to millions of people in many different cultures to ensure they don't say anything any parent anywhere in the world won't agree is appropriate)

If any of our Church leaders feel it is appropriate to talk to young children about an issue then I would think that any parent who doesn't agree should start to think that maybe they should agree with that Church leader and his or her thought that it is an okay thing to talk about.

Getting stuck on the idea that "No I don't want them to hear anything until "I" think they are ready to hear about it" kind of defeats the whole point of having Church leaders to tell us what is okay or not okay as a thing to talk about, isn't it?

If they think it's okay, then we should probably be thinking that it is okay, too.

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5 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Oh, okay, didn't know that.  So I suppose it is a good idea to talk to them about those issues even if they are only 8 years old.

I disagree.  And they are my children.

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3 minutes ago, Ahab said:

If any of our Church leaders feel it is appropriate to talk to young children about an issue then I would think that any parent who doesn't agree should start to think that maybe they should agree with that Church leader and his or her thought that it is an okay thing to talk about.

Getting stuck on the idea that "No I don't want them to hear anything until "I" think they are ready to hear about it" kind of defeats the whole point of having Church leaders to tell us what is okay or not okay as a thing to talk about, isn't it?

If they think it's okay, then we should probably be thinking that it is okay, too.

This is one of the most foolish abdications of one's ability to think, reason and judge for oneself I have read in quite while.

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5 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

Sure. 

I love it when men say that in order to be worthy to enter the celestial kingdom we need to be happy about sharing our spouses. 

A little sensitivity, like “ I am a male and can only imagine how impossible it must seem to fathom such a thing as willingly sharing your spouse in every way. I trust God loves you and will make everything ok.” can go a long way in these conversations. 

 

We do share out spouses with other people but I wouldn't say that we share them with others in "every" way.  My wife is also our children's Mother and I share her with them so that they can enjoy a particular type of relationship together.  

Sharing is caring.  Don't you and your spouse(s) share yourselves with other people while also enjoying the particular relationships you have with each other?  What is the big deal about sharing your spouse with someone else?

Are you sure you are ready for the celestial way of life?

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If folks are unhappy with certain items being discussed in certain sessions, then it is incumbent for such people to send their concerns to the 15 and the leaders of the organizations.

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5 minutes ago, Ahab said:

If any of our Church leaders feel it is appropriate to talk to young children about an issue then I would think that any parent who doesn't agree should start to think that maybe they should agree with that Church leader and his or her thought that it is an okay thing to talk about.

Getting stuck on the idea that "No I don't want them to hear anything until "I" think they are ready to hear about it" kind of defeats the whole point of having Church leaders to tell us what is okay or not okay as a thing to talk about, isn't it?

If they think it's okay, then we should probably be thinking that it is okay, too.

No, I don't agree that parents should turn to Church leaders to see what is appropriate to talk about.  It's supposed to be" home led, church supported", not "church led, home supported".

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5 minutes ago, rockpond said:

I disagree.  And they are my children.

You are allowed to disagree but nobody else is forced to agree with you.  Your children are the children of our Father in heaven too and he has given all of us responsibilities about how we should try to help each other.

What was it they heard which you object to them having heard, anyway?  If you didn't tell them that do you think nobody is supposed to tell them until you decide you want to tell them?  Life doesn't work that way, bro.  Even at 8 years old people will hear all kinds of things.

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8 minutes ago, ttribe said:

This is one of the most foolish abdications of one's ability to think, reason and judge for oneself I have read in quite while.

So who do you think you should turn to for your ideas about what to talk about and when to talk about it, then?  Nobody but you and your spouse? Of if you are not married, just you? Just whatever you think or whatever you and 1 other person thinks?  Essentially cutting yourself off from other people to get ideas from?  And if you do decide to go beyond yourself to get other ideas, who better to get ideas from than our Church leaders as they share messages of inspiration from our Father in heaven?

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10 minutes ago, bluebell said:

No, I don't agree that parents should turn to Church leaders to see what is appropriate to talk about.  It's supposed to be" home led, church supported", not "church led, home supported".

Who is supposed to lead the members at home, though?  If we are members of our Church, who are the leaders who are supposed to lead us?  Don't you get ideas from them and then share those ideas with your family?  If not why not?  What kind of member are you?

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22 minutes ago, rockpond said:

I agree with this.  As my wife and I discussed it on Saturday night, we were wondering why they don't have the Women's Session be 12 years old and up.  There should be a session where more adult topics can be discussed without primary age children present.

I know that not all sisters are happy about having 8 year olds there. 

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Just now, bluebell said:

I know that not all sisters are happy about having 8 year olds there. 

I am thinking they should be glad their children were there to hear from our leaders and that we as parents should be teaching them the same things even if we haven't already done that.

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4 minutes ago, Ahab said:

So who do you think you should turn to for your ideas about what to talk about and when to talk about it, then?  Nobody but you and your spouse? Of if you are not married, just you? Just whatever you think or whatever you and 1 other person thinks?  Essentially cutting yourself off from other people to get ideas from?  And if you do decide to go beyond yourself to get other ideas, who better to get ideas from than our Church leaders as they share messages of inspiration from our Father in heaven?

Your response makes no sense.  The post to which I made my statement made it clear that you believe Church leaders have the final say on this issue and that members must bow to those decisions, without fail, without questioning and without consideration of one's own ability to think.  I never said anything about some absolute reservation of all thought upon which to act to oneself.  It is YOU who spoke in absolute terms.  If you think Church leaders are an appropriate source of wisdom and advice, that's all well and good, but fully abdicating your decision making to Church leaders is 100% foolish, in my opinion.

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, provoman said:

Would you be willing to post Elder Hollands words that have caused the offense? 

You accuse him of hypocrisy and laughing  laughing at sam young....I am curious of what I missed in Elder words.

hy·poc·ri·sy
/həˈpäkrəsē/
noun
 
  1. the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform; pretense.
     
     
    the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs
    "a certain blind man sat by the wayside, begging...  have mercy on me... the crowd tried to silence the man, but he cried so much the more...."  I am moved by this... we can sense the man's distress, we can almost hear him shouting... we smile at his refusal to be silent ... the good sense that this man had in having spiritually sensitive people around him... it all hinges on a handful of anonymous women and men to identify Christ.  In matters of faith and conviction, it helps to direct your inquiry to those who actually have (faith)... shall the blind lead the blind?  shall they not both fall into the ditch?"
     
    one's own behavior does not conform
    4:20, he smirks, and has to pause as everyone in the audience is laughing about Sam Young, laughing about LGBT, laughing about racism against indigenous people, laughing at women, laughing about all those outside who have been deeply hurt by the church.
     
    The opposite of love is not hate it's indifference.  
     
    the church is filled with prideful hypocrites who laugh and mock those who are abused.  Like pharisees praising and applauding Judas, giving Judas money even.... everyone pays the apostles to tell them they are chosen, tell them they are special, while all others are hated by God, and to be laughed at.
     
     
     
     
Edited by changed

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4 minutes ago, ttribe said:

Your response makes no sense.  The post to which I made my statement made it clear that you believe Church leaders have the final say on this issue and that members must bow to those decisions, without fail, without questioning and without consideration of one's own ability to think.  I never said anything about some absolute reservation of all thought upon which to act to oneself.  It is YOU who spoke in absolute terms.  If you think Church leaders are an appropriate source of wisdom and advice, that's all well and good, but fully abdicating your decision making to Church leaders is 100% foolish, in my opinion.

You're misrepresenting what I was saying.  I'm saying that if Church leaders feel that something is good or a good thing to talk about, then most likely it is and we should examine our own thoughts if we think they are not telling us good things or good things to talk about.

You can think whatever you want to think about anything  You have that freedom.  You can even think that our Church leaders make a lot of false statements and are trying to lead your soul to destruction and it is better for you to not listen to anything they try to tell you.

I will still testify though that I have learned a lot of good things by listening to our our Church leaders and I am glad I have had and still have them to listen to.   They share a lot of good ideas, even some ideas which people think are not good, but which I know to be good, anyway.

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3 minutes ago, changed said:
the church is filled with prideful hypocrites who laugh and mock those who are abused.  Like pharisees praising and applauding Judas, giving Judas money even.... everyone pays the apostles to tell them they are chosen, tell them they are special, while all others are hated by God, and to be laughed at.
 

I think you are talking about the wrong church. Are you sure you are on the right board?

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17 minutes ago, Ahab said:

I am thinking they should be glad their children were there to hear from our leaders and that we as parents should be teaching them the same things even if we haven't already done that.

Just curious @Ahab... how many kids do you have and what are their ages?

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10 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

I’ve heard that he’s quite the prankster....

 

Be that as it may, I think it a bit of a stretch to say in this instance that it was intentional. 

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53 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Oh, okay, didn't know that.  So I suppose it is a good idea to talk to them about those issues even if they are only 8 years old.

And if the parents judge them as too immature?

Since topics for conference are not announced ahead of time and women are encouraged to bring their young daughters with them, maybe better for a different time. 

Though other sessions would have included younger kids at this conference, so it would seem more appropriate for a Priesthood session where it starts at 11? these days.

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8 minutes ago, rockpond said:

Just curious @Ahab... how many kids do you have and what are their ages?

2 sons from my wife who was a widow when I met her, ages 18 / 21 then and 36 / 39 now.  I'm hoping I'll get to enjoy some more of the "parent" kind of experiences with them as they have some grand children, having missed out on a lot of things from earlier ages.

The younger one is  married now and they both want to have children fairly soon.

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22 minutes ago, Ahab said:

You're misrepresenting what I was saying.  I'm saying that if Church leaders feel that something is good or a good thing to talk about, then most likely it is and we should examine our own thoughts if we think they are not telling us good things or good things to talk about.

You can think whatever you want to think about anything  You have that freedom.  You can even think that our Church leaders make a lot of false statements and are trying to lead your soul to destruction and it is better for you to not listen to anything they try to tell you.

I will still testify though that I have learned a lot of good things by listening to our our Church leaders and I am glad I have had and still have them to listen to.   They share a lot of good ideas, even some ideas which people think are not good, but which I know to be good, anyway.

I'm misinterpreting nothing.  You are backtracking, now.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, changed said:
hy·poc·ri·sy
/həˈpäkrəsē/
noun
 
  1. the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs to which one's own behavior does not conform; pretense.
     
     
    the practice of claiming to have moral standards or beliefs
    "a certain blind man sat by the wayside, begging...  have mercy on me... the crowd tried to silence the man, but he cried so much the more...."  I am moved by this... we can sense the man's distress, we can almost hear him shouting... we smile at his refusal to be silent ... the good sense that this man had in having spiritually sensitive people around him... it all hinges on a handful of anonymous women and men to identify Christ.  In matters of faith and conviction, it helps to direct your inquiry to those who actually have (faith)... shall the blind lead the blind?  shall they not both fall into the ditch?"
     
    one's own behavior does not conform
    4:20, he smirks, and has to pause as everyone in the audience is laughing about Sam Young, laughing about LGBT, laughing about racism against indigenous people, laughing at women, laughing about all those outside who have been deeply hurt by the church.
     
    The opposite of love is not hate it's indifference.  
     
    the church is filled with prideful hypocrites who laugh and mock those who are abused.  Like pharisees praising and applauding Judas, giving Judas money even.... everyone pays the apostles to tell them they are chosen, tell them they are special, while all others are hated by God, and to be laughed at.
     
     
     
     

Thank you for the clarification.

Edited by provoman

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54 minutes ago, Ahab said:

What is the big deal about sharing your spouse with someone else?

So you have no problem with your wife being married to five or so other men then?

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