Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
poptart

Meanwhile in Bavaria...

Recommended Posts

11 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Actually, no.  I was just joking.  Alma 39:9 advises us to "cross yourself in all these things."  And the Book of Mormon constantly recalls the cross upon which Jesus hung.

There goes my idea of hanging rainbow colored crosses to confuse and scare people......

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
4 minutes ago, longview said:

CFR on any "ridiculous stunts to signal his racism" at any point since his election  (and make sure you don't leave out anything that Clinton and Obama have not done routinely in their administrations).

In a conflict involving literal neo-Nazis he insisted there was bad “on many sides”. “Bad hombres” coming up from the South. Those are signals to racists that you are on their side. Wink, wink, nudge nudge.

Quote

Demonizing is your forte.  Engaging in ad hominem attacks is your usual knee-jerk option.  Before he ran for the presidency, he was feted by the elite establishment, hollywood, and the press.  He appeared on Oprah a few times and made numerous charitable assistances for all kinds of people.

He was. He thrived on scandal. He was sort of part of the elite establishment. He was shunned by a lot of the major real estate magnates of New York and seen as an upstart you do not want to deal with. He pivoted and went for press approval which he got with his playboy lifestyle. Are you suggesting Hollywood and Oprah invitations are marks of virtue?

The Trump foundation was shut down due to rampant illegality, self-enrichment from a charitable trust.

He has given more then I probably ever will but what makes him so vile is his constant promises to give to charities as a PR stunt with little to no follow through. When he was a relative nobody in terms of celebrity no one looked into his promises. Now that they do care they find he would promise millions and give thousands. He would promise to donate all of the proceeds of some venture to charity and then little to none would appear.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-promised-millions-to-charity-we-found-less-than-10000-over-7-years/2016/06/28/cbab5d1a-37dd-11e6-8f7c-d4c723a2becb_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.831b62c9e496

The most telling story I know of that shows the motive was in 1996 at a charity event for kids with HIV. Trump showed up and sat on the podium taking a seat designated for an actual contributor. He likes the pretense and publicity of being a charitable giver but greed overrules the actual giving:

https://www.complex.com/life/2016/10/trump-crashed-charity-event-macarena-didnt-donate

Share this post


Link to post
55 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

So all vampires and Mormons need to stay in Transylvania.  :pirate:

As a Mormon vampire I feel I am being stereotyped.

#notallgarmentwearingvampires

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
43 minutes ago, poptart said:

He didn't force em but the whole thing about it being easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle? 

This is just another example of his appeal to the heart of man.  No force.  No socialism in these words.

46 minutes ago, poptart said:

Also hey, people have used the bible forever to justify just about whatever they want.

This is very true, and your defense of socialism by calling Jesus a socialist based on this passage is a prime example of that.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
2 minutes ago, pogi said:

This is just another example of his appeal to the heart of man.  No force.  No socialism in these words.

This is very true, and your defense of socialism by calling Jesus a socialist based on this passage is a prime example of that.

I agree, thing is i'm not a christian in the same sense you are so it's not quite the same nor carries the same sting for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, poptart said:

My interpretation when reading the new testament was Jesus was a socialist and probably would be in favor of some form of it, good luck getting that to fly with most Christians here.

 

Yep, George Washington was the first Masonic Grandmaster of the USA, he was also a deist as were most of the Founding Fathers. 

Ohh you don't know that?  Bit of an interesting history lesson for you.  Freemasons and Churches here used to work together a lot more back in the day, what charity they could not pick up in their local community the masons would.  It wasn't until the 50s and 60s when a few mostly evangelical people tried to get in and were denied due to poor character that the attacks started.  Most of the mainline bodies here save the Episcopals and ELCA Lutherans hate their guts, it's power and competition for money and resources.  The Catholic Church has always hated them, they're still bitter over France and Mexico.  Funny how they accuse the Freemasons of almost anything and everything under the sun yet they've done very little if anything over their own corruption and child abuse. 

The real Irony is how Joseph Smith got in a lot of hot water with the Grand Lodge of Illinois yet you guys are more than tolerant of the craft, infact I think the current (He may not be anymore...) Grandmaster for the state of Utah is a BYU grad.  Leave it to Mormons to be shrewd and practical, always loved that trait.

Jesus stayed out of government affairs. We know a bit of how he wants his kingdom to be run. I doubt either capitalism or what we think of when we think of socialism will survive his coming. I base this primarily on one verse: “He that is idle shall not eat the bread nor wear the garments of the laborer.”

I think this deserves careful examination. Who is the idler? Is it a single mom with a job on food stamps? Probably not if we believe raising a family is work. What about a single guy who sits at home playing video games and getting a check for spurious disability?Definitely. A person living off a trust fund? Definitely. A capitalist business owner? Maybe, they might be working but are they paying their employees a fair living wage for their labors? If not and they are not barely hanging on themselves they are eating the bread of the laborer. An employee who slacks off and pushes their work onto their coworkers? Definitely. Someone who made their fortune and lives an extravagant lifestyle of luxury and ease? Definitely. Someone who made their fortune and now spends time trying to help others in a rational and deliberate way with their time and wealth? Almost certainly not.

Hence why I think we will see something different. I am not necessarily happy about this conclusion. I am not wealthy but I do have more then I need and I am probably one of those that needs to be, in the words of the D&C, “made low”.

 

As to the rest I think you go too far. Some of the Founders were deists and some were ardent supporters of Christianity. Most were nominally and privately Christian but heavily influenced by Enlightenment ideas like Deism. It is true that the Religious Right’s claim of this being an exclusively Christian nation is partly myth. 

If anything the founder’s diversity is a perfect endorsement of E Pluribus Unim and an example of moderation we could use in the current culture war. Religious individual and organizations should have no special political status other then to be left alone within the laws of the state and religious individuals should stand up and be heard in public discourse.

Both sides mangle the term “religious liberty”. One side wants special privileges to ignore the law because of their faith and the other wants religion restricted to quiet personal prayers conducted solely in private and any attempts at reasoning on religious principles abolished from policy discussions. Both are “king-men” in the Book of Mormon sense and want aristocratic privileges for their beliefs. The founders were wiser. Many of them were deeply religious men but they also understood that privileging some religion or a religion could easily lead to tyranny and that those privileges, even if on their side, would set a dangerous precedent if things shift and another takes power. The best defense is equality.

Christian dominionists want to destroy Jefferson’s equality to create their utopia. Dedicated atheists want to silence and exile faith to claim their utopia. Both are damned.

Edited by The Nehor

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, poptart said:

...How popular is the Afd down there?  From what i've read they're getting quite popular.

AfD so far hasn't managed to get any real power, but they're growing in popularity, which is concerning.

1 hour ago, poptart said:

Wanted to ask, just how well is the LDS church doing over there?  I'd imagine in places like Germany and France where Beer/wine is a huge part of life the LDS faith isn't all too popular. 

The church is growing, albeit slowly. Most of the converts tend to be refugees and immigrants, but a good chunk of converts are regular Germans, as well. People do have a hard time understanding why we don't drink alcohol.

Share this post


Link to post
12 minutes ago, rchorse said:

AfD so far hasn't managed to get any real power, but they're growing in popularity, which is concerning.

The church is growing, albeit slowly. Most of the converts tend to be refugees and immigrants, but a good chunk of converts are regular Germans, as well. People do have a hard time understanding why we don't drink alcohol.

I always marveled at the wide range of people who convert, I know here the retention rates tend to suck.  I don't believe like you do and after being considered the filthy gay gentile who was almost homeless because I offended their sensibilities, yeah that was that.  Honestly that was what really did it for me as far as Christianity here stateside goes, the entitlement and out right meanness of christians makes me want to throw up, big suprise they're loosing people so fast.  Really makes me wonder how a German who culturally is so different would opt for the LDS faith.  Only thing I can think of is maybe the saints are different over there, I know in places like Hawaii and from what i've been told Polynesia and Japan the church is quite different.  Mom went to BYUH and her classmates still check up on her, and she's not even LDS.

Share this post


Link to post
3 hours ago, The Nehor said:

In a conflict involving literal neo-Nazis he insisted there was bad “on many sides”. “Bad hombres” coming up from the South. Those are signals to racists that you are on their side. Wink, wink, nudge nudge.

He was. He thrived on scandal. He was sort of part of the elite establishment. He was shunned by a lot of the major real estate magnates of New York and seen as an upstart you do not want to deal with. He pivoted and went for press approval which he got with his playboy lifestyle. Are you suggesting Hollywood and Oprah invitations are marks of virtue?

The Trump foundation was shut down due to rampant illegality, self-enrichment from a charitable trust.

He has given more then I probably ever will but what makes him so vile is his constant promises to give to charities as a PR stunt with little to no follow through. When he was a relative nobody in terms of celebrity no one looked into his promises. Now that they do care they find he would promise millions and give thousands. He would promise to donate all of the proceeds of some venture to charity and then little to none would appear.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-promised-millions-to-charity-we-found-less-than-10000-over-7-years/2016/06/28/cbab5d1a-37dd-11e6-8f7c-d4c723a2becb_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.831b62c9e496

The most telling story I know of that shows the motive was in 1996 at a charity event for kids with HIV. Trump showed up and sat on the podium taking a seat designated for an actual contributor. He likes the pretense and publicity of being a charitable giver but greed overrules the actual giving:

https://www.complex.com/life/2016/10/trump-crashed-charity-event-macarena-didnt-donate

image.jpeg.2bf8e3ab859156d9dc685dc4c558b435.jpeg

Are you tired of DJT winning? 

image.jpeg

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
4 minutes ago, snowflake said:

image.jpeg.2bf8e3ab859156d9dc685dc4c558b435.jpeg

Are you tired of DJT winning? 

image.jpeg

Did we get “great again”? I must have missed it.

Share this post


Link to post
14 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Did we get “great again”? I must have missed it.

Well the economy certainly is, unemployment is way down especially for women,  African Americans and Latinos.....that's good right? 

 

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, snowflake said:

Well the economy certainly is, unemployment is way down especially for women,  African Americans and Latinos.....that's good right? 

 

The impact of Congress and the President on the economy is vastly overrated and most legislation and executive orders that impact the economy do not show their full impact for several years at least. Their effect is also relatively minor. There are exceptions such as military conflict and sweeping legislation that upends everything (think New Deal) but participation in military conflict should not be something we decide primarily on economic impact and there has not been any sweeping legislation that upends the economy.

Economic growth is pretty stable which is good. There are risks ahead but there always are. If you are trying to defend Trump with this  it is worth noting that he promised 4% growth in the economy and suggested it would not be hard to get 5% to 6%. We didn’t and we are not anticipated to. I would hardly count that as a win even if you think government has that big of an impact.

Share this post


Link to post
5 hours ago, poptart said:

Ohh you don't know that? 

I knew he was a Mason, etc; I just missed the apron the first couple of times I looked at it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
Sign in to follow this  
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...