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Danzo

Seminary Credit

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Does anyone here know what seminary credit is good for?

I like seminary and my children attend willingly.  I like the opportunity for them to study the gospel every day. I keep getting notices like "they must pass some test to get credit", or" they must register to get credit or "If they get too many absences, they won't get credit"

I am just not sure what the credits are good for.   Do they transfer to BYU somehow?

Anyone know?

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To attend a church college you are in theory required to graduate from seminary. 

Also, personal satisfaction of receiving a certificate each year and a graduation certificate at the end. 

Also, brownie points. 

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Seminary graduation could improve a student’s chances of being accepted, but it is not necessary. In 2015, 96.2 percent of students who were accepted into BYU had graduated from the four-year seminary program according to the BYU Admissions website. The Admissions Council considers the ecclesiastical endorsement and then academic records. Then each application is evaluated according to seminary attendance, service, leadership, personal essays, individual talents, creativity, AP/IB courses taken and unique or special circumstances, as well as other factors that enhance the individual’s application to BYU.

https://universe.byu.edu/2016/02/09/byu-admission-rumors-debunked/

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However, I wonder how many of that 4% were nonmembers or international students.  If I wanted to go to BYU, I would definitely be focused on graduating seminary.

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My son was accepted a few months ago to BYU.  

He was accepted to the department of his choice.  

In December he stopped attending seminary.  He was told if he doesn’t make up lost days the district manager over our area will report him to BYU to have him removed from enrollment. 

It upsets me but doesn’t upset me at the same time.  I can appreciate following standards, as there are many willing to do so who don’t get in. But what I don’t like is what looks like the power game of one little man.  At least he’s getting a chance to get er done. 

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Credit is needed for graduation (or to pass the class for any given year).  

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So Its just a BYU thing

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1 hour ago, MustardSeed said:

To attend a church college you are in theory required to graduate from seminary. 

Also, personal satisfaction of receiving a certificate each year and a graduation certificate at the end. 

Also, brownie points. 

I know a lot of people who have gotten into a church school through the pathway program and Seminary isn't a prerequisite for it.

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1 hour ago, MustardSeed said:

My son was accepted a few months ago to BYU.  

He was accepted to the department of his choice.  

In December he stopped attending seminary.  He was told if he doesn’t make up lost days the district manager over our area will report him to BYU to have him removed from enrollment. 

It upsets me but doesn’t upset me at the same time.  I can appreciate following standards, as there are many willing to do so who don’t get in. But what I don’t like is what looks like the power game of one little man.  At least he’s getting a chance to get er done. 

The actual procedure for anyone that has been accepted to a Church school but then drops out of Seminary is to NOTIFY the school.  I believe they are notified either way.

The school CAN take action.  I have seen it happen.  I have seen it have no effect.   Usually the latter.   It is NOT an automatic thing.

I don't know anything about college admissions but it is possible that contingencies exist for certain people.

 

 

And if you are looking for secular doors to be opened by graduating from Seminary you will some missions closed to you unless you graduate.  And your probability to be accepted to a church school is greater with the 'diploma'.

There are MUCH greater things that CES and Q15+ have in mind for attending/learning/applying what is taught in those classes.  And most of them don't have to do with opening doors to other opportunities.   I will let you Gooogle the stats.

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3 hours ago, The Mean Farmer said:

The actual procedure for anyone that has been accepted to a Church school but then drops out of Seminary is to NOTIFY the school.  I believe they are notified either way.

The school CAN take action.  I have seen it happen.  I have seen it have no effect.   Usually the latter.   It is NOT an automatic thing.

I don't know anything about college admissions but it is possible that contingencies exist for certain people.

 

 

And if you are looking for secular doors to be opened by graduating from Seminary you will some missions closed to you unless you graduate.  And your probability to be accepted to a church school is greater with the 'diploma'.

There are MUCH greater things that CES and Q15+ have in mind for attending/learning/applying what is taught in those classes.  And most of them don't have to do with opening doors to other opportunities.   I will let you Gooogle the stats.

Yes, this is what I remember from when they started doing credit. Something about some countries requiring those who serve missions needing some kind of religious education to minister within the country. 

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Is the rumor true that in some countries missionaries must be "seminary graduates" in order to be allowed to enter as ministers?

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26 minutes ago, Bernard Gui said:

Is the rumor true that in some countries missionaries must be "seminary graduates" in order to be allowed to enter as ministers?

Perhaps LDS seminary is confused with real seminary education in Judaism and mainstream Christianity.  Jewish rabbis, for example, are typically trained in institutions such as the Jewish Theological Seminary of America.  They may then become licensed (ordained) rabbis. The same for RC priests and for Protestant ministers.

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4 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

Is the rumor true that in some countries missionaries must be "seminary graduates" in order to be allowed to enter as ministers?

That is true.  Brazil is one of those countries.

For my 18 year old soon-to-be high school graduate that doesn't move the needle for him at all!

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5 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Perhaps LDS seminary is confused with real seminary education in Judaism and mainstream Christianity.  Jewish rabbis, for example, are typically trained in institutions such as the Jewish Theological Seminary of America.  They may then become licensed (ordained) rabbis. The same for RC priests and for Protestant ministers.

I didn't understand it to be confusion so much as that the country required something. l do remember my son's seminary teacher saying a couple of years ago that this was one of the reasons for the test at the end of the year - that some requirement of getting credit in some countries was being tested on what was learned.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Rain said:

I didn't understand it to be confusion so much as that the country required something. l do remember my son's seminary teacher saying a couple of years ago that this was one of the reasons for the test at the end of the year - that some requirement of getting credit in some countries was being tested on what was learned.

Perhaps so, but it may also be that standard practice for regular Protestant ministers of the Gospel is to be well educated and licensed with real academic credit at the college level -- in accredited institutions of higher learning.  That is likewise the practice for RC priests and Jewish rabbis.  Most countries understand that, and m ay fully expect from LDS ministers (all LDS missionaries carry official ID from the LDS Church declaring them to be official ministers).

When an LDS member is accepted as an officer in the Chaplain Corps of the U.S. Armed Forces, he must meet certain minimum requirements:

Quote
  • Are not older than 42 by the date they commission into the Army.
  • Have completed their basic theological education for their denomination or faith tradition (often the Master of Divinity degree).
  • Have completed at least two years of post-theological education professional experience in their denomination or faith tradition (applies to active duty only).
  • Are ordained and endorsed by their denomination or faith tradition to serve in one of the components of the Army.
  • Have served a minimum of two years in a full-time professional capacity as a member of a denomination or faith group, validated by an endorsing agency (this requirement does not apply to Army Reserve or Army National Guard applicants).

RELIGIOUS ENDORSEMENTS

You must obtain an ecclesiastical endorsement from your faith group.

This endorsement should certify that you are:

  • A clergy person in your denomination or faith group.
  • Qualified spiritually, morally, intellectually and emotionally to serve as a chaplain in the Army.
  • Sensitive to religious pluralism and able to provide for the ‘free exercise’ of religion by all military personnel, their family members and civilians who work for the Army.

EDUCATION REQUIREMENTS

In order to qualify as an Army Chaplain, you must possess the following degrees from accredited institutions:

  • A baccalaureate degree of no less than 120 semester hours.
  • A graduate degree in theological or religious studies, and at least 72 semester hours in graduate work.

Many of these requirements will be on the minds of those in foreign countries, and with good reason.

Edited by Robert F. Smith

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16 hours ago, Danzo said:

Does anyone here know what seminary credit is good for?

I like seminary and my children attend willingly.  I like the opportunity for them to study the gospel every day. I keep getting notices like "they must pass some test to get credit", or" they must register to get credit or "If they get too many absences, they won't get credit"

I am just not sure what the credits are good for.   Do they transfer to BYU somehow?

Anyone know?

I'm not sure I know what you mean by "seminary credit".

I live in Colorado and in my particular area, the youth are required to attend released time seminary.  They do not receive credit with the school system for taking it even though it takes the place of one of their other HS classes and is taught by a professional instructor with CES.  They do receive certificates for each year and a diploma for completing all four years.  (Perhaps the system is different in Utah, I don't know.)

As others have indicated, I think it is considered if one applies to a church school.  Otherwise, it's done for personal reasons or because parents make them go. :)

 

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Also I got a plaque for having four years of perfect attendance. My mother probably deserves the plaque though and I was sick sometimes I was just too asleep to realize it until after seminary was over.

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Perhaps LDS seminary is confused with real seminary education in Judaism and mainstream Christianity.  Jewish rabbis, for example, are typically trained in institutions such as the Jewish Theological Seminary of America.  They may then become licensed (ordained) rabbis. The same for RC priests and for Protestant ministers.

An LDS student who takes seminary seriously and studies assiduously for four years would have a formidable mastery of the fundamentals our religion. Of course they are not being trained in the fineries and skills of rabbihood or pastoring. I think we tend to value this instruction less than our Jewish and Christian friends. 

Edited by Bernard Gui

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1 hour ago, rockpond said:

I'm not sure I know what you mean by "seminary credit".

I live in Colorado and in my particular area, the youth are required to attend released time seminary.  They do not receive credit with the school system for taking it even though it takes the place of one of their other HS classes and is taught by a professional instructor with CES.  They do receive certificates for each year and a diploma for completing all four years.  (Perhaps the system is different in Utah, I don't know.)

As others have indicated, I think it is considered if one applies to a church school.  Otherwise, it's done for personal reasons or because parents make them go. :)

 

As I said earlier, I am completely in favor of a early (In our area) class where high school students study the scriptures.  I think such a system has value in and of itself.  For me its like daily Sunday school. It helps compliment our daily gospel study that we have in our homes at night.

What I notice about seminary lately is that it seems that there are a lot more formalities to this program than to other gospel study programs.  You need to register, You need to record attendance, take take tests, etc.  At the end if you do all of this you get . . . . "Credit?", "A Diploma?" "A Certificate?".

I am wondering what these "brownie points" are good for.  I graduated from seminary when I was a youth, but I don't recall that fact being remembered by anyone afterwords.  I don't recall it ever being brought up in again.  I don't think It is even on the normal church records that the ward clerk and bishop has access to (At least it wasn't when I was a clerk).

Although the knowledge and experience is extremely valuable, the "Certificate" doesn't seem to have much value.  

I suppose it might have if I had decided to attend BYU, but that doesn't seem to be the case since my wife has gotten into the BYU Idaho through pathways and she didn't get graduate from seminary.

Maybe, as Indicated by some here, it helps get a visa for missionaries.  

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1 minute ago, Danzo said:

As I said earlier, I am completely in favor of a early (In our area) class where high school students study the scriptures.  I think such a system has value in and of itself.  For me its like daily Sunday school. It helps compliment our daily gospel study that we have in our homes at night.

What I notice about seminary lately is that it seems that there are a lot more formalities to this program than to other gospel study programs.  You need to register, You need to record attendance, take take tests, etc.  At the end if you do all of this you get . . . . "Credit?", "A Diploma?" "A Certificate?".

I am wondering what these "brownie points" are good for.  I graduated from seminary when I was a youth, but I don't recall that fact being remembered by anyone afterwords.  I don't recall it ever being brought up in again.  I don't think It is even on the normal church records that the ward clerk and bishop has access to (At least it wasn't when I was a clerk).

Although the knowledge and experience is extremely valuable, the "Certificate" doesn't seem to have much value.  

I suppose it might have if I had decided to attend BYU, but that doesn't seem to be the case since my wife has gotten into the BYU Idaho through pathways and she didn't get graduate from seminary.

Maybe, as Indicated by some here, it helps get a visa for missionaries.  

Well, the switch to released-time seminary and hiring full-time CES instructors definitely increases the formalities.  :)

I think what you've mentioned is mostly the reason for seminary "credit" -- consideration when applying to church schools and visas for missionaries.

And, if I'm being honest, I am proud of the fact that I completed four years of early morning seminary.  Although, all we really had to do was show up.

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1 hour ago, rockpond said:

Well, the switch to released-time seminary and hiring full-time CES instructors definitely increases the formalities.  :)

I think what you've mentioned is mostly the reason for seminary "credit" -- consideration when applying to church schools and visas for missionaries.

And, if I'm being honest, I am proud of the fact that I completed four years of early morning seminary.  Although, all we really had to do was show up.

To be fair, showing up is all I really needed to do to get the High School diploma (and it has about the same value in my life as the seminary graduation certificate).

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15 minutes ago, Danzo said:

To be fair, showing up is all I really needed to do to get the High School diploma (and it has about the same value in my life as the seminary graduation certificate).

Truth.

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Posted (edited)
19 hours ago, MustardSeed said:

To attend a church college you are in theory required to graduate from seminary. 

When did they add that? It would seem to be problematic for converts or people who for whatever reason didn't do seminary.

Edit: nevermind. Saw the quote that it helps but isn't essential.

 

Edited by clarkgoble

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4 hours ago, Bernard Gui said:

An LDS student who takes seminary seriously and studies assiduously for four years would have a formidable mastery of the fundamentals our religion. Of course they are not being trained in the fineries and skills of rabbihood or pastoring. I think we tend to value this instruction less than our Jewish and Christian friends. 

Getting concentrated high school Sunday School lessons for 4 years from someone who is only a Sunday School teacher just doesn't compare to professional seminary training at the collegiate level (undergrad & graduate).  The types of training are not even related in any way.  Perhaps LDS students just don't need such training, and perhaps they should not even be interested in such training.  However, then we must ask why Joseph Smith thought such training to be important -- School of the Prophets, 1835-1836.

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There are some countries which require religious training for the visa's missionaries enter that country with.   Seminary credit gives that.

The church schools require Seminary credit for entry (I don't know the extent to which exceptions are made for members, but non-members can be admitted without seminary graduation).

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