Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
lostindc

The Church is potentially spending 129 million to purchase a London office building.  

Recommended Posts

15 hours ago, The Nehor said:

Well, there was that threesome I turned down in college.......but no, not just a desire for intimacy or companionship.

If the gospel is false I have wasted a lot of my life. Mission, temple, countless meetings, etc. Paul wasted much more. He gave up pretty much his whole life post-vision and spent a lot of time in prison and privation for nothing if it was a fraud.

Fortunately it is not a fraud. :) 

Do you know how dangerous it is to even think the church could be untrue, it's obliterated some testimonies out there. That tells something right there, that some out there have never considered it could be untrue, and just the thought cracks their testimony. 

Share this post


Link to post
47 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

Do you know how dangerous it is to even think the church could be untrue, it's obliterated some testimonies out there. That tells something right there, that some out there have never considered it could be untrue, and just the thought cracks their testimony. 

I have a hard time believing that there are that many completely unimaginative people out there who have never even considered it.

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
4 hours ago, rockpond said:

{snip} Sunstoned wrote specifically of racism and civil rights.  I see those as for more than "popular societal trends".

That's a tautology, isn't it?

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
52 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I have a hard time believing that there are that many completely unimaginative people out there who have never even considered it.

I know two individuals (family members) who say proudly that they have never considered the church not to be true.

Maybe there’s more?

Share this post


Link to post
54 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I have a hard time believing that there are that many completely unimaginative people out there who have never even considered it.

You're looking at her!

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, SouthernMo said:

I know two individuals (family members) who say proudly that they have never considered the church not to be true.

Maybe there’s more?

That is like saying they have never thought of a pink elephant. 

By verbalizing the concept, they had to consider it. Perhaps only superficially, but they certainly understand the possibility exists.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
8 minutes ago, Calm said:

That is like saying they have never thought of a pink elephant. 

By verbalizing the concept, they had to consider it. Perhaps only superficially, but they certainly understand the possibility exists.

I don't think so. You are comparing two extremes. A pink elephant is not going to get me to the CK.

Share this post


Link to post
35 minutes ago, Calm said:

That is like saying they have never thought of a pink elephant. 

By verbalizing the concept, they had to consider it. Perhaps only superficially, but they certainly understand the possibility exists.

Perhaps they meant that they had never explored the possibility.  For some, it is easier to press forward with less consideration than for others.

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, SouthernMo said:

I know two individuals (family members) who say proudly that they have never considered the church not to be true.

Maybe there’s more?

Do you believe them? Not sure I would. Sounds like spiritual chest beating to me. I thought the same thing when an apostle said it though I was a little more unsure on that one.

1 hour ago, Tacenda said:

You're looking at her!

You have still never considered it? ;) 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
25 minutes ago, SouthernMo said:

Perhaps they meant that they had never explored the possibility.  For some, it is easier to press forward with less consideration than for others.

I think there is a happy medium. Some people seem to dismiss it and I imagine that absent great spirituality witness and testimony that would leave them spiritually brittle. On the other hand you have people who have to relitigate the gospel with every wind of doctrine. I liked President Kimball’s approach of deciding once what you are going to do and not worrying about it again. It sounds nice. I wish I knew how to do it.

Share this post


Link to post
1 minute ago, The Nehor said:

Do you believe them? Not sure I would. Sounds like spiritual chest beating to me. I thought the same thing when an apostle said it though I was a little more unsure on that one.

You have still never considered it? ;) 

You may be right. The tone I heard from my family members who said that was more spiritual chest beating.

But, I do remain convinced that some people are far more skeptical and questioning than others.  We’ll find extremes on both ends of the “considering if it’s not true” spectrum.

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)

The church is an organization.  I don't think it can be true or false.  It exists, it functions, we acknowledge that it's a going concern.

When someone says the church is true (or not), I wonder what they (personally) mean...

... that they believe all of its claims to be true?

... that they believe Christ lived and died for us?

... that they believe the plan of salvation is a real thing?

... that they trust in the authority of the priesthood?

 

We could go on and on with those questions.  I find the answers to those specifics to be more meaningful than the blanket statement.

Edited by rockpond
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
32 minutes ago, rockpond said:

The church is an organization.  I don't think it can be true or false.  It exists, it functions, we acknowledge that it's a going concern.

When someone says the church is true (or not), I wonder what they (personally) mean...

... that they believe all of its claims to be true?

... that they believe Christ lived and died for us?

... that they believe the plan of salvation is a real thing?

... that they trust in the authority of the priesthood?

 

We could go on and on with those questions.  I find the answers to those specifics to be more meaningful than the blanket statement.

I believe the question is more is if it the Kingdom of God on earth. That is what I mean when I equate it with truth.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Calm said:

That is like saying they have never thought of a pink elephant. 

By verbalizing the concept, they had to consider it. Perhaps only superficially, but they certainly understand the possibility exists.

I think it's quite different: It's more about giving consideration to an idea and having some level of openness to it.

I can truly say I've never thought about having an affair. Just because the concept exists, and I'm aware of it, doesn't mean I've given it any thought or consideration and would be open to it.

 

Edited by HappyJackWagon

Share this post


Link to post
41 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I believe the question is more is if it the Kingdom of God on earth. That is what I mean when I equate it with truth.

Joseph Smith would say that the Church is not the Kingdom of God on earth.  He clearly delineated between the two.  Subsequent prophets have disagreed with him, and agreed with you.

Weird how the words of the guy who LDS claim restored the Church of God would be rejected/altered by those leaders who came after him.

There's too much dogma in this church.  Drives me nuts...

Share this post


Link to post
11 minutes ago, SouthernMo said:

Joseph Smith would say that the Church is not the Kingdom of God on earth.  He clearly delineated between the two.  Subsequent prophets have disagreed with him, and agreed with you.

Weird how the words of the guy who LDS claim restored the Church of God would be rejected/altered by those leaders who came after him.

There's too much dogma in this church.  Drives me nuts...

I think the role of the Council of Fifty was subsumed back into the general church.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)
6 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

I think the role of the Council of Fifty was subsumed back into the general church.

Maybe. But, I don’t know of any teaching confirming or refuting that.

If the LDS church organization truly is the Kingdom of God on earth, then I am really disappointed.

This is it?  I’ve done all my home teaching and skipped Sunday sports events for this?  This is the reward?

Edited by SouthernMo

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, SouthernMo said:

If the LDS church organization truly is the Kingdom of God on earth, then I am really disappointed.

Mate, you must have been eating from the wrong end of the buffet.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
1 hour ago, SouthernMo said:

Maybe. But, I don’t know of any teaching confirming or refuting that.

If the LDS church organization truly is the Kingdom of God on earth, then I am really disappointed.

This is it?  I’ve done all my home teaching and skipped Sunday sports events for this?  This is the reward?

By that I mean the Kingdom of God organization. The fulness of the glory of the kingdom has to wait for the king. In any case I expect it gets better once the world is at least Terrestialized. If not, I may call it quits. I have met people who think the Millenium has already started and my response is that the prophets have really surpassed any semblance of advertising ethics if this is the promised peaceful Millenium. I also saw a lion eat a lamb on a nature documentary not too long ago.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
39 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

By that I mean the Kingdom of God organization. The fulness of the glory of the kingdom has to wait for the king. In any case I expect it gets better once the world is at least Terrestialized. If not, I may call it quits. I have met people who think the Millenium has already started and my response is that the prophets have really surpassed any semblance of advertising ethics if this is the promised peaceful Millenium. I also saw a lion eat a lamb on a nature documentary not too long ago.

Ok. I’ll bite.

What will the King (Jesus) do when he gets here to make the church/kingdom of god (since you say these are synonymous) better or to bring the “fullness?”

Also/or, what will He do to ‘terrestrialize’ it?  More palm trees & beaches, fewer earthquakes & volcanoes?

Also - mutton is delicious. Can you imagine being a lion and being told no more mutton?  Just grass?  Sorry, but the millennium sounds like it will suck for big cats. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
2 minutes ago, SouthernMo said:

Ok. I’ll bite.

What will the King (Jesus) do when he gets here to make the church/kingdom of god (since you say these are synonymous) better or to bring the “fullness?”

Also/or, what will He do to ‘terrestrialize’ it?  More palm trees & beaches, fewer earthquakes & volcanoes?

Also - mutton is delicious. Can you imagine being a lion and being told no more mutton?  Just grass?  Sorry, but the millennium sounds like it will suck for big cats. 

Well, first he burns the wicked that were ruining it for everyone. Satan gets thrown out so a lot of mischief goes away. I suspect the nature of matter will change somehow so that things do not decay with time.

One of my projects if we cannot eat meat from animals will be to create plants that grow steaks every time I mention this plan others back me up and promise to help so I think we can get it done pretty quickly and the big kitties can eat that.

Share this post


Link to post
6 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Well, first he burns the wicked that were ruining it for everyone. Satan gets thrown out so a lot of mischief goes away. I suspect the nature of matter will change somehow so that things do not decay with time.

One of my projects if we cannot eat meat from animals will be to create plants that grow steaks every time I mention this plan others back me up and promise to help so I think we can get it done pretty quickly and the big kitties can eat that.

Jesus with a flame thrower taking out all those uncelestial tea drinkers?

Have a hard time seeing joy in this...

Share this post


Link to post
7 hours ago, Bob Crockett said:

As well:

1.  Governor Ford breached his promise (as he admits in his biography) to provide protection to Joseph Smith at Carthage.  He personally withdrew the state militia to make room for the Carthage Greys.  Joseph Smith's basis for incarceration was "treason," a non-bailable offense.  His treason?  Using Nauvoo's chartered authority to quash subpoenas against him and in the ordering of the destruction of the Nauvoo Expositor.  Really?  That justified state-sanctioned murder?

2.  The Republican party sent out Evangelical ministers and supporters to masquerade as judges and public officials to confiscate the Church's property, while Democrats, Jews and Catholics complained.  

3.  The Republicans sponsored and passed legislation to disenfranchise LDS female voters.   

4.  In the early 1900s, the Republican-led Senate used the subpoena power of Congress to question LDS general authorities about their sexual relationships and the intimate details of the temple. 

So you are referencing things that happened more than 120 years ago?  Come on Bob.  You know that was not what I was responding to. 

Share this post


Link to post
21 hours ago, Wade Englund said:

I was kidding. I really do care.

Thanks, -Wade Englund-

So do I.  But you are too nice of a guy to argue with.

Share this post


Link to post
Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, SouthernMo said:

Jesus with a flame thrower taking out all those uncelestial tea drinkers?

Just for the sake of accuracy, Latter-day Saint belief is that the earth will be cleansed of the wicked at the Lord's coming, i.e. those with telestial behaviour. This leaves all good and honourable people, most of whom will not be of our faith.

More importantly, one of the things I've learnt is that heaven is available in the here and now. We can be surrounded by everything that might go away in any future cleansing and still be filled with immeasurable peace and unspeakable joy. We can have the angels as our companions.

Edited by Hamba Tuhan
  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...