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The Nehor

Notre Dame on fire

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15 minutes ago, RevTestament said:

Oh, now your including me with supremacists - not just conspiracists. I haven't even said it was arson. That doesn't make the circumstances any less suspicious - especially after a man is arrested in St Patrick's in New York with two gasoline cans and lighter fluid - yet another Catholic Church set to go up in flames. And this was after he was arrested Mon night for refusing to leave a Church in Newark.  https://abc7news.com/man-arrested-at-st-patricks-with-gas-cans-had-ticket-to-rome/5256911/ Nope. No conspiracy there because the man in just a mentally disturbed kook. Keep telling people not to be alarmed - nothing is going on untoward - let's just assume  there are no conspiracies while we watch the Churches burn - Or we can be cautious - set up cameras and security. I mean how many cases of arson do you need before you raise the flag of caution? Instead we should label any such cautious people as supremacists.... typical... they should hire you as their PR man. 

I don't know, would you label David Duke a white supremacist?

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53 minutes ago, Gray said:

I don't know, would you label David Duke a white supremacist?

You are just not going to stop are you? Now you are associating me with KKK. Just who is the conspiracist here?

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5 hours ago, RevTestament said:

You are just not going to stop are you? Now you are associating me with KKK. Just who is the conspiracist here?

I never associate you with anyone. I said it was a conspiracy theory currently bandied about by white supremacists to justify some of their unsavory ideas and white western culture. Ergo, it's better not to spread conspiracy theories and wait for actual evidence. I do not for one minute think you are a white supremacist.

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On 4/18/2019 at 11:04 PM, Gray said:

I never associate you with anyone. I said it was a conspiracy theory currently bandied about by white supremacists to justify some of their unsavory ideas and white western culture. Ergo, it's better not to spread conspiracy theories and wait for actual evidence. I do not for one minute think you are a white supremacist.

Jeeze.  Just because some white supremacist says that it might be arson doesn't automatically mean that it wasn't arson. 

I agree that nobody should be making unfounded assertions, and especially shouldn't be touting them as true when nothing has been officially concluded, but given the current spate of church burnings and descrecrations which have been going on in France, it is entirely reasonable to suspect that the blaze may have been intentional rather than accidental.  That was among the first thoughts that occurred to me, along with the opposite, namely that as an active worksite an accidental fire was very likely.  The second thoughts I had were these: there would be all kinds of unfounded speculation that the fire was deliberate and some of the speculators would say who they thought had done it; there would also be those who were pretty sure that there would be plenty of unfounded speculation about the cause of the fire, and some of these folks would bend over backwards accusing those making speculations of being bad people for having those suspicions, and accusing them of promulgating conspiracy theories.

It is a fact that the fire MIGHT have been deliberately set.  It is also a fact that fire MIGHT have been an unfortunate accident.  There are grounds for preferring one alternative over the other.  Just because you disagree with someone over the cause doesn't make them a conspiracy theorist.  

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On 4/15/2019 at 12:32 PM, The Nehor said:

Police are concerned that a second hunchback might set fire to the Louvre.

Footage of him sliding down on a zip line with a beautiful gypsy lady. 

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Stargazer said:

Jeeze.  Just because some white supremacist says that it might be arson doesn't automatically mean that it wasn't arson. 

I agree that nobody should be making unfounded assertions, and especially shouldn't be touting them as true when nothing has been officially concluded, but given the current spate of church burnings and descrecrations which have been going on in France, it is entirely reasonable to suspect that the blaze may have been intentional rather than accidental.  That was among the first thoughts that occurred to me, along with the opposite, namely that as an active worksite an accidental fire was very likely.  The second thoughts I had were these: there would be all kinds of unfounded speculation that the fire was deliberate and some of the speculators would say who they thought had done it; there would also be those who were pretty sure that there would be plenty of unfounded speculation about the cause of the fire, and some of these folks would bend over backwards accusing those making speculations of being bad people for having those suspicions, and accusing them of promulgating conspiracy theories.

It is a fact that the fire MIGHT have been deliberately set.  It is also a fact that fire MIGHT have been an unfortunate accident.  There are grounds for preferring one alternative over the other.  Just because you disagree with someone over the cause doesn't make them a conspiracy theorist.  

Maybe it was just the "Immaculate fire" set by an widely recognized force known as karma. 

Sorry, I just got back from a comedy show and one set was mostly about this.

Edited by Jean-Luc Picard
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Investigation into the cause is ongoing, but the initial report from officials is that they suspect an electrical fault, nothing suspicious. 

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8 hours ago, Jean-Luc Picard said:

Maybe it was just the "Immaculate fire" set by an widely recognized force known as karma. 

Sorry, I just got back from a comedy show and one set was mostly about this.

Not hilarious, but made me smile.

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Jean-Luc Picard said:

Maybe it was just the "Immaculate fire" set by an widely recognized force known as karma. 

Sorry, I just got back from a comedy show and one set was mostly about this.

Maybe it is my ignorance of Catholicism, but I don't get it. Immaculate fire? 

Wait. Catholics like burning people, and now they get something of theirs burned? Hmmmm. Still not very funny or clever, to me anyway. 

What are you thinking with the "Immaculate fire"? Are there fires that are "conceived" in original sin? Of course I know you don't mean that. One of the biggest differences between LDS and everybody else is that LDS hold that everyone is immaculately conceived. Catholics agree with LDS when it comes to the Virgin Mary. 

Anyway, if you or Stargazer could enlighten me, I sometimes appreciate theogical humor. My favorite is on the Jehovah's Witnesses, who don't believe in hell, and don't believe in observing any kind of holiday.

So with all due respect to JW beliefs, as you surely have for the RC's, the funny thing about Jehovah's Witnesses is their favorite Christmas hymn!

No hell. No hell. No hell. Born is the king of Israel. Pretty good, eh? Disclaimer. Sadly, I only repeat that joke. I have never made a good joke myself. You get the joke, even if it is weak? Most people seem unamused at my telling of it though I trot it out several times a decade. I never think of it. I probably need more practice in the telling. Thanks for reminding me of it. It always amuses me. I just don't understand your joke.

Thanks for your help.

3DOP

Edited by 3DOP

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7 hours ago, 3DOP said:

Maybe it is my ignorance of Catholicism, but I don't get it. Immaculate fire? 

Wait. Catholics like burning people, and now they get something of theirs burned? Hmmmm. Still not very funny or clever, to me anyway. 

What are you thinking with the "Immaculate fire"? Are there fires that are "conceived" in original sin? Of course I know you don't mean that. One of the biggest differences between LDS and everybody else is that LDS hold that everyone is immaculately conceived. Catholics agree with LDS when it comes to the Virgin Mary. 

Anyway, if you or Stargazer could enlighten me, I sometimes appreciate theogical humor. My favorite is on the Jehovah's Witnesses, who don't believe in hell, and don't believe in observing any kind of holiday.

So with all due respect to JW beliefs, as you surely have for the RC's, the funny thing about Jehovah's Witnesses is their favorite Christmas hymn!

No hell. No hell. No hell. Born is the king of Israel. Pretty good, eh? Disclaimer. Sadly, I only repeat that joke. I have never made a good joke myself. You get the joke, even if it is weak? Most people seem unamused at my telling of it though I trot it out several times a decade. I never think of it. I probably need more practice in the telling. Thanks for reminding me of it. It always amuses me. I just don't understand your joke.

Thanks for your help.

3DOP

The comedy bit was about the cover-up of the crimes of priests.

Catholicism has a pretty horrid past, like many old organizations. From priest scandals, to crimes during WWII to the Inquisition. Built up Karma...this all in jest. 

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, 3DOP said:

Anyway, if you or Stargazer could enlighten me, I sometimes appreciate theogical humor. My favorite is on the Jehovah's Witnesses, who don't believe in hell, and don't believe in observing any kind of holiday.

It's a VERY labored pun.  It evoked a smile upon my first reading, but upon further reflection I didn't think it was all that funny, and I don't really like it.

The jokester was trying to pun on immaculate conception and relate the fire to karma or revenge on Catholicism for all the bad things done by it over the millennia.  The joke actually sucks.  

Edited to add: OK, I see that Picard has explained his own joke now.

Edited by Stargazer

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Jean-Luc Picard said:

The comedy bit was about the cover-up of the crimes of priests.

Catholicism has a pretty horrid past, like many old organizations. From priest scandals, to crimes during WWII to the Inquisition. Built up Karma...this all in jest. 

Another "old organization" is comparable to Catholicism for having a horrid past? Surely you still jest! 

 

Edited by 3DOP

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Stargazer said:

It's a VERY labored pun.  It evoked a smile upon my first reading, but upon further reflection I didn't think it was all that funny, and I don't really like it.

The jokester was trying to pun on immaculate conception and relate the fire to karma or revenge on Catholicism for all the bad things done by it over the millennia.  The joke actually sucks.  

Edited to add: OK, I see that Picard has explained his own joke now.

I have to agree the joke wasn't very good. Just a chance for someone to vent their personal feelings. Luckily they only had three minutes to share their set, then on the next person with a better set.

But then again, maybe Karma has been building like static electricity, or maybe the workers plugged too many tools into an outlet 😉

Edited by Jean-Luc Picard

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Just recently watched an interview with a former head architect that supervised Notre Dame for 13 years. He said that there were TWO flash points in the roof, and also that fire personnel were on duty 24/7 to watch for just such events. He also said he was surprised that the large oak roof timbers burned so easily. I personally have held a blowtorch on a large timber for several minutes and the tiny fire produced quickly died out when the heat source was removed. 

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1 hour ago, strappinglad said:

Just recently watched an interview with a former head architect that supervised Notre Dame for 13 years. He said that there were TWO flash points in the roof, and also that fire personnel were on duty 24/7 to watch for just such events. He also said he was surprised that the large oak roof timbers burned so easily. I personally have held a blowtorch on a large timber for several minutes and the tiny fire produced quickly died out when the heat source was removed. 

The news confuses me. Like you, I have some experience with really thick, old lumber. That stuff does not burn unless there is a considerable amount of coals created from smaller, more flammable starter material. There must be something that I am missing. 

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2 hours ago, Storm Rider said:

There must be something that I am missing. 

According to some here, you and I are both missing our tin foil hats.!😎

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