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Are we as open as we ask others to be?

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There’s a beautiful worship service every Sunday night in Seattle that is broadcast on classic radio , and when I’m visiting I’ll go see it live.  Episcopalian church, monks I believe.  It’s beautiful.  

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On 3/12/2019 at 8:26 PM, Kenngo1969 said:

I don't know.  I certainly cannot, and therefore, do not presume to, speak for "the bulk of Latter-day Saints."  I believe I have been very consistent in advocating that approach.

In my experience your approach is a rarity.

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1 hour ago, MustardSeed said:

There’s a beautiful worship service every Sunday night in Seattle that is broadcast on classic radio , and when I’m visiting I’ll go see it live.  Episcopalian church, monks I believe.  It’s beautiful.  

This is exactly what I was referring to in my post of two days ago. Every Christian group has its own strengths, and therefore weaknesses, in manifesting the overall attributes of Christianity. Reading the works of A W Tozer of the Christian and Missionary Alliance will never threaten your Mormon faith, but will most likely strengthen your Christian faith and could motivate you to greater piety. That has been its impact on me.

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Just saw these quotes and quite liked them. This may or may not belong on this thread, but the part about being open to things does. 

Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

 

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8 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

Just saw these quotes and quite liked them. This may or may not belong on this thread, but the part about being open to things does. 

Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

 

Wow! i really like that second one a lot. That may be my new signature on my emails. Thanks for posting

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Tacenda said:

Just saw these quotes and quite liked them. This may or may not belong on this thread, but the part about being open to things does. 

Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Keep the company of those who seek the truth - run from those who have found it -Václav Havel

 

I agree with the purported quotations of Frater Ravus and Vaclav Havel, in principle.  I think it behooves anyone who purports to be in possession of the truth, whatever the source, to exercise humility and open-mindedness (provided that one is not so open minded that one runs the risk that his brain will fall out ;)), and  I don't think one should be too provincial in one's possession of what purports to be the truth.  We ought to remember that none of us sees the truth as it is, but, rather, as we are.  All of that having been said, with all due respect, It's difficult to respond intelligently to the visual equivalent of sound bites without knowing the original context in which the purported quotations were spoken or written.  

Edited by Kenngo1969

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Teancum said:

In my experience your approach is a rarity.

Of course, your experience is your experience.  Perhaps even somewhat differing beliefs which, nonetheless, bear good fruits in the lives of their adherents can be understood in light of the final sentence of the 13th Article of Faith.  I think it behooves us to laud those who "seek after" good fruit that is "virtuous, lovely, of good report or praiseworthy" even if their beliefs differ somewhat from our own.  As I mentioned in one of the essays I linked to earlier in the thread from my Blog, I don't believe God gives me fruit, bread, and fish when I ask for them while giving those of other faiths thorns, thistles, stones, and serpents, despite the fact that those not of my faith also asked God for the first three things on that list.  (See Matthew 7:9-11, 16-20).  As I also mentioned in that essay, quality of fruit matters more than yield, even if, from my perspective, I have received "an hundredfold" harvest as a result of my membership in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.  (See Matthew 13:1-23).

And we could all spend more time (and would be better served) as members of the Church of Jesus Christ attempting to build bridges among ourselves and those of other faiths rather than attempting to tear them down.  While I would not and do not presume to speak for anyone else, it would surprise me if others I could cite as examples would disagree with the assertions I make above.  For example, Robert Millet, Roger Keller, and Dan Peterson, all of Brigham Young University (whether currently, or at least formerly so), have labored to build bridges of religious understanding between members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and those of other faiths.  Their work should not be discounted.  However sparse the numbers of their like-minded fellows may be, surely, there are others of that ilk, as well.  

President Gordon B. Hinckley (and he wasn't the first President of the Church to make such an invitation) invited those not of our faith to bring the good that they have with them, and to let us, as members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, see if we could add to it.  It seems sure that such an invitation wouldn't make sense if there were no good to be found in the different faith traditions of others, doesn't it?  Similarly (while I hope you'll forgive me for lacking references), Joseph Smith reportedly said that it does not prove that a man is not a good man simply because he errs in doctrine, and Brigham Young reportedly said that a good man is a good man, whether in the Church of Jesus Christ or out of it.

Elder B.H. Roberts said:

Quote

 

While the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is established for the instruction of men; and it is one of God’s instrumentalities for making known the truth yet he is not limited to that institution for such purposes, neither in time nor place. God raises up wise men and prophets here and there among all the children of men, of their own tongue and nationality, speaking to them through means that they can comprehend. … All the great teachers are servants of God; among all nations and in all ages. They are inspired men, appointed to instruct God’s children according to the conditions in the midst of which he finds them. [Endnote omitted.]

Source: James A. Toronto (August 2000), Ensign, "A Latter-day Saint Perspective on Muhammad," accessed on line at https://www.lds.org/study/ensign/2000/08/a-latter-day-saint-perspective-on-muhammad?lang=eng on March 14, 2019.

 

In 1975, the First Presidency, then consisting of Presidents Spencer W. Kimball, Marion G. Romney, and N. Eldon Tanner, respectively, issued the following statement:

Quote

“Based upon ancient and modern revelation, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints gladly teaches and declares the Christian doctrine that all men and women are brothers and sisters, not only by blood relationship from mortal progenitors, but also as literal spirit children of an Eternal Father.

“The great religious leaders of the world such as Mohammed, Confucius, and the Reformers, as well as philosophers including Socrates, Plato, and others, received a portion of God’s light. Moral truths were given to them by God to enlighten whole nations and to bring a higher level of understanding to individuals.

“The Hebrew prophets prepared the way for the coming of Jesus Christ, the promised Messiah, who should provide salvation for all mankind who believe in the gospel.

“Consistent with these truths, we believe that God has given and will give to all people sufficient knowledge to help them on their way to eternal salvation, either in this life or in the life to come.

“We also declare that the gospel of Jesus Christ, restored to his Church in our day, provides the only way to a mortal life of happiness and a fullness of joy forever. For those who have not received this gospel, the opportunity will come to them in the life hereafter if not in this life.

“Our message therefore is one of special love and concern for the eternal welfare of all men and women, regardless of religious belief, race, or nationality, knowing that we are truly brothers and sisters because we are the sons and daughters of the same Eternal Father.”

Source:: As quoted by R. Lanier Britsch (January 1988), "What is the relationship of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to the non-Christian religions of the world?," Ensign, accessed on line at the following address:  https://www.lds.org/study/ensign/1988/01/i-have-a-question/what-is-the-relationship-of-the-church-of-jesus-christ-of-latter-day-saints-to-the-non-christian-religions-of-the-world?lang=eng on March 14, 2019

 

 

Edited by Kenngo1969

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14 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

Of course, your experience is your experience.  Perhaps even somewhat differing beliefs which, nonetheless, bear good fruits in the lives of their adherents can be understood in light of the final sentence of the 13th Article of Faith.  I think it behooves us to laud those who "seek after" good fruit that is "virtuous, lovely, of good report or praiseworthy" even if their beliefs differ somewhat from our own.  As I mentioned in one of the essays I linked to earlier in the thread from my Blog, I don't believe God gives me fruit, bread, and fish when I ask for them while giving those of other faiths thorns, thistles, stones, and serpents, despite the fact that those not of my faith also asked God for the first three things on that list.  (See Matthew 7:9-11, 16-20).  As I also mentioned in that essay, quality of fruit matters more than yield, even if, from my perspective, I have received "an hundredfold" harvest as a result of my membership in the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.   

And we could all spend more time (and would be better served) as members of the Church of Jesus Christ attempting to build bridges among ourselves and those of other faiths rather than attempting to tear them down.  While I would not and do not presume to speak for anyone else, it would surprise me if others I could cite as examples would disagree with the assertions I make above.  For example, Robert Millet, Roger Keller, and Dan Peterson, all of Brigham Young University (whether currently, or at least formerly so), have labored to build bridges of religious understanding between members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and those of other faiths.  Their work should not be discounted.  However sparse the numbers of their like-minded fellows may be, surely, there are others of that ilk, as well.  

President Gordon B. Hinckley (and he wasn't the first President of the Church to make such an invitation) invited those not of our faith to bring the good that they have with them, and to let us, as members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, see if we could add to it.  It seems sure that such an invitation wouldn't make sense if there were no good to be found in the different faith traditions of others, doesn't it?  Similarly (while I hope you'll forgive me for lacking references), Joseph Smith reportedly said that it does not prove that a man is not a good man simply because he errs in doctrine, and Brigham Young reportedly said that a good man is a good man, whether in the Church of Jesus Christ or out of it.

Well said my friend. The basis for interfaith dialogue is that we each can and should add to the other's goodness and faith. 

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Tacenda said:

Faith does not give you the answers, it just stops you asking the questions. -Frater Ravus

Not the type of faith I feel or see.  Sounds like someone who had their own limited experience of faith and then insists that must be how everyone else experiences it.

I see that as bad as saying if someone doesn't believe they have received s relaxation  the Book of Mormon is true, they must be spiritually hard hearted/blind.

Edited by Calm
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