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poptart

Depression getting bad

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It's getting worse, curious what else I can do.  Getting mental health care here is kind of a nightmare. 

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Posted (edited)

What kind of natural and alternative therapies or habits or coping are you doing?

 

The reason I ask is I don't want to recommend anything you are already doing.

Edited by Maidservant

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Really, really tough question - follow the advice of your counselor. Make absolutely certain that you are eating a healthy diet; getting daily exercise; and a balanced, appropriate amount of sleep - those three things are totally within your control and have a major impact on reducing the impact of depression. 

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16 minutes ago, Storm Rider said:

Really, really tough question - follow the advice of your counselor. Make absolutely certain that you are eating a healthy diet; getting daily exercise; and a balanced, appropriate amount of sleep - those three things are totally within your control and have a major impact on reducing the impact of depression. 

Actually all of those things may not totally be in control by a person that is deeply depressed. Just going to sleep may be an exercise in futility as the mind reuses to shut down. I agree that physical activity can lessen the effects of depression but if a person's depression is clinical, caused by a chemical imbalance, he or she can wake in a depressed state so debilitating, so enervating, that there is no will to move. I hope that poptart is not to that point and can take your good advice.

Glenn

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Given the time of year, if you are not going outside much, try to get out and get sunlight for a half an hour or even 20 minutes as soon as you are able. Seasonal affective disorder can hit hard. I am having a harder time this year than since I lived in Canada, I think due to the weather (though it could be combination of life just got too complicated) being colder than usual and not being able to get outside due to fires in summer.  I don’t know if you are in a location where that might be affecting you. 

This is something that wouldn’t cause side effects. If you can combine with a walk, even better. 

Have you had a thorough physical work up?  I would suggest minimum of testing thyroid, vitamin d, calcium and magnesium deficiencies if you can get it done. Even if you can’t get mental health very well, eliminating possible physical complications might help alleviate some of the intensity. 

I am hesitant to recommend nutritional supplements because even those can throw you off if sensitive (anything that works as a stimulant affects my anxiety level, for example my most recent episode might even have been made worse by too much hibiscus tea as that can raise blood pressure, I was using very strong strength because I love the flavor and have been craving carbs).

Please do research and ask your doctor if it would be safe for you to try Tryptophan or Tyrosine. Both are amino acids, you need to take them on an empty stomach or with juice (no proteins).  The first affects serotonin, the second dopamine. please don’t try either if taking any medications as that could raise levels too high. My daughter got extremely woozy and almost passed out when trying tryptophan while medicated and she didn’t realize it might pushed her levels too high. She is diabetic so it likely was something to do with her blood sugar, but it makes me very leary about combining meds and supplements  

You could also try magnesium or calcium or both to help with anxiety, relaxing. Please do research and start low to avoid screwing up digestion. Calcium can constipate. Too much magnesium can cause diarrhea which throws off others needs. Plus different kinds can affect you differently, so finding the best fit requires you to study up on choices. Finding a good quality would be important as well  (something I need to research myself) to ensure you are getting what you expect  

Anything else I do not feel comfortable because everyone is so individual. Like I said check with your doctor.  WebMD and the Mayo site may help with ideas to talk with your doctor about. 

Edited by Calm
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1 hour ago, Glenn101 said:

Actually all of those things may not totally be in control by a person that is deeply depressed. Just going to sleep may be an exercise in futility as the mind reuses to shut down. I agree that physical activity can lessen the effects of depression but if a person's depression is clinical, caused by a chemical imbalance, he or she can wake in a depressed state so debilitating, so enervating, that there is no will to move. I hope that poptart is not to that point and can take your good advice.

Glenn

I am finding it very hard to even turn on my SAD light when I wake up or take my vitamins this winter at times. It is just too hard to think or care.   Sometimes even turning on my other side in bed seems an effort  So ridiculous, but impossible to talk myself out of feeling that way  

Not intense depression for me thankfully, it is manifesting as apathy...but frustrating because I know stuff that will help but can’t get myself to do it consistently. Hoping spring will make a difference. 

People who haven’t experienced that sort of limbo probably find it hard to realize how it feels. It is not laziness or lack of willpower. 

Edited by Calm
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And talk to your pharmacist about drug interactions and possible side effects of supplements.  They may be able to suggest something from your history and can be aware of problems your doctor might be less familiar with. 

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Too much carrot cake?  Seriously, you want to watch something simple like eating too much sugar.

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10 minutes ago, Robert F. Smith said:

Too much carrot cake?  Seriously, you want to watch something simple like eating too much sugar.

I was thinking the same thing.  I crave sweetness when depressed, which can make things worse, so I try to eat protein with any snack in hope of not getting too hungry, etc.  Also eat protein before I go to sleep along with a little carb to avoid a middle of the night hunger strike.

Edited by Calm
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Just know you have a friend here that knows where you are coming from.  PM me if you like. I care.

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Posted (edited)

Thanks for the advice, it's appreciated.

Edited by poptart

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25 minutes ago, poptart said:

Thanks for the advice, it's appreciated.

Hope things get better for you.

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Many in today's world are Vitamin D deficient and take a daily 2000 IU of D3 because of it.   Deficiencies affect the immune system and it can impact mental health among other things.

If you cannot find or afford cognitive behavioral therapy in your area (and it is tough because many therapists who claim to do it, don't with fidelity), some benefit from the exercises in David Burn's "feeling sad", or online CBT  https://ecouch.anu.edu.au/welcome

While it is not a substitute for medical and psychological help, some find some measure of relief by seeking a priesthood blessing (look up your address at meetinghouselocator.com and it will identify your bishop (and he is bishop of everyone in that geographical location, whether they claim him as that or not, so feel free to ask him to send priesthood holders to give you one, if you want, and maybe someone to come to your house, and walk a half mile with you every day, or take you with them while they are serving someone else --- both of which can help distract from depression).

 

 

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39 minutes ago, rpn said:

Many in today's world are Vitamin D deficient and take a daily 2000 IU of D3 because of it.   Deficiencies affect the immune system and it can impact mental health among other things.

If you cannot find or afford cognitive behavioral therapy in your area (and it is tough because many therapists who claim to do it, don't with fidelity), some benefit from the exercises in David Burn's "feeling sad", or online CBT  https://ecouch.anu.edu.au/welcome

While it is not a substitute for medical and psychological help, some find some measure of relief by seeking a priesthood blessing (look up your address at meetinghouselocator.com and it will identify your bishop (and he is bishop of everyone in that geographical location, whether they claim him as that or not, so feel free to ask him to send priesthood holders to give you one, if you want, and maybe someone to come to your house, and walk a half mile with you every day, or take you with them while they are serving someone else --- both of which can help distract from depression).

 

 

Dumb question, would the bishop be that nice to an outsider?  Not like I have anything to offer. 
Supposedly Co does pay for mental health, I've debated for a while now just giving it another try. 

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Like I said, he is bishop to everyone in your geographic location.  That means he has been called to be a shepherd to you.  I cannot tell you what he will do --- because he is your bishop, he's entitled to inspiration from God about what would be the way to help you, after all-----, and even if he assigns someone to help you out in the ways I described or other ways, he cannot be certain that the member asked would actually follow through.   But I know that I did exactly what I described daily for almost four months, when asked, and I'm pretty sure that there are many disciples of Christ who would step up when asked to do the same.   (And if you get blessed/lucky,  you may even make one or more friends in the process.)   Worst case is that you don't get the help you ask for, and that you don't get help that helps either.   You won't be worse off if that is the case, so no harm in asking.

ETA:  To the extent you are able, you should pay for the help you need ---- this is part of the doctrine of the church so that we preserve our independence and agency by not getting inappropriately dependent on others such that they are enabling us---, so consider hiring a high school or college kid directly to walk with you, if that is within your capability, maybe through Task Rabbit or maybe by putting up a flyer in your local grocery story, or in the LDS Institute building (where college students hang out, typically near a college).   But there is still no shame at all ever for reaching out for help that you cannot do for yourself, so don't get into thinking that you shouldn't ask because you should be able to do what you at the moment cannot do --- THAT isn't what I'm saying or what is required AT ALL.  When you do get to a better place, then just find a way to pay it forward.

Edited by rpn
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Vitamin D is possibly best absorbed eaten with your dinner meal, some studies show, btw.

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Phew... I’ve been retired from practice for over a decade so please understand my thoughts are from me as an individual more so than a past clinician...

first let me say I hope you’ve talked with your primary healthcare provider (doc), and that they are willing to hear you, listen, and ask questions before whipping out their prescription pad.

second, don’t be intimidated by antidepressants, when you get on the one best for you, at the right dosage it literally can be like the dark looming clouds over life have parted and light and sunshine reappears in your life.   But having said that so often it’s a trial and error effort on your position to try and find the right medication at the right dose, and sadly that can take weeks if not months.  I do know that some work better than others for most people, and according to age and weight and history, doses are pretty easy to figure out pretty quickly. Provided again you have a primary healthcare provider he’s paying attention.

Third, The suggestion of SAD (seasonal affect disorder) is very real, and effects millions around the world.  In the case of this typically when springtime comes he will expect to see a bus of a depression. If it is not SAD and maybe not so and maybe not good to wait around to find out.

Fourth, there are co-occurring disorders, i.e. having more than one thing going on, that can cause depression or can cause depression to get worse. Some of those have already been suggested, and  i’d highly recommend it for you to start investigating on your own, get lab work done that will check your levels of your vitamins etc. to see if you’re deficient in anything.  But truly a simple thing like a thyroid  imbalance, a vitamin or mineral deficiency, etc. can truly make a depression happen or be worse.

Fifth, and I don’t know what your insurance is like, but there are his genetic testing now that’s available to tell what the better medications are for patients, I probably should have more confidence in it than I do, but I’m an old dog and I like to see the data over a period of time before I jump in and say this is the best thing in the world. So far I haven’t seen you to be the best thing in the world but I can help a clinician maybe find a better if not best medication if it turns out you need an antidepressant.  

Sixth, it Is probably in your best interest to see a therapist, the problem is you never know if you got a good therapist or a bad therapist unless you’re in the field yourself and even then sometimes we’re not 100% sure until we’ve seen them screw up a patient.  I will say that a good therapist should never make you feel bad, should never leave you walking out of a session feeling bad, and if they start making you feel uncomfortable or like they’re not helping you - chances are they’re not helping you.   I tell this to everyone - It’s way too easy to get a license to be a therapist, counselor, etc. and because treatment happens in a private session we can’t always be sure what they’re doing is best for the patient. So I always go by the guidelines if they’re not making you feel better, or worse than making you feel worse, find another therapist… Even if you have to go through five or six therapist to find one good one, that’s probably about the odds anyway.  Sadly.

Seventh, Not everybody can have a pet, but the suggestion of a pet was a good idea if you like animals. If not possible to have a pet or you don’t want to pet, do you have a hobby that you enjoy? Can you think of a hobby that you could start that you might enjoy?

eighth, Suggestion about getting out the house is right, spot on. Even if you don’t want to get dressed or get out of bed for that matter, you will feel better if you get out the house especially if you’re interacting with a group of people or even just someone special to you. Or someone that could become special to you. Most communities have groups, senior groups, retire groups, widowed groups, hobby groups etc...  check into them and see what’s available, even if you don’t think you want to do it make yourself do it. After a while it may take a while you’ll be glad you did. 

Ninth, What do you remember or not I assume you are center on this site, I would totally recommend talking to your bishop, but if you’re not a member of the Mormon church, then talk to a pastor or preacher or some religious leader who not only could spend time chatting with you, but might also direct you towards a good position, a good therapist, some great groups belong to, I just give you a sense that someone there cares. I can say by all the responses here are you definitely have a lot of people that care.

Last thing and I can’t impress us when most of all why are strongly enough.... never ever give up.  I know that sounds very simple, simplistic, but I have talked to so many people over my lifetime you’re just hearing that reminded them to hold on. Sometimes we have to change things in our lives - sometimes little things sometimes big things, but change can open up opportunities.   But the very first thing you want to do is talk to your doctor - make sure you tell the appointment clerk you need extra time to talk, thats important because so often doctors are booking patients 5-10 minutes at a time, and in this situation I would expect 15 or 20 minutes to be more appropriate.   If that’s not something they can do, then maybe you need to re-shop your doc.   And I don’t say that lightly, but I will say this and closing and this applies to doctors, therapist, even religious leaders - no one is perfect, and each has a life separate from their job.... we are not all created equal.  I’ve fired my share of doctors who either lost or wasn’t as vested in my healthcare as I was.....  typically there’s always a replacement right around the corner. And looking for a good referral often is a good way to start if you do need new doc.   Let’s hope that just you’re going to them and talking, and them listening will make a difference for you. God bless 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Gayle said:

i am definitely an old dog, I am forever battling with auto-correct and voice texting.  I want to apologize for all the many errors in my post and if clarification is needed please do not hesitate to ask.   I literally checked it for spelling and word appropriateness before I hit ‘send’ and it still came up weird.

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Gayle said:

 

You will be able to edit at 25 posts.  I gave up on voice texting for that reason...always missing the errors.

I found it understandable.  :)

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13 hours ago, Gayle said:

 

Welcome to the board Gayle!!

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