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cksalmon

Intense Conversation with a Mormon: Trigger Warning --> James White

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https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=james+white+intense+conversation&docid=608018753205309065&mid=C28BA9DB567281CE1412C28BA9DB567281CE1412&view=detail&FORM=VIRE

Yes, I used Bing. 

No, I haven't watched this all the way through. 

Watching now. 

I am thus far impressed with James White's demeanor in this particular, specific debate. Believe it or not, I have some problems with James White. I think he has, at times, gone off the rails. 

At any rate, this young Mormon is acquitting himself quite well, thus far. 

Cheers!

 

 

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Oh, snap! Divine Council. 

Gonna have to pull out my Heiser dissertation. 

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re: esoteric doctrine (aka exaltation of Heavenly Father)

"We don't have much information about it. So everything is sort of a suggested kind of theory."

Yes, this is my bumpkin version of live-tweeting. 

 

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JW: Is the KFD esoteric doctrine?

M (aka The Mormon -- gotta get his name): You can be unsure about KFD and still be a Mormon-in-good-standing. (<-- that's a synopsis; check it out for yourself)

 

 

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M is the anti-Dale-Tuggy.

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M dude is on a very "anti-Mormon" podcast show. So, give him props. 

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Podcast host: Name one book on your shelf about the Trinity. 

M: something by Tim Keller*

* Presbyterian popularizer at best. 

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M (to JW): I think you're an incredibly smart man. I think you are kind as well. 

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M: before the NT, is the Godhead still a Trinity or is it a two persons?

Excellent question.

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As a Trinitarian, full stop. I do have the same question. So...

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Wow. Totally misread M. I was thinking binitarianism === Father, Son. M is excluding Son from pre-NT. 

Disagree.

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JW: without meaning to, supports binitarianism. Word (the Son) was God. No mention of Spirit.

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JW: Is your spirit still in Provo?

M says his spirit is eternal, no bound by space and time. 

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17 hours ago, cksalmon said:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=james+white+intense+conversation&amp;docid=608018753205309065&amp;mid=C28BA9DB567281CE1412C28BA9DB567281CE1412&amp;view=detail&amp;FORM=VIRE

Yes, I used Bing. 

No, I haven't watched this all the way through. 

Watching now. 

I am thus far impressed with James White's demeanor in this particular, specific debate. Believe it or not, I have some problems with James White. I think he has, at times, gone off the rails. 

At any rate, this young Mormon is acquitting himself quite well, thus far. 

Cheers!

 

 

I agree, he definitely doesn't back down. And like he mentions, he was Protestant until the age 15, so grew up studying the Bible, I'm thinking, which helps a ton in his arguments. 

But too bad they concentrated the majority of the time on the Trinity, and the archeology in the BoM. 

Edited by Tacenda

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18 hours ago, cksalmon said:

I am thus far impressed with James White's demeanor in this particular, specific debate. Believe it or not, I have some problems with James White. I think he has, at times, gone off the rails. \

James White is a man who makes his profession by bearing false witness to the people he preaches to (via knowingly and purposely misrepresenting other people's beliefs).  He might put one sheets clothing very nicely, but a liar is always that.  This particular "debate" is no different: he is just like the Pharisees of old-- trying to trick the other person with fancy word games and misrepresentation. 

The LDS dude is one of the guys from YouTube show "Saints Unscripted" (formally known as "3 Mormons").  I have always liked his work.

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18 hours ago, cksalmon said:

re: esoteric doctrine (aka exaltation of Heavenly Father)

"We don't have much information about it. So everything is sort of a suggested kind of theory."

Personally, I feel that we have plenty to go on for the exaltation of Heavenly Father, but that the brethern had to back down from it due to a golden-calf moment. That's not a knock against the brethern.

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7 hours ago, Jane_Doe said:

James White is a man who makes his profession by bearing false witness to the people he preaches to (via knowingly and purposely misrepresenting other people's beliefs).  He might put one sheets clothing very nicely, but a liar is always that.  This particular "debate" is no different: he is just like the Pharisees of old-- trying to trick the other person with fancy word games and misrepresentation. 

The LDS dude is one of the guys from YouTube show "Saints Unscripted" (formally known as "3 Mormons").  I have always liked his work.

The later portions of this debate were posted in another thread.

JW does misrepresent the beliefs of others (ok, he lies about them).  He claims to "know" LDS doctrine and history, yet he doesn't act like it. 

Also, either he is not really familiar with Hebrew OR he is willing to let his debating partner misrepresent it.  Letting a false information stand without correction is to perpetrate a deception. 

I think the "kid" did well, but he let a few false premises get introduced without question. 

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