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esodije

Status of Discovery in Denson Lawsuit

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Posted (edited)
Quote

"Someone came into my home and put drano in my orange juice".

"Someone set my car on fire in my driveway."

"There was a man by my fence in my front yard.  And, he had a hoodie, and a sweatshirt.  Couldn't really see his face but I jumped off my porch (don't ask me why I'd do this), my first response was 'well, what are you doing?'.  And I jump off my porch and then someone came around behind me..."

Ok, something not ok is happening.  If random weirdoes are getting drawn to her because of the news, that's not ok.  If some LDS or LDS ally do-gooders are moving themselves to acts of violence, that's not ok.  If she's lying/embellishing/pulling a Jussie Smollett, none of that is ok either.

Just to make sure I'm on record, dirty tricks like this aren't kosher.  I don't care how LDS you are, or how righteous you think your cause, or how deplorable you think your victim may be.  I would defend just about anyone, including Denson, from crap like this, and if ever found out someone was doing something like this, I'd report it, prevent it if I could.

(Just to make sure I'm on record and all.)

 

 

 

Edited by LoudmouthMormon
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Posted (edited)

No, it is not okay to have this, whether Ms Denison is really having to go through this or made it up.  This is all nasty business.  The next expected step would be for MormonStories to make this into a podcast where either the Church is having the Danites carry this out or covering up for the perpetrator.   Because the Church knows all the things that every member has ever done wrong. 

Ms. Denison is also sitting out in a congregation filming when a person does a hit piece on a sexual abuser during testimony meeting.   

Recently, Sterling Van Wagenen`s victim came on MormonStories and they called it a coverup by the LDS Church.  It actually seems to me that the Church system worked.  The Bishop found out about it, required that it be reported to the police, parents opted not to press charges, he was disfellowshipped.  The level of abuse is in question and he apparently abused other children later.   It`s a very sad story.  The victim doesn’t feel supported enough or receive counseling from the Church.  They didnt`t ask him to give his side of the story when the event happened (something probably many parents would want to avoid for their child).  I don’t know what the Church is supposed to do.  These are complicated stories with contradictions and possible manipulation for potential gain.  This is all my opinion, but the trial by court of public opinion is getting old.

Edited by readstoomuch

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Tacenda said:

Several on another forum are skeptical; like Jessie Smollet skeptical - yes it happened but was it staged.

The police report about car burning is available to the public. 

 

"On 2/3/19 at approximately 1253 hrs I, Officer *name removed for MDDB* was dispatched to the *address removed for MDDB* Pueblo, CO on a car fire.
Upon arrival I spoke to Mckenna Denson who stated someone had started a fire inside her car a 2000 Toyota Avalon (KY 287GEB). Denson stated she last saw the car at 2330 hrs the night before and found it damaged this morning at 1130 hrs. Denson estimated the damage at $5000 and had possible suspect information.
This is a summary of my investigation."

Edited by provoman
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Posted (edited)

I have seen her claims or someone else's reports in the past (had to be at least six months, if not a year) of harassment.  Wouldn't  surprise me that someone as public as she is has drawn more attention than the usual death threats (even I got a sort of death threat/wishful thinking 'you will soon be burning in hell' kind of thing).  Her problem is substantiating them given her past fraudulent claims (I am not speaking of any claim she has made, but only ones the police found as fraud or she admitted to).

How much do security systems cost these days?  We got a doorbell camera, but it might have been a good deal.  If I were her or one of her many friends, I would be investing in something like that both for safety and to help prove claims.

add-on:  the video states she has now taken precautions. 

Edited by Calm

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Posted (edited)

I just got to say it out loud.

Someone sneaks into my house and poisons me and I don't take immediate precautions until more incidents take place?  Even if just a week, I would not be living in my home until I had security systems installed, especially given my daughter was living with me.  If it was in her orange juice, it could have easily ended up as her daughter's.

I could understand that if no precautions were ever taken because of being totally broke, but she was talking about needing protection eons ago.

Maybe it is just poorly worded and she took some precautions for the inside of her house.

------

Fox reports the three incidents are being investigated, but there is just the one police report for the arson online. (I searched her name back to 5/2016.)

Can anyone explain this?  

-----

I also don't understand the delay in making it public if she was attacked three times in about a week's time at the end of January, beginning of February if the reasoning is making it public will make her safer.  Would police investigating have asked her to keep quiet for a time at least so as not to taint the investigation? (I am not implying that it means it didn't happen as there is concrete evidence we can see something happened at least for two of the incidents, I am trying to understand the thought process and askingbfor others' POV to see if my personal approach is tainting my view too much, that her choices make sense to them).

add-on:  it is unfortunate they only showed an X-ray of her hand, if they had showed a hospital report substantiating the drano poisoning, it would go a long way imo to convincing most people it was a bondafide attack and not a false claim.  Not too many people would go so far as to actually take poison (though there are a few, but Denson's past frauds never went to actual physical self harm that I am aware of).  The timing of the incidents works in her favor, imo.  It is one thing to take advantage of an accident tripping to claim one was physically assaulted, but for an accident like that to happen within a week of her car getting torched?  I think at this point it is most likely she has been attacked or she fabricated all three incidents and the injuries seem moving into the mentally ill range if self inflicted...I can see false claims of poisoning without actually taking it or torching an old car, but hitting oneself in the face and breaking a finger and wrist?  That would not be the least rational, imo.

Edited by Calm
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1 hour ago, Calm said:

Fox reports the three incidents are being investigated, but there is just the one police report for the arson online. (I searched her name back to 5/2016.)

Can anyone explain this?  

Unsure. I ran a similar search and only found two police reports for her: one for the car fire this year and one for an undisclosed out of state arrest warrant last year.

 

2 hours ago, provoman said:

Several on another forum are skeptical; like Jessie Smollet skeptical - yes it happened but was it staged.

Admittedly, the drain cleaner in orange juice thing sounds like a bad film trope. 

And McKenna has always been paranoid about 'the church' trying to intimidate her. Remember the hot mic moment toward the end of her first press conference where she was asked about being visited by the strengthening church members committee (or something similar). You had to turn the volume up, but she said the church had been following her - to which her attorney reminded her (again, off mic) that they didn't know that.

Plus, the church doesn't need to silence McKenna. Most of her case has already been thrown out, and, let's be honest - when given a platform, McKenna frequently turns out to be her own worst enemy.

Hopefully, some rogue actor didn't take it upon themselves to involve themselves with this woman. She has serious problems and needs real help.

 

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3 hours ago, Calm said:

I just got to say it out loud.

Someone sneaks into my house and poisons me and I don't take immediate precautions until more incidents take place?  Even if just a week, I would not be living in my home until I had security systems installed, especially given my daughter was living with me.  If it was in her orange juice, it could have easily ended up as her daughter's.

I could understand that if no precautions were ever taken because of being totally broke, but she was talking about needing protection eons ago.

Maybe it is just poorly worded and she took some precautions for the inside of her house.

------

Fox reports the three incidents are being investigated, but there is just the one police report for the arson online. (I searched her name back to 5/2016.)

Can anyone explain this?  

-----

I also don't understand the delay in making it public if she was attacked three times in about a week's time at the end of January, beginning of February if the reasoning is making it public will make her safer.  Would police investigating have asked her to keep quiet for a time at least so as not to taint the investigation? (I am not implying that it means it didn't happen as there is concrete evidence we can see something happened at least for two of the incidents, I am trying to understand the thought process and askingbfor others' POV to see if my personal approach is tainting my view too much, that her choices make sense to them).

add-on:  it is unfortunate they only showed an X-ray of her hand, if they had showed a hospital report substantiating the drano poisoning, it would go a long way imo to convincing most people it was a bondafide attack and not a false claim.  Not too many people would go so far as to actually take poison (though there are a few, but Denson's past frauds never went to actual physical self harm that I am aware of).  The timing of the incidents works in her favor, imo.  It is one thing to take advantage of an accident tripping to claim one was physically assaulted, but for an accident like that to happen within a week of her car getting torched?  I think at this point it is most likely she has been attacked or she fabricated all three incidents and the injuries seem moving into the mentally ill range if self inflicted...I can see false claims of poisoning without actually taking it or torching an old car, but hitting oneself in the face and breaking a finger and wrist?  That would not be the least rational, imo.

I know, I don't get it either. Could she have harmed herself? That would be total desperation. I wish she wasn't connected to NNN, he seems a little crazy and I smell something fishy, but can't put my finger on it. But in actuality, what if she isn't lying? If she hadn't recorded her and Bishop, I'd had been very skeptical of the whole thing, but she proved he did do something wrong. So it's possible and I shouldn't doubt her at all. 

I feel the whole lot of them are sick and tired of the sexual abuse cases stacking up that they are very serious about getting these to stop, but hurting herself, wow. Who knows, but I sure hope not. And if not, I sure hope she gets some back up for protection. 

 

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On 1/16/2019 at 2:25 AM, cdowis said:

I understand that someone of questionable character is not allowed even to sing in the ward choir.

Not true.  At best it is a per-unit decision.  I know of former members who sing in ward choirs.

On 1/16/2019 at 6:59 AM, SouthernMo said:

My former stake president did not allow non-members to sing in the stake choir. Not sure if that’s a policy or not. 

Stake choir is different, they can pull from the whole stake so they can be more selective.  For a ward choir a policy like this would surly get pushback because almost every ward choir I've sung in the director will take all comers because they almost always need more voices.

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5 hours ago, Amulek said:

Admittedly, the drain cleaner in orange juice thing sounds like a bad film trope. 

It flashbacks me to her claim of razor blades in icing.

"Other incidents ranged from allegedly lying about cancer treatments for money, forging prescriptions, and DUI. Police documents show the woman also claimed a restaurant put razor blades in the icing of a chocolate cake—only for police, doctors and psychologists to say she did it intentionally."

https://fox13now.com/2018/03/21/family-of-former-lds-mission-president-accused-of-sexual-assault-responds-to-allegations/

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On 1/13/2019 at 8:37 PM, esodije said:

Does anyone know if the church has done any discovery in the McKenna Denson “MTC rape” lawsuit? I read sometime back that Denson’s lawyers had taken Joseph Bishop’s deposition, although seemingly the only item of interest to come out of it was that Bishop supposedly had “resigned” his church membership. If I were repping the church, I’d want to depose Denson’s ex-husband, who supposedly accompanied Denson to her alleged meeting with Carlos Asay in 1987 (and who himself is the object of Denson’s allegations that he was a serial adulterer and a child-support deadbeat); her MTC missionary companion(s), who presumably could testify about Denson’s being called out of class and wandering the MTC “companionless”; and her MTC branch president (assuming he’s still alive), who presumably would have constituted the first level of any counseling Denson might have received in the MTC.  (I’d also want to subpoena copies of her medical records, but that almost goes without saying.) I don’t have a personal stake in the case, aside from having known one of Bishop’s sons in the mission field in 1979-80; however, if Bishop truly was so depraved that he would sexually assault a sister missionary—and in the MTC of all places—I would agree that the church bears at least some responsibility for it.

Elder Wells and Joseph Bishop have been deposed. 

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, Tacenda said:

I wish she wasn't connected to NNN, he seems a little crazy ...

if you read the posts on his YouTube, you will find the crazies in the church too.... but, you know, I'm sure there are no crazy prepper religious zealots ready to kill people for the prophet in the church... those Danite guys, that is ancient history...

 

Screenshot_20190519-073902_Samsung capture.jpg

Edited by changed

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7 minutes ago, changed said:

if you read the posts on his YouTube, you will find the crazies in the church too.... but, you know, I'm sure there are no crazy prepper religious zealots ready to kill people for the prophet in the church... those Danite guys, that is ancient history...

Screenshot_20190519-072740_Facebook.jpg

Well he’s got a sense of humor.  And the draino villain is something of a 5th grade bad guy creative writing assignment but indeed, it is all very possible. 

I am going to need more information before I get behind much. 

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Posted (edited)

Thanks for the info, changed. Makes me think Fox did a bad job of reporting to leave out the medical details if accurate. As far as I am aware in her false claims she never self harmed and if she is accurately reporting (and surely her medical condition could be questioned as part of a defense strategy to prove she lacks credibility, so lying seems very counterproductive to me), this seems very different from her past. 

The setting a fire in her car could have been done in hopes of someone donating her one, so I see that as not counting either way.  It also sounds amateurish from the report, something less dangerous than drano....though it sounds like the drano was still pretty dilute thankfully  from what I have heard would have been the case of even a small drink that was swallowed.  She wouldn’t have been home in a day if stronger.

At this point I find it more credible someone is attacking her. I think better of her for making it clear she is not attempting to imply church involvement, something else Fox reported poorly imo. 

There are sick, sick people out there. 

Edited by Calm
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Posted (edited)
47 minutes ago, MustardSeed said:

Well he’s got a sense of humor.  And the draino villain is something of a 5th grade bad guy creative writing assignment but indeed, it is all very possible. 

I am going to need more information before I get behind much. 

I would definitely like an explanation of why she chose to go home after being poisoned and if her daughter was there as well.  And then stay after a fire in her car.  This is the biggest problem for me especially since previous threats had her getting a bodyguard somehow.

I would also like more info about the razor blades incident and if she got hurt at all (doctors and psychologists being involved make me wonder).  If she did, that would be a huge red flag for these incidents.

add-on:  MustardSeed, you got me thinking again of how it could be if this was more fraud...and I am getting really stuck on her being in the hospital only a day or two and then going home.  That could have been a fake and not gotten the attention she wanted if they didn't keep her long enough to look impressive, so she upped it with burning the car which would be a more visual attack.  But that kind of fizzled too since the report has a candy bar recovered from the car (reads as one car seat got damaged to me), so she then fakes an physical attack.  This one actually causes her significant harm and that is why the alleged attacks stop, perhaps it went farther than she wanted...if she fell on her face, she might have expected some physical bruising, but the broken bones were unexpected.

It is all pretty extreme though, so I am finding that she did it to herself hard to believe.  The attacks could have stopped because the creeps (the yard attack requires two people) had to go back to wherever they came from.

If they don't have any suspects after almost four months, seems unlikely they will be found and prosecuted.  Unless she thinks they will come back and try again and now be caught given the greater security, her confidence seems to be unrealistic there.

And given the frauds we know of that she committed in the past, her claim the lawsuit is the only thing that would make her a target seems unrealistic as well.  A past victim might have tracked her down due to the publicity.

Edited by Calm
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2 hours ago, Calm said:

I would definitely like an explanation of why she chose to go home after being poisoned and if her daughter was there as well.  And then stay after a fire in her car.  This is the biggest problem for me especially since previous threats had her getting a bodyguard somehow.

I would also like more info about the razor blades incident and if she got hurt at all (doctors and psychologists being involved make me wonder).  If she did, that would be a huge red flag for these incidents.

add-on:  MustardSeed, you got me thinking again of how it could be if this was more fraud...and I am getting really stuck on her being in the hospital only a day or two and then going home.  That could have been a fake and not gotten the attention she wanted if they didn't keep her long enough to look impressive, so she upped it with burning the car which would be a more visual attack.  But that kind of fizzled too since the report has a candy bar recovered from the car (reads as one car seat got damaged to me), so she then fakes an physical attack.  This one actually causes her significant harm and that is why the alleged attacks stop, perhaps it went farther than she wanted...if she fell on her face, she might have expected some physical bruising, but the broken bones were unexpected.

It is all pretty extreme though, so I am finding that she did it to herself hard to believe.  The attacks could have stopped because the creeps (the yard attack requires two people) had to go back to wherever they came from.

If they don't have any suspects after almost four months, seems unlikely they will be found and prosecuted.  Unless she thinks they will come back and try again and now be caught given the greater security, her confidence seems to be unrealistic there.

And given the frauds we know of that she committed in the past, her claim the lawsuit is the only thing that would make her a target seems unrealistic as well.  A past victim might have tracked her down due to the publicity.

"Denson said on Jan. 30, she made breakfast for her daughter and took her to school. When she got home, she made breakfast for herself and drank a glass of orange juice."

So between taking her to school and getting home it allegedly happen. A few days later was the car fire. Doesn't the report on the car fire indicate 3 people - Mckenna and two others, possibly another female who is unemployed - all live at the same house?

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Posted (edited)

It is my opinion that her statement that she is not blaming the church is passive aggressive. 

I might be wrong, and I’m gossiping about something I know very little of.  I also admit I have zero tolerance for highly dramatic types, hypochondriacs, and false cancer claims. I get impatient when people try my compassion.  

I suppose we will know more as time passes. If she is being dishonest, this will likely escalate.  If she is being honest, she should go into hiding. 

 

Edited by MustardSeed
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4 hours ago, Calm said:

Thanks for the info. Makes me think Fox did a bad job of reporting to leave out the medical details if accurate. As far as I am aware in her false claims she never self harmed and if she is accurately reporting (and surely her medical condition could be questioned as part of a defense strategy to prove she lacks credibility, so lying seems very counterproductive to me), this seems very different from her past. 

The setting a fire in her car could have been done in hopes of someone donating her one, so I see that as not counting either way.  It also sounds amateurish from the report, something less dangerous than drano....though it sounds like the drano was still pretty dilute thankfully  from what I have heard would have been the case of even a small drink that was swallowed.  She wouldn’t have been home in a day if stronger.

At this point I find it more credible someone is attacking her. I think better of her for making it clear she is not attempting to imply church involvement, something else Fox reported poorly imo. 

There are sick, sick people out there. 

I know when I watched Fox 13 it did mention a broken nose among other things, as a woman that's the last thing that I'd want broken, given how we tend to worry about our looks a lot. 

And really, after watching shows like "Abducted in Plain Sight", and the Ted Bundy tapes and so many more. This shouldn't surprise me I guess, because there are some crazies out there. 

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Three months ago on a reddit forum a person who identified as Mckenna's daughter post that Mckenna had suffered three injuries, 1. drano in orange the juice, 2. car set on fire, 3. that Mckenna was attacked in her front yard and received a broken nose, finger and snapping her wrist. The poster was chidded by a moderator of that form "Please stop posting these claims in *this specific reddit sub* without a news article to back them up.", as the post was the second in a short period of time relating to Mckenna's injuries. 

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Thanks for sharing this.

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Posted (edited)

Anyone listen to her RFM podcast?  There is a claim on Reddit:

Quote

McKenna did an interview on Radio Free Mormon. Where she claimed someone put poison in her orange juice 20 years ago when she lived in South Carolina

Timestamp is around 52 minutes, so I will get to listen to it myself.

Also:
 

Quote

The orange juice drano claim is also strange because she told Sean on Heart of the Matter that years ago a neighbor drugged her orange juice and her children's orange juice. The children "lost time" and she was raped. But police found nothing. The church lawyers put that in their dossier so she was explaining that it really happened. 

 

Time stamp around 28:30

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eOcfoTvr8yI

Are there any time stamped postsurgery pictures showing a three month old incision so that it is clear the X-rays and pictures are not from an earlier injury?  Did she give a date for that attack like she did the poisoning and fire?  I can't remember.

It would appear the procedure may be out of date, so from an earlier time maybe?  

Quote

Non FCR approach for distal radius fracture, in this day and age?

Someone also reports reading the police report on the razor blades and it saying she swallowed some...which would explain the involvement of doctors and psychologists.

So if she did that, I can imagine her doing all of this.

I found it interesting that those who doubted her still seemed to believe it was Bishop's actions that led to her pattern of fraudulent/criminal behaviour.  No one is mentioning the sexual abuse she says her ( step?)father put her through in her youth.

Edited by Calm
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Just checked on exmormon reddit, and even they’re very skeptical of Denson’s claims.

While it’s still uncertain what exactly happened, at this point it appears Denson is a troubled soul crying out for help.

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54 minutes ago, Calm said:

Anyone listen to her RFM podcast?  There is a claim on Reddit:

Timestamp is around 52 minutes, so I will get to listen to it myself.

Also:
 

Time stamp around 28:30

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=eOcfoTvr8yI

Are there any time stamped postsurgery pictures showing a three month old incision so that it is clear the X-rays and pictures are not from an earlier injury?  Did she give a date for that attack like she did the poisoning and fire?  I can't remember.

It would appear the procedure may be out of date, so from an earlier time maybe?  

Someone also reports reading the police report on the razor blades and it saying she swallowed some...which would explain the involvement of doctors and psychologists.

So if she did that, I can imagine her doing all of this.

I found it interesting that those who doubted her still seemed to believe it was Bishop's actions that led to her pattern of fraudulent/criminal behaviour.  No one is mentioning the sexual abuse she says her ( step?)father put her through in her youth.

Yeah, it could be possible that she fell off the porch and was injured that way, maybe had too much to drink? Read this analogy on reddit. But I believe that Joseph Bishop abused her, this happens often to those that have been abused before. Maybe the abuser seeks out these types. She does seem to have some serious issues though. 

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