How was two hour church?

[sheilauk]

We still had three talks and an intermediate hymn in Sacrament meeting.  I don't think the length of the talks was different either and we finished by 11am.  We have not had more attend, we were very light on numbers last Sunday. We had hardly anyone in relief society.   We don't have a ward choir and haven't for years. People also have rushed off at the end when they used to linger and chat which is disappointing. 

[The Nehor]

We had a finger food buffet at the end of church on Sunday. It seemed like half the ward stayed and an eighth of the ward went through the buffet as if it were a full meal and ate almost everything and there was no fried chicken left when I got there. Jerks. 

[Hamba Tuhan]

6 minutes ago, sheilauk said:

I don't think the length of the talks was different either and we finished by 11am.

How did you pull that off? I noted in our ward this past Sunday that the announcements consisted entirely of telling us that all announcements were available on the printed half-sheet that everyone had been offered upon entering.

Quote

People also have rushed off at the end when they used to linger and chat which is disappointing. 

This is disappointing. I had three people to drop home after church, and no one seemed in any rush. We finally left about 50 minutes after church had ended, and we weren't the last to go by any stretch. There were several groups standing around talking in the courtyard and a few in the foyer still.

[Hamba Tuhan]

3 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

An eighth of the ward went through the buffet as if it were a full meal and ate almost everything and there was no fried chicken left when I got there.

We have people in our ward from a particular ethnic background who do this too ... so we always make sure that food is served out, even if it's just Soup Sunday or Sundae Sunday or whatever.

[Duncan]

Something i've noticed is the folks who take handi transit have been absent since the new change. We have maybe 3 or 4 but they haven't been there, I figure that it's harder to arrange for just a two hour pickup then it is for 3. One person could theoretically could get a lift but the others with wheelchairs, etc. can't

[sheilauk]

5 hours ago, sheilauk said:

We still had three talks and an intermediate hymn in Sacrament meeting.  I don't think the length of the talks was different either and we finished by 11am.  

 

5 hours ago, Hamba Tuhan said:

How did you pull that off? I noted in our ward this past Sunday that the announcements consisted entirely of telling us that all announcements were available on the printed half-sheet that everyone had been offered upon entering.

I'm not sure!  Most people have generally kept to time in their talks.  We usually have a young person 1st for 5 minutes and they are usually shorter than that.  We then have a 10 minute talk and a 15-20 minute talk and again most have stayed within that time. We do have verbose members but I think most struggle to produce 10 minutes.  Also,  we had no announcements at all - we stopped making announcements in Sacrament meeting years ago and were making them in priesthood/relief society.  We will now be using the Internet and the notice board!  And it doesn't take all that long usually to pass the Sacrament because of the low number of attendees. In the past, we rarely ran over time and have even finished early so having 10 minutes less may not be too much of a problem! 

[sheilauk]

6 hours ago, sheilauk said:

People also have rushed off at the end when they used to linger and chat which is disappointing. 

 

5 hours ago, Hamba Tuhan said:

This is disappointing. I had three people to drop home after church, and no one seemed in any rush. We finally left about 50 minutes after church had ended, and we weren't the last to go by any stretch. There were several groups standing around talking in the courtyard and a few in the foyer still.

People in my ward tend to take things very literally - they are told the meeting is shorter to allow for more family time so that's what they go and do.  I have heard some say they cant stop, even for essential meetings because its family time.  2 weeks ago they would have stayed and chatted or held a meeting,  now they wont. It's part of why I worried about the changes and how it would affect the single adults.  It may change in time.

[Hamba Tuhan]

29 minutes ago, sheilauk said:

People in my ward tend to take things very literally - they are told the meeting is shorter to allow for more family time so that's what they go and do.  I have heard some say they cant stop, even for essential meetings because its family time.

Maybe they need to go back and read what Elder Cook said in General Conference:

Quote

In many parts of the world, people choose to stay at the meetinghouse after the normal Sunday schedule to enjoy social relationships. There is nothing in this announced adjustment that would interfere with this wonderful and rewarding practice in any way ...

Sunday can be a day of gospel learning and teaching at church and in the home. As individuals and families engage in family councils, family history, ministering, service, personal worship, and joyful family time, the Sabbath day will truly be a delight.

 

[sheilauk]

16 minutes ago, Hamba Tuhan said:

Maybe they need to go back and read what Elder Cook said in General Conference:

 

I am aware of it and have raised it leading up to the change and will continue to refer to it and hope that a more nuanced view takes hold or that people's sociability (and they are generally a sociable group) changes their initial response.

[strappinglad]

We have 3 wards in our building and overlap a half hour . That means people are in the building about 2 hours less than before. I will be interested to see if that translates into less using up of paper products etc. 😄

[Bernard Gui]

14 hours ago, The Nehor said:

While attendance was not as high yesterday as it was on the first Sunday of the month it is still up about 30 people from the norm. Talked to a member of the Stake Presidency and we are not the exception. All the wards are reporting similar increases.

Are the 30 inactive members who have returned?

[Scott Lloyd]

9 hours ago, The Nehor said:

We had a finger food buffet at the end of church on Sunday. It seemed like half the ward stayed and an eighth of the ward went through the buffet as if it were a full meal and ate almost everything and there was no fried chicken left when I got there. Jerks. 

A buffet with fried chicken?  Sounds pretty elaborate. I’d be worried about the burden and stress on those who have to set everything up and then take it down and clean up at the end. 

Edited January 15, 2019 by Scott Lloyd

[Scott Lloyd]

16 hours ago, sheilauk said:

We still had three talks and an intermediate hymn in Sacrament meeting.  I don't think the length of the talks was different either and we finished by 11am.  We have not had more attend, we were very light on numbers last Sunday. We had hardly anyone in relief society.   We don't have a ward choir and haven't for years. People also have rushed off at the end when they used to linger and chat which is disappointing. 

If you had time in an hour for three talks and a full hymn, the talks must have been a good deal shorter than what I’m used to where I live — which is probably a good thing. 

If you’ve had light attendance that could impact the length of time needed for the sacrament. 

Edited January 15, 2019 by Scott Lloyd

[Hamba Tuhan]

2 hours ago, Scott Lloyd said:

I’d be worried about the burden and stress on those who have to set everything up and then take it down and clean up at the end. 

I agree that fried chicken sounds a step or two beyond 'finger food' -- though I clearly don't live anywhere near Texas -- but in my ward, everyone just sets up, takes down and cleans up. We're able to hold a complete after-Church social in 50 minutes so that there's no disruption to the ward that follows us.

[Gray]

22 hours ago, The Nehor said:

While attendance was not as high yesterday as it was on the first Sunday of the month it is still up about 30 people from the norm. Talked to a member of the Stake Presidency and we are not the exception. All the wards are reporting similar increases.

Let's keep this train rolling. One hour church should bring even more people back to church. Who's with me?

[Scott Lloyd]

On 1/15/2019 at 8:28 AM, Gray said:

Let's keep this train rolling. One hour church should bring even more people back to church. Who's with me?

I believe there is value in a periodic communal interactive discussion of gospel principles and mutual strengthening of commitment outside of one’s own home setting to live those principles. Likewise, if there is to be a priesthood quorum, there ought to be a periodic meeting of that quorum to plan its work and to strengthen the collegiality therein, even if said meeting occurs only twice a month, as now constituted. I assume the same could be said of a Relief Society and its vital work. 

Furthermore, a weekly meeting to partake of the emblems of the Lord’s sacrifice and to hear admonition to righteousness seems to fit the scriptural injunction that the saints “meet together oft.” 

So no, I can’t go along with you that there be further reduction to one hour. 

Edited July 28, 2019 by Scott Lloyd

[stemelbow]

27 minutes ago, Gray said:

Let's keep this train rolling. One hour church should bring even more people back to church. Who's with me?

I'm guessing there are a ton of people who have grown tired of church over the years and thought this two hour thing intriguing enough to try it out for a bit.  With that, i'd think attendance will round back down to where it was in most areas.  Perhaps overall there'll be a bit of a gain, as some triers will get sucked back in.  If so it'll prove to be a pretty good little marketing trick/experiment.  maybe someday they'll have to try a refresh again and cut it down to an hour hoping to spark more attendance.  

[HappyJackWagon]

49 minutes ago, stemelbow said:

I'm guessing there are a ton of people who have grown tired of church over the years and thought this two hour thing intriguing enough to try it out for a bit.  With that, i'd think attendance will round back down to where it was in most areas.  Perhaps overall there'll be a bit of a gain, as some triers will get sucked back in.  If so it'll prove to be a pretty good little marketing trick/experiment.  maybe someday they'll have to try a refresh again and cut it down to an hour hoping to spark more attendance.  

OR...

They could hold church every other week. Think how many more wards could meet in one building if there were a two week rotation of two-hour church. The church is to "meet together oft" but how do we know that "oft" must be every week? It's the cultural norm but is it required? I don't know. Many would respond by suggesting that it's important to participate regularly in the ordinance of the sacrament. Fair point, but what is "regularly". We often skip weeks in the church for bad weather, stake conferences, special regional conferences, general conference etc, and I don't know that people are negatively impacted by not having the sacrament that week.

Having said all that, I don't really think the church would move to an every other week kind of schedule but there really isn't any reason I can see why it couldn't be done if it became a necessity or if the brethren decided to change things up some more.

[Duncan]

2 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

OR...

They could hold church every other week. Think how many more wards could meet in one building if there were a two week rotation of two-hour church. The church is to "meet together oft" but how do we know that "oft" must be every week? It's the cultural norm but is it required? I don't know. Many would respond by suggesting that it's important to participate regularly in the ordinance of the sacrament. Fair point, but what is "regularly". We often skip weeks in the church for bad weather, stake conferences, special regional conferences, general conference etc, and I don't know that people are negatively impacted by not having the sacrament that week.

Having said all that, I don't really think the church would move to an every other week kind of schedule but there really isn't any reason I can see why it couldn't be done if it became a necessity or if the brethren decided to change things up some more.

our local grocery store is changing up their displays and all kinds of mucking about but one of the managers said they could close it down for 6 months and have everything moved but then all the customers would get used to going elsewhere so they are doing it slower and messier but retaining the customers.So based on that, I think you're right they wouldn't go to every other weekend as people would just stop altogether or get confused as to what week church was on, etc.

[HappyJackWagon]

11 minutes ago, Duncan said:

our local grocery store is changing up their displays and all kinds of mucking about but one of the managers said they could close it down for 6 months and have everything moved but then all the customers would get used to going elsewhere so they are doing it slower and messier but retaining the customers.So based on that, I think you're right they wouldn't go to every other weekend as people would just stop altogether or get confused as to what week church was on, etc.

I agree it's very doubtful, but it IS possible. Considering the push towards Home Centered Church, other than the fear of attrition, there isn't a really strong argument against it. But of course attrition is a concern, as it should be.

[Gray]

1 hour ago, stemelbow said:

I'm guessing there are a ton of people who have grown tired of church over the years and thought this two hour thing intriguing enough to try it out for a bit.  With that, i'd think attendance will round back down to where it was in most areas.  Perhaps overall there'll be a bit of a gain, as some triers will get sucked back in.  If so it'll prove to be a pretty good little marketing trick/experiment.  maybe someday they'll have to try a refresh again and cut it down to an hour hoping to spark more attendance.  

I can say that at least so far the quality of the experience has actually improved in my ward. It's not just shorter. It's like people are putting more into things because there isn't so much time to waste.

[Gray]

1 hour ago, Scott Lloyd said:

I believe there is value in a periodic communal interactive discussion of gospel principles and mutual strengthening of commitment outside of one’s own home setting to live those principles. Likewise, if there is to be a priesthood quorum, there ought to be a periodic meeting of that quorum to plan its work and to strengthen the collegiality therein, even if said meeting occurs only twice a month, as now constituted. I assume the same could be said of a Relief Society and it’s vital work. 

Furthermore, a weekly meeting to partake of the emblems of the Lord’s sacrifice and to hear admonition to righteousness seems to fit the scriptural injunction that the saints “meet together oft.” 

So no, I can’t go along with you that there be further reduction to one hour. 

I was mostly kidding.

As I mentioned about, I can say that at least so far the quality of the experience has actually improved in my ward. It's not just shorter. It's like people are putting more into things because there isn't so much time to waste.

[mnn727]

We start at 8:30 and seemed like there were 30-40 people less than normal. Since the next Ward in the building doesn't start until 11:30 AM so we are able to hold Priesthood in the chapel which I like much better than the "Cultural Hall" 

We had a Baby blessing, a quartet song, a youth speaker, a flash choir (anyone who like to sing gets up and sings the chosen song ) and then 1 adult speaker - ended right on time.

After Church I was able to talk to a few people for about 15 minutes, and my wife actually talked to people for about an hour (luckily we drive different cars to Church)

[The Nehor]

6 hours ago, Hamba Tuhan said:

I agree that fried chicken sounds a step or two beyond 'finger food' -- though I clearly don't live anywhere near Texas -- but in my ward, everyone just sets up, takes down and cleans up. We're able to hold a complete after-Church social in 50 minutes so that there's no disruption to the ward that follows us.

I agree but the Elder’s Quorum Presidency ran it and I got no say. They got fried chicken and invited members to bring stuff. I did get some chip and some excellent 7 layer dip that will probably guarantee her exaltation as excluding that dip from celestial glory would make it insufficiently glorious.

[The Nehor]

28 minutes ago, HappyJackWagon said:

OR...

They could hold church every other week. Think how many more wards could meet in one building if there were a two week rotation of two-hour church. The church is to "meet together oft" but how do we know that "oft" must be every week? It's the cultural norm but is it required? I don't know. Many would respond by suggesting that it's important to participate regularly in the ordinance of the sacrament. Fair point, but what is "regularly". We often skip weeks in the church for bad weather, stake conferences, special regional conferences, general conference etc, and I don't know that people are negatively impacted by not having the sacrament that week.

Having said all that, I don't really think the church would move to an every other week kind of schedule but there really isn't any reason I can see why it couldn't be done if it became a necessity or if the brethren decided to change things up some more.

I sin too much to risk only taking the sacrament every other week.