Ex-fertility Doctor, Former Mission & Temple President Facing Lawsuit

[JulieM]

1 hour ago, CA Steve said:

I believe the term for this is:

Non-consensual donation.

Ok.  Now, that is funny 

(But this story is disturbing.)

[Kenngo1969]

1 hour ago, Prof said:

This is a job for Maury Povich!!!

"Dr. Mortimer, you are the father!"  

[Calm]

12 minutes ago, Kenngo1969 said:

"Dr. Mortimer, you are the father!"  

This confirms I have missed nothing by never ever seeing even a clip of that show.  My exposure has been no more than a few seconds of commercial.  I am so grateful for remote controls, DVR and fast forward, and all such things that allow me to watch TV while avoiding reality shows (except on occasion cooking and home shows...check out Netflix's Extraordinary Homes show; I want to live in the Alps)

[readstoomuch]

So, this is kind of weird.  I know Dr Mortimer.  For my own privacy I am not going to say where or how.  That would be just too obvious.  He helped me quite a bit in my own life.  I am as shocked as any one could be.  I don't agree with it or condone his actions.  

When I was in graduate school there were advertisements for sperm donors and various other medical studies.  I used to make about 50 dollars a week donating blood for some studies.  I almost did a drug study, but opted not to.  This was also the time of the HIV epidemic and Hepatitis C.  There was a vaccine for Hepatitis B, but there is still none for C.  So, there was some worry about women becoming infected with HIV or hepatitis from a donor whose screening tests were not positive yet.  I had friends who donated sperm and the doctors preferred not to freeze it and thaw to inject.  So, the sperm donor would basically make an appointment dropping off the specimen to a dropbox at a certain time and date. Then it could be freshly used.  It could be an awkward process and the man was supposed to abstain from sex at least 48 hours before the donation to increase the yield.  In mid 80s they were paid 50 dollars each time.  In the late 80s a number of women were infected with HIV from a sperm donor in Australia whose screening for HIV had not been accurate/often enough to diagnosis his carrier state.  After that time, no fresh donations were used.  All semen was stored for 90 days and only used after the donor had a negative HIV test.  The sperm donors were also screened more closely for number of sperm, motility and chromosomal abnormalities.  I think it is still done similar to this, but probably even more screening for other diseases.  So,.......................the doctor knows his own history and that he is a person of above average intelligence.   Another scenario.  The woman is ovulating and there is not semen available at that moment.  

One article I read, said that the woman's husband was supposed to have his sperm mixed with a donor to increased the odds of fertilization.  Most likely the father had a very low sperm count and/or poor motility.  I don't know how after 34 years you would be able to reconstruct what was or wasn't mixed together.  That's if the records are even available.  

Dr Mortimer was one of the most ethical people I ever dealt with.  So, I think there could be another side to the story, but it is unfortunate and I see why all of the family feels hurt and betrayed.  

[MorningStar]

That is so messed up. 

[katherine the great]

I'm sure this was extremely upsetting to the couple and their daughter but the fact that they would include the doctor's wife in the lawsuit just seems plain mean-spirited to me. I seriously doubt his wife was complicit and likely had no idea he had done that. Not really knowing the facts, the scenario I imagine is that the doctor heard the description the couple requested and thought, "Hey, I match that description. Problem solved!"  Totally unethical, but it seems possible he meant to help without thinking through the possible repercussions.

[JulieM]

39 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

I'm sure this was extremely upsetting to the couple and their daughter but the fact that they would include the doctor's wife in the lawsuit just seems plain mean-spirited to me. I seriously doubt his wife was complicit and likely had no idea he had done that. Not really knowing the facts, the scenario I imagine is that the doctor heard the description the couple requested and thought, "Hey, I match that description. Problem solved!"  Totally unethical, but it seems possible he meant to help without thinking through the possible repercussions.

I think it’s odd his wife is named in the lawsuit too.  Maybe she knew or was involved in his office somehow?  Otherwise, why name her?

And, they wanted a donor that was a college student, over 6 feet tall with brown hair and blue eyes for the donor.  I don’t know what this doctor looked like but I wouldn’t let him off with “Hey, I match that description.  Problem solved!”, when he was doing something completely unethical and dishonest.  (I know you agree it was unethical.)

Edited April 5, 2018 by JulieM

[katherine the great]

16 minutes ago, JulieM said:

I think it’s odd his wife is named in the lawsuit too.  Maybe she knew or was involved in his office somehow?  Otherwise, why name her?

And, they wanted a donor that was a college student, over 6 feet tall with brown hair and blue eyes for the donor.  I don’t know what this doctor looked like but I wouldn’t let him off with “Hey, I match that description.  Problem solved!”, when he was doing something completely unethical and dishonest.

Oh I'm not letting him off. His behavior was definitely a violation of ethics and has caused a tangled web of pain for many people. I'm just trying to imagine a scenario in which an otherwise stand up guy would do something like this. I'm assuming that the description the couple gave for the donor matched both the dad and the doctor: college educated, tall, brown hair, blue eyes.

[JulieM]

3 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

Oh I'm not letting him off. His behavior was definitely a violation of ethics and has caused a tangled web of pain for many people. I'm just trying to imagine a scenario in which an otherwise stand up guy would do something like this. I'm assuming that the description the couple gave for the donor matched both the dad and the doctor: college educated, tall, brown hair, blue eyes.

I agree that it may have and with your other thoughts too.  

(I edited my post above to add that I knew you agreed that he was unethical but you may not have seen that! )

[katherine the great]

This case is interesting to me. In fact, I was just discussing DNA analysis with my bio-anth students today. We talked about "23 and me" and other genetic companies. When I had my DNA done, my dad's name popped up, then my brother's and finally my mom's. I wondered out loud to my class how many families have been broken up by this flow of information we have at our fingertips. It can be exciting for many but can reveal very painful secrets for others...

[Calm]

Perhaps we will find out if this was a one time thing or happened multiple times.

One time thing...I can see something happened given there was probably a time sensitive element (mother's fertility cycle) involved and it was just easier to 'donate' himself than tell the couple they would have to wait a month.  Not saying this has to be the story if it happened only once, but possible.  

If it was more than once, changes 'the nice guy making a one time major mistake he still needs to be held accountable for' potential scenario to 'guy was committing major fraud for profit and maybe ego, quite possibly more conman than nice guy'.

Edited April 5, 2018 by Calm

[Storm Rider]

3 hours ago, Calm said:

Law and Order did an episode eons ago iirc (could have been another show).  The doctor benefitted by saving money on storage and processing of sperm, not sure about paying donors.  Also a huge ego thing.

Have no clue if matches the reality, just thought it was a weird deja vu.

Wonder how frequently it actually happens.

I read this article a few days ago as I was perusing genealogy articles. As I read it I was trying to understand what would motivate a doctor to donate his own sperm.  When I read the desires of the parents, brown hair, 6' tall, etc., I thought, "Well, that is so broad and in genetics it becomes meaningless. My hair color is dark brown and both of my kids were blonds that has they have past 30 years of age they become darker in color to a light brown - some might say dishwater blond"  

However, even with a rather meaningless requirement for the donor, why would the doctor himself donate?  I think you have answered the question; the only thing that makes sense is if the doctor could save significant monies from doing so.  Yet, then it is just too weird - you have your progeny running all over the place simply because you wanted to save money?!?  

It is just too bizarre.  

btw, the article I read did not mention the doctor's church affiliation - it was more focused on Ancestry.com's DNA test. 

 

[Gray]

3 hours ago, Duncan said:

If he didn't have "relations" with her, I don't know what he would get out of it other than his genetic donation, it's super weird though!

I've heard of this happening before. Not sure what these kind of guys are getting out of it. Maybe it's narcissism, and they think they have super genes that need to be spread far and wide.

[Tacenda]

16 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

This case is interesting to me. In fact, I was just discussing DNA analysis with my bio-anth students today. We talked about "23 and me" and other genetic companies. When I had my DNA done, my dad's name popped up, then my brother's and finally my mom's. I wondered out loud to my class how many families have been broken up by this flow of information we have at our fingertips. It can be exciting for many but can reveal very painful secrets for others...

My thoughts too, and especially if you do something illegal, as in this case.

[Calm]

34 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

This case is interesting to me. In fact, I was just discussing DNA analysis with my bio-anth students today. We talked about "23 and me" and other genetic companies. When I had my DNA done, my dad's name popped up, then my brother's and finally my mom's. I wondered out loud to my class how many families have been broken up by this flow of information we have at our fingertips. It can be exciting for many but can reveal very painful secrets for others...

Is there some agreement you sign that allows your name to be released to others?  My husband responded to the news with "bet he is going to sue ancestry.com for privacy invasion", for releasing his name without consent...so I am thinking you sign some sort of consent form.

Edited April 5, 2018 by Calm

[katherine the great]

5 minutes ago, Calm said:

Is there some agreement you sign that allows your name to be released to others?  My husband responded to the news with "bet he is going to sue ancestry.com for privacy invasion", for releasing his name without consent...so I am thinking you sign some sort of consent form.

Yes. My company was 23 and me and the customer has control of their privacy settings. I'm assuming this is the same across the board. There are many people though who manage other family members' accounts (like children or parents)--especially if the test is given as a gift.

[Calm]

11 minutes ago, katherine the great said:

Yes. My company was 23 and me and the customer has control of their privacy settings. I'm assuming this is the same across the board. There are many people though who manage other family members' accounts (like children or parents)--especially if the test is given as a gift.

If it was a one time thing, I can see him either not even thinking of it since it was 30 or more years ago or thinking 'what are the chances she will submit her DNA before I am dead'.

[katherine the great]

59 minutes ago, Calm said:

If it was a one time thing, I can see him either not even thinking of it since it was 30 or more years ago or thinking 'what are the chances she will submit her DNA before I am dead'.

True. I don't think he possibly could have foreseen a huge database of DNA being available worldwide. Back in the 80's that would have seemed like science fiction.

[Thinking]

Law & Order - Seed

[Avatar4321]

3 hours ago, ALarson said:

I wonder that as well.  I know I have read of other cases where the doctor was using his own sperm and fathered many children.

I'm a bit amazed that he would have had his DNA done by ancestry.com (or is there another way they would have it?).  He had to have known there was a chance he'd be matched with her (and possibly others?).

Ancestry does DNA paternity tests? I was under the impression that their DNA services was strictly to determine ancestry origins.

[Calm]

18 minutes ago, Avatar4321 said:

Ancestry does DNA paternity tests? I was under the impression that their DNA services was strictly to determine ancestry origins.

Parents are ancestors.

[Marginal Gains]

1 hour ago, Calm said:

Parents are ancestors.

Parents are among your ancestors...

[Avatar4321]

4 hours ago, Calm said:

Parents are ancestors.

Yes I understand that but I wasn't aware they were doing paternity tests or opened their database to learn that info

[JulieM]

It’s on the CNN website now:

https://www-m.cnn.com/2018/04/04/health/fertility-doctor-dna-test-lawsuit-bn/index.html

[JulieM]

1 hour ago, Avatar4321 said:

Yes I understand that but I wasn't aware they were doing paternity tests or opened their database to learn that info

You must have to sign that they can release your name to others who are a match.

I know of two people who were adopted that found their birth parent through ancestry.com.

ETA:

In the CNN article, there is a statement from Ancestry.com about how you can choose to not share your information if you don’t want to:

"’With Ancestry, customers maintain ownership and control over their DNA data. Anyone who takes a test can change their DNA matching settings at any time, meaning that if they opt-out, their profile and relationship will not be visible to other customers,’ the statement said.”

 

Edited April 5, 2018 by JulieM