CMZ Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 Can anyone point me to the quote by Wendy Watson Nelson where she talked about the possibility of Jesus Christ already having been in attendance at some special Church gatherings? Link to comment
Duncan Posted January 13, 2018 Share Posted January 13, 2018 24 minutes ago, CMZ said: Can anyone point me to the quote by Wendy Watson Nelson where she talked about the possibility of Jesus Christ already having been in attendance at some special Church gatherings? "What if you learned that the Savior had already returned to this earth—that He, as part of His Second Coming, had already met with some of His true followers in several marvelous, large gatherings13—gatherings about which the world, including CNN and the blogosphere, knew nothing. If you found out that the Savior was already on the earth, what would you desperately want to do today, and what would you be willing and ready to do tomorrow?" https://www.lds.org/broadcasts/article/worldwide-devotionals/2016/01/becoming-the-person-you-were-born-to-be?lang=eng 4 Link to comment
Calm Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 (edited) It is a thought experiment (what would you do?), not a claim or speculation that Christ has come already. Edited January 14, 2018 by Calm 4 Link to comment
Duncan Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 36 minutes ago, Calm said: It is a thought experiment (what would you do?), not a claim or speculation that Christ has come already. that's what I was thinking as well Link to comment
CMZ Posted January 14, 2018 Author Share Posted January 14, 2018 The wording is ambiguous. Hard to know if she is speaking only hypothetically or obliquely referring to accomplished reality. 1 Link to comment
Calm Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 22 minutes ago, CMZ said: The wording is ambiguous. Hard to know if she is speaking only hypothetically or obliquely referring to accomplished reality. Somehow I doubt that the first the fsithful hear of secret meetings at thevSecond Coming will be an ambiguous statement by someone who is not a General Officer or Authority, but the spouse of one. Link to comment
CMZ Posted January 14, 2018 Author Share Posted January 14, 2018 11 minutes ago, Calm said: Somehow I doubt that the first the fsithful hear of secret meetings at thevSecond Coming will be an ambiguous statement by someone who is not a General Officer or Authority, but the spouse of one. Could be, but hard to ultimately determine. Link to comment
CMZ Posted January 14, 2018 Author Share Posted January 14, 2018 I don't personally know what the reality is, but if such a meetings had already occurred it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility for an attendee to obliquely refer to them, even if they aren't a General Officer or Authority. If they had already occurred there is no need for people to receive an invitation to them that only comes from a general authority. The whole "who is authorized to invite?" question is moot and irrelevant. That said, yes, it could just be hypothetical. Link to comment
The Nehor Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 On 1/13/2018 at 7:57 PM, Calm said: It is a thought experiment (what would you do?), not a claim or speculation that Christ has come already. Definitely. Wink, wink, nudge, nudge, say no more! 1 Link to comment
cinepro Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) On 1/13/2018 at 5:57 PM, Calm said: It is a thought experiment (what would you do?), not a claim or speculation that Christ has come already. It is a woefully ham-fisted and irresponsible "thought experiment." Anyone rational person with any experience in the culture of Mormondom would read that and think "Woa, if I say this there are a lot of members who are going to think I'm telling them that this has actually happened, but that I'm doing it using coded language that only the elect will understand. I probably shouldn't do this." I would be more worried if LDS cared at all about what the wife of the Prophet has ever had to say. As it is, this will quickly get relegated to the level of Three-Nephite stories and get brought out every once in a while by random Gospel Doctrine teachers who read it in hushed tones. But heaven help us if a GA ever says something similar. Edited January 15, 2018 by cinepro 2 Link to comment
cinepro Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) I'm sorry, but the more I think about this, the more stupid it becomes. Because the answer to the question is "You'd be lying." How is that a useful thought experiment? "Um, Sister Nelson, we wouldn't believe you. But please continue and we'll believe everything else you say that isn't presented as a hypothetical." "No really, everyone, please ask yourself what you would do if I stood here and told you something that wasn't true. What would you do?" Is there any situation where it is conceivably useful to start out "What if I told you..." and then follow it with something that isn't true? Edited January 15, 2018 by cinepro Link to comment
Gray Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Quote 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. 1 Link to comment
cinepro Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Gray said: 26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. 27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Deseret News Headline: "Scriptural Prophecy Fulfilled at Women's Conference" Edited January 15, 2018 by cinepro 1 Link to comment
Rain Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 I can only think, "how would I answer that question?" He met privately with some people, but didn't let the general public know? What could I even do? Just wait. If he had wanted me there he would have invited me. If he didn't invite me then I would have no business going there. Link to comment
CMZ Posted January 16, 2018 Author Share Posted January 16, 2018 8 hours ago, cinepro said: Deseret News Headline: "Scriptural Prophecy Fulfilled at Women's Conference" Some aspects of the Second Coming will be out in the open but some will be secret. Link to comment
Scott Lloyd Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 On 1/13/2018 at 10:29 PM, CMZ said: The wording is ambiguous. Hard to know if she is speaking only hypothetically or obliquely referring to accomplished reality. On 1/13/2018 at 10:53 PM, Calm said: Somehow I doubt that the first the fsithful hear of secret meetings at thevSecond Coming will be an ambiguous statement by someone who is not a General Officer or Authority, but the spouse of one. Indeed. Her wording was not in the least ambiguous to me. Link to comment
Scott Lloyd Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 (edited) 11 hours ago, cinepro said: Deseret News Headline: "Scriptural Prophecy Fulfilled at Women's Conference" I think you’ve been taken to task in the past for inventing fake quotes and attributing them to others as though they were real. Edited January 16, 2018 by Scott Lloyd Link to comment
Scott Lloyd Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 (edited) On 1/13/2018 at 11:32 PM, CMZ said: I don't personally know what the reality is, but if such a meetings had already occurred it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility for an attendee to obliquely refer to them, even if they aren't a General Officer or Authority. If they had already occurred there is no need for people to receive an invitation to them that only comes from a general authority. The whole "who is authorized to invite?" question is moot and irrelevant. That said, yes, it could just be hypothetical. This is entering the realm of sensationalistic drivel a la “Visions of Glory.” https://www.fairmormon.org/archive/publications/spencers-visions-of-glory Edited January 16, 2018 by Scott Lloyd Link to comment
cdowis Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 (edited) 17 hours ago, cinepro said: I'm sorry, but the more I think about this, the more stupid it becomes. Because the answer to the question is "You'd be lying." How is that a useful thought experiment? Perhaps this will help to open your mind. https://www.mormontabernaclechoir.org/articles/if-the-savior-stood-beside-me.html She is speaking of something which is factually true, whether at this very moment or sometime in the future. Are you so caught up in counting the number of angels that can stand on the head of a pin that you miss the lesson that she is trying to teach. She is speaking to reality, now or in the future, and where you you or I be when that day comes. What would I do if the Saviour stood beside me? How sad, how petty to belittle her message. Edited January 16, 2018 by cdowis 2 Link to comment
The Nehor Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 5 hours ago, cdowis said: Perhaps this will help to open your mind. https://www.mormontabernaclechoir.org/articles/if-the-savior-stood-beside-me.html She is speaking of something which is factually true, whether at this very moment or sometime in the future. Are you so caught up in counting the number of angels that can stand on the head of a pin that you miss the lesson that she is trying to teach. She is speaking to reality, now or in the future, and where you you or I be when that day comes. What would I do if the Saviour stood beside me? How sad, how petty to belittle her message. Then she articulated it rather poorly. Acting as if the Savior is always there is a good practice because in many senses he is. Alluding to marvelous sacred/secret meetings is implying the Second Coming is imminent, a different proposition. 2 Link to comment
cdowis Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 23 hours ago, The Nehor said: Then she articulated it rather poorly. Acting as if the Savior is always there is a good practice because in many senses he is. Alluding to marvelous sacred/secret meetings is implying the Second Coming is imminent, a different proposition. Nehor, Are you telling me that a wife of a prophet is not meeting your standards of fine tuned rhetorical perfection? Methinks just another modern day Pharasee. Every night I get on my knees and thank God for these people whilst others spend their efforts to pick away at their imperfections. How sad. Knock off the personal insults. ~Mods Link to comment
The Nehor Posted January 17, 2018 Share Posted January 17, 2018 (edited) 7 minutes ago, cdowis said: Are you telling me that a wife of a prophet is not meeting your standards of fine tuned rhetorical perfection? Methinks just another modern day Pharasee. Every night I get on my knees and thank God for these people whilst others spend their efforts to pick away at their imperfections. How sad. No, I am saying that if your interpretation of the intent of her words is correct that she does not meet my exacting standards for rhetorical perfection. I think Your interpretation is unsupportable so she is vindicated. Thankfully I do not get down on my knees every night and thank God for your interpretations of the wife of a prophet’s words or your sanctimonious insinuations that I compare unfavorably to 1st Century Populist Judaism. If I did I would be in real serious TROUBLE. That would be even sadder. Edited January 17, 2018 by The Nehor 1 Link to comment
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