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I personally am not opposed to the general authorities receiving money for their service. They work full time and everybody needs food, clothing, and a place to live.

I AM critical of the semantics used which make the money received sound like it's a lot less than it really is. Phrases like modest living allowance are used to describe the income. If the responses on this thread are any indication, many faithful LDS are in favor of the general authorities receiving a healthy (my word) paycheck for their service.

Would the Church risk losing members if the salaries of the general authorities were easily accessible?

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38 minutes ago, Thinking said:

I personally am not opposed to the general authorities receiving money for their service. They work full time and everybody needs food, clothing, and a place to live.

I AM critical of the semantics used which make the money received sound like it's a lot less than it really is. Phrases like modest living allowance are used to describe the income. If the responses on this thread are any indication, many faithful LDS are in favor of the general authorities receiving a healthy (my word) paycheck for their service.

Would the Church risk losing members if the salaries of the general authorities were easily accessible?

IMO..the only way the Church could risk losing members by having salaries accessible is by continuing to say that they are unpaid laymen and volunteers...which is what old members still really believe.

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5 hours ago, Jeanne said:

IMO..the only way the Church could risk losing members by having salaries accessible is by continuing to say that they are unpaid laymen and volunteers...which is what old members still really believe.

The only way to "continue to say" something is to first start to say it.

So, where and when was it actually said?

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13 hours ago, kiwi57 said:

The only way to "continue to say" something is to first start to say it.

So, where and when was it actually said?

always...it was very much a part of dialogue when we ever discussed the difference between the LDS church and others.

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5 hours ago, Jeanne said:

always...it was very much a part of dialogue when we ever discussed the difference between the LDS church and others.

CFR please, Jeanne. I'm looking for something in writing from an official Church source, or something in a Conference talk claiming that General Authorities were "unpaid laymen and volunteers."

Rumours don't count.

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2 hours ago, kiwi57 said:

CFR please, Jeanne. I'm looking for something in writing from an official Church source, or something in a Conference talk claiming that General Authorities were "unpaid laymen and volunteers."

Rumours don't count.

Don't ask for a CFR...it was always discussed around my ward..home..and teachings.  One of the big differences between the LDS church and others was leaders were not paid a direct salary. You know this...!

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5 minutes ago, Jeanne said:

Don't ask for a CFR...it was always discussed around my ward..home..and teachings.  One of the big differences between the LDS church and others was leaders were not paid a direct salary. You know this...!

I know perfectly well that my bishop, and your bishop, and every other bishop in the Church is an unpaid lay volunteer.

I also know that my stake president, and your stake president, and every other stake president in the Church is an unpaid lay volunteer.

I also know that, out of these thousands of unpaid lay volunteers, a very tiny minority are shoulder-tapped and asked to give up their careers and serve the Lord full time; for which, they are financially compensated. I've known this since I was a teenager, which is rather a long time ago.

So if you're unable to substantiate your claim that the Church has described the GA's as unpaid volunteers, I think we can take that as refuted.

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9 minutes ago, kiwi57 said:

I know perfectly well that my bishop, and your bishop, and every other bishop in the Church is an unpaid lay volunteer.

I also know that my stake president, and your stake president, and every other stake president in the Church is an unpaid lay volunteer.

I also know that, out of these thousands of unpaid lay volunteers, a very tiny minority are shoulder-tapped and asked to give up their careers and serve the Lord full time; for which, they are financially compensated. I've known this since I was a teenager, which is rather a long time ago.

So if you're unable to substantiate your claim that the Church has described the GA's as unpaid volunteers, I think we can take that as refuted.

Fine...your need to be right far exceeds my need to prove you wrong.  I just really don't  care.  I made an observation that was IMO based on my experience.

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On ‎1‎/‎7‎/‎2018 at 3:42 PM, JLHPROF said:

If true, who cares?

Ridiculous waste of time.  At least it's not an anti hit piece.  Whatever this questionable site is they provide net worth on lots of people.

So Pres. Monson was relatively wealthy.  Is there some reason he shouldn't be?

Mormon leaders deny they don't get paid so yes 

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1 hour ago, Danzo said:

It Sounds like you had the impression growing up that General Authorities were unpaid volunteers (in the financial sense).

Later you found out that they weren't.

My question is, why does this new piece of information bother you?

Was this the first time you found out something you previously thought you knew was wrong?

Did you ever think much about it?

I mean, these people travel all of the time and don't work full time jobs. Either they are independently wealthy or they receive some support from someone.  While Some of them may be independently wealthy, I know many of them didn't have those kind of jobs.

How did you actually think they ate and paid the rent?

 

 

It doesn't bother me really.  I am just saying that it has been a perception (IMO) of a lot of older members that all leaders were relatively unpaid.  I have found out a lot of things that I previously thought was wrong...this is why I resigned..:P 

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On 1/10/2018 at 6:02 PM, carbon dioxide said:

All things considered, I think it is quite modest based on one simple fact.  There is NO retirement plan for apostles.  Usually people work and make a lot of money and eventually retire and live off their money and do the things they want to do.  For an Apostle, you work until the day you die or are long as you are able to work.  Most people will not choose this path even if it offers them a good check.  A doctor might make a million a year but eventually they want to retire and do other things. 

I'm glad that there is the emeritus status for those that would be better off retired for health or other reasons. I wish the apostles had that choice readily offered. But I don't know how it all works. I just wonder how many would love to be able to retire. Kind of feels like imprisonment, but I'm coming from a whole different mindset than most on here. 

Edited by Tacenda
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2 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

I'm glad that there is the emeritus status for those that would be better off retired for health or other reasons. I wish the apostles had that choice readily offered. But I don't know how it all works. I just wonder how many would love to be able to retire. Kind of feels like imprisonment, but I'm coming from a whole different mindset than most on here. 

I agree  I realize that tis is basically a kkind of lifetime commitment and certainly not an easy to walk away from for any reason.  I feel for them in this respect.  If I thought I had to work at Walmart until I die...I would be dead..:huh:

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1 minute ago, Hamba Tuhan said:

Oddly, I've never considered serving the Lord and fellowman as a kind of punishment one needs to escape from.

Well, like I said, I'm coming from a whole different mindset. You truly are a standout LDS Hamba. You love the work, maybe if I loved it like you do, I wouldn't feel this way. But these gentlemen are way up there in age, and I'm sure get so tired. 

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2 hours ago, Tacenda said:

You love the work, maybe if I loved it like you do, I wouldn't feel this way.

I think you've hit on an important point. One of my mates recently posted a question on Facebook about the purpose of life. I suggested that my understanding includes learning to know for ourselves from personal experience what creates lasting happiness and what doesn't ... and then learning to love the former.

I have found in my life that the knowledge doesn't always engender the love, and this has been the specific reality that has most developed my faith in Christ and His atonement. In many cases, I can change some of my behaviour as an act of discipline or self-will. But I've never been able to change my desires on my own. That, to me, is the 'mighty change of heart' spoken of in the scriptures: when the Saviour alters us so that we love what He loves.

Quote

But these gentlemen are way up there in age, and I'm sure get so tired. 

I suspect they feel perpetually 'heavy laden'. I sincerely doubt they would wish to give up the one thing that 'gives them rest'.

Edited by Hamba Tuhan
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23 hours ago, kiwi57 said:

CFR please, Jeanne. I'm looking for something in writing from an official Church source, or something in a Conference talk claiming that General Authorities were "unpaid laymen and volunteers."

Rumours don't count.

Hugh W. Pinnock made a statement in April 1980 General Conference that does not differentiate between general authorities and lay clegy.

Quote

Consider these additional aspects of the restored Church: a great women’s program involving in meaningful ways over 400,000 of our sisters who are leading and teaching in various organizations; the Aaronic Priesthood and the Melchizedek Priesthood, which involve the men and boys in a multiplicity of powerful and helpful ways; worship services on the first day of the week; holy temples where eternal marriage and other ordinances are performed, including baptism for the dead; a worldwide missionary system wherein 30,000 men and women serve; baptism by immersion for the remission of sins; an unpaid clergy (“freely ye have received, freely give” [Matt. 10:8]); teachings that stress the redeeming and positive in life; and an extensive welfare program to assist the poor and needy in dignity and love. The list goes on and on.

I could not find any general conference talk that discussed the "modest living allowance" of the general authorities.

On the LDS Newsroom page there is a blog about "The Church's Unpaid Clergy." I could not find a blog about the "modest living allowance."

There are some paragraphs in some lessons that mention the "modest living allowance,"

Quote

In our day, General Authorities of the Church give up their livelihoods to serve full-time, so they receive a modest living allowance—enough for them to support themselves and their families.  Link

IMO more people know about the unpaid clergy claim than know about the GA stipend.

Edited by Thinking
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3 hours ago, Raingirl said:

Your comment makes no sense. No surprise there. 

Not at all. Josh said (minus the huge font and garish colour) "Mormon leaders deny they don't get paid."

In the which, he's absolutely correct.

Parse it carefully. Mormon leaders deny that they don't get paid.

IOW, if you asked a GA: "Elder B, is it true that you don't get paid?" he'd say, "No."

I really don't know if Josh told the truth on purpose (in fact, I rather suspect that he didn't) but his statement is true as it stands.

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