New Archaeological Tool Could Find Zarahemla...it's Only a Matter of Time

[Johnnie Cake]

National Geographic Fellow, Sarah Parcak, an Egyptologist, is pioneering the young field of satellite archaeology, using futuristic tools to unlock secrets from the past and transform the way discoveries are made. "We're using satellites to help map and model cultural features that could never be seen on the ground because they're obscured by modernization, forests, or soil," she explains.

Parcak blends expertise with advanced computer programs, satellite imagery analysis, and old-fashioned digging to reveal thousands of new sites, including lost pyramids, temples, monasteries, tombs, homes, and even entire towns.

Parcak has already been successful in using this new tool to discover "other" previously unknown Egyptian Cities and sights...Now all we need is someone brave enough to ask her to go on a search for the long lost City of Zarahemla, Earthquake ravaged Lamanite and Nephite Cities from when Christ visited America (so far none have been discovered) or any other hidden Book of Mormon city.  It's only a matter of time until we have actual archaeological proof for the existence of the Book of Mormon....and boy I can hardly wait.

 

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/explorers/bios/sarah-parcak/

[bluebell]

What would a hidden book of mormon city look like, and how could we tell it a part from other non-book of mormon cities?

[Johnnie Cake]

28 minutes ago, bluebell said:

What would a hidden book of mormon city look like, and how could we tell it a part from other non-book of mormon cities?

On the outskirts of the city would be a large sign...saying "Welcome to Zarahemla...What Happens Here Stays Here"

[clarkgoble]

I tend to be skeptical we'd see much that could tag a city as Nephite from archaeology. The cities likely persist past the end of the Nephites with any texts likely destroyed and even buildings repurposed. The best one could hope for is a city destroyed at the time of Christ that happened to have some artifacts but even that's not likely. (As I recall some speculate that one lost city under that lake may fit that criteria -- not that there's anything uniquely Nephite that has been found there)

[notHagoth7]

1 hour ago, Johnnie Cake said:

On the outskirts of the city would be a large sign...saying "Welcome to Zarahemla...What Happens Here Stays Here"

Or:

[T-Shirt]

1 hour ago, Johnnie Cake said:

On the outskirts of the city would be a large sign...saying "Welcome to Zarahemla...What Happens Here Stays Here"

Does this qualify?

 

Edited March 14, 2017 by T-Shirt

[Tacenda]

10 minutes ago, T-Shirt said:

Does this qualify?

 

Where is this?!?! Hill Cumorah?

[bluebell]

4 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

Where is this?!?! Hill Cumorah?

That's not Hill Cumorah.  It's no where near that big.

[ksfisher]

1 hour ago, Johnnie Cake said:

National Geographic Fellow, Sarah Parcak, an Egyptologist, is pioneering the young field of satellite archaeology, using futuristic tools to unlock secrets from the past and transform the way discoveries are made. "We're using satellites to help map and model cultural features that could never be seen on the ground because they're obscured by modernization, forests, or soil," she explains.

Parcak blends expertise with advanced computer programs, satellite imagery analysis, and old-fashioned digging to reveal thousands of new sites, including lost pyramids, temples, monasteries, tombs, homes, and even entire towns.

Parcak has already been successful in using this new tool to discover "other" previously unknown Egyptian Cities and sights...Now all we need is someone brave enough to ask her to go on a search for the long lost City of Zarahemla, Earthquake ravaged Lamanite and Nephite Cities from when Christ visited America (so far none have been discovered) or any other hidden Book of Mormon city.  It's only a matter of time until we have actual archaeological proof for the existence of the Book of Mormon....and boy I can hardly wait.

 

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/explorers/bios/sarah-parcak/

What if Zarahemla has already been found and we just don't know it.  In looking for Istanbul what if we've found Constantinople?  After all, even old New York was once New Amsterdam...

[Tacenda]

3 minutes ago, bluebell said:

That's not Hill Cumorah.  It's no where near that big.

I know that Bluebell.

[T-Shirt]

10 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

Where is this?!?! Hill Cumorah?

Cerro Vigia in Veracruz, Central Mexico

[cinepro]

I imagined it being more like this:

Edited March 14, 2017 by cinepro

[T-Shirt]

2 minutes ago, cinepro said:

I imagined it being more like this:

That's obviously photoshopped, there are no braces behind the letters!

[cinepro]

2 hours ago, Johnnie Cake said:

National Geographic Fellow, Sarah Parcak, an Egyptologist, is pioneering the young field of satellite archaeology, using futuristic tools to unlock secrets from the past and transform the way discoveries are made. "We're using satellites to help map and model cultural features that could never be seen on the ground because they're obscured by modernization, forests, or soil," she explains.

Parcak blends expertise with advanced computer programs, satellite imagery analysis, and old-fashioned digging to reveal thousands of new sites, including lost pyramids, temples, monasteries, tombs, homes, and even entire towns.

Parcak has already been successful in using this new tool to discover "other" previously unknown Egyptian Cities and sights...Now all we need is someone brave enough to ask her to go on a search for the long lost City of Zarahemla, Earthquake ravaged Lamanite and Nephite Cities from when Christ visited America (so far none have been discovered) or any other hidden Book of Mormon city.  It's only a matter of time until we have actual archaeological proof for the existence of the Book of Mormon....and boy I can hardly wait.

 

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/explorers/bios/sarah-parcak/

Not needed.  Meldrum has already found Zarahemla:

 

 

 

[Marmonboy]

Of course, because the Saints named a patch of prairie Zarahemla, it must be the real Zarahemla!!

[bluebell]

Just now, Marmonboy said:

Of course, because the Saints named a patch of prairie Zarahemla, it must be the real Zarahemla!!

Who knew Bountiful and Zarahemla were so far a part!

[Johnnie Cake]

5 hours ago, bluebell said:

What would a hidden book of mormon city look like, and how could we tell it a part from other non-book of mormon cities?

I'm always surprised every time this apologetic attention deflection technique is rolled out (no offense Blueblell) whenever the question is asked Why haven't we found Zarahemla, a Nephite artifact or anything else that might act as evidence for the existence of any Book of Mormon claim....the apologetic question then follows asking well duh what would that look like?  Why isn't the answer just as simple and easily answered from a direct reading of the BoM that could answer this question.  The city of Zarahemla would look exactly like the Nephite City that it claims to be...complete with Nephite Walls, Nephite armaments such as steal swords and the like, it might have the remains of dead horses, or a wheeled chariots remains, perhaps a wheat or barley silo still within the city walls or any of the other markings claimed to have existed in the Nephite civilization...if we're lucky we might even find a limnah of gold or an onti of silver laying around. Why would we expect to find anything other than what the book claims existed in the Nephite civilization? I mean seriously why make it any more complicated than what the Book of Mormon claims to have existed in the Book of Mormon. So what would we find and what would it look like...it would look like a Nephite City with many of the markings one would expect to find in a Nephite City...also it would probably have a lot of Christology within its walls as well...that's what a Book of Mormon city would look like and that is how we could tell it apart from all non-BoM cities.  But perhaps our best and first choice would be to focus on all of these cities that were destroyed by earthquakes and whose contests and people were buried with them.

How is an Egyptian village identified as an ancient Egyptian village or a Greek village identified as a Greek village...they have all of the markings and contents one would expect to find within an Egyptian or Greek village...why would we rise the bar higher for a Nephite village or city it should have to meet the same standard as that of any claimed ancient civilization?

Archaeologist can tell the difference  between an Etruscan  and a Roman village Why?  Because each has distinct and unique characteristic's.  The distinct characteristic's of a BoM city have been provided within the pages of the BoM...  those unique qualities will easily set them apart form those of the cities of native non Nephite populations

Edited March 14, 2017 by Johnnie Cake

[clarkgoble]

1 hour ago, Johnnie Cake said:

The city of Zarahemla would look exactly like the Nephite City that it claims to be...complete with Nephite Walls, Nephite armaments such as steal swords and the like, it might have the remains of dead horses, or a wheeled chariots remains, perhaps a wheat or barley silo still within the city walls or any of the other markings claimed to have existed in the Nephite civilization...if we're lucky we might even find a limnah of gold or an onti of silver laying around.

What would a limnah of gold or an onti of silver look like that you could identify them? (Especially if they are, as most argue, merely weights) Further if the cities persisted after the Nephites were destroyed, why would they remain in the city? Wouldn't others take the valuable items?

For the horses, chariots and the like, if they are as apologists suggest Tapirs and ritualistic carts, would you recognize them? The whole point of the apologists is that our expectations when we read the text are probably wrong. Now don't get me wrong, if we find steel somewhere that's a huge deal. I'm not expecting it. But to turn around the question, if steel was found would you suddenly become a believer?

My reading of the Book of Mormon is that you hear about steel swords initially and then they disappear because the technology is lost. The last reference is Jarom 1:8 fairly early on. They then adopt traditional Macuahuitl. So if you find a city from the era of Mosiah - Mormon we should not expect to find steel swords. There may have been only a few swords made by Nephi and then nothing. Even the reference to sword making appears only in 2 Nephi 5:14 but that's a rather vague "after the manner of" which may be anything that cuts like a sword or it might actually be a sword. But of course making swords is hard. The sword of laban is mentioned later, but it might be precisely because it is so unusual. Further it's not mentioned used in war after Jacob 1:10. Mosiah 1:16 treats it more as a sacred relic.

The whole point of apologists is that just like a Christian home in Rome looks Roman, a Nephite home will probably be indistinguishable from other mayan homes. If you find some artifact that is unambiguously Nephite that'd be great. But again it's not at all clear what that would be.

Edited March 14, 2017 by clarkgoble

[Storm Rider]

Humans enjoy arguing about the historicity of almost all religious beliefs, etc.  The historicity question of the Book of Mormon is no different than that focused on the Bible and other religious writings.  What puzzles me more is IF they found and proved Book of Mormon historicity what impact it would have on humanity as a whole?  Would the nay sayers immediately repent and follow Christ?  Would those who heard about the discoveries immediately leave their religious traditions and embrace the Church?  I don't think so; the unfaithful will continue to be unfaithful, the doubters will never cease to doubt, and life would go on while people find more to b---- and complain about the Church, its leaders, its teachings, and beliefs.  

So what is new?

[Gervin]

18 minutes ago, clarkgoble said:

If you find some artifact that is unambiguously Nephite that'd be great. But again it's not at all clear what that would be.

Doesn't the Book of Mormon describe a reformed Hebraic / Egyptian writing system that was used for around 1,000 years?  We see plenty of Mayan traces of their writing system in carved stone, in paint on walls, etc.  How could the written language as described in the Book of Mormon not also leave behind examples?

[dberrie2000]

1 hour ago, Johnnie Cake said:

I'm always surprised every time this apologetic attention deflection technique is rolled out (no offense Blueblell) whenever the question is asked Why haven't we found Zarahemla, a Nephite artifact or anything else that might act as evidence for the existence of any Book of Mormon claim....the apologetic question then follows asking well duh what would that look like?  Why isn't the answer just as simple and easily answered from a direct reading of the BoM that could answer this question.  The city of Zarahemla would look exactly like the Nephite City that it claims to be...complete with Nephite Walls, Nephite armaments such as steal swords and the like..

"Steal" swords in the tropics--for 1500 years, eh?

[Johnnie Cake]

44 minutes ago, clarkgoble said:

What would a limnah of gold or an onti of silver look like that you could identify them? (Especially if they are, as most argue, merely weights) Further if the cities persisted after the Nephites were destroyed, why would they remain in the city? Wouldn't others take the valuable items?

For the horses, chariots and the like, if they are as apologists suggest Tapirs and ritualistic carts, would you recognize them? The whole point of the apologists is that our expectations when we read the text are probably wrong. Now don't get me wrong, if we find steel somewhere that's a huge deal. I'm not expecting it. But to turn around the question, if steel was found would you suddenly become a believer?

My reading of the Book of Mormon is that you hear about steel swords initially and then they disappear because the technology is lost. The last reference is Jarom 1:8 fairly early on. They then adopt traditional Macuahuitl. So if you find a city from the era of Mosiah - Mormon we should not expect to find steel swords. There may have been only a few swords made by Nephi and then nothing. Even the reference to sword making appears only in 2 Nephi 5:14 but that's a rather vague "after the manner of" which may be anything that cuts like a sword or it might actually be a sword. But of course making swords is hard. The sword of laban is mentioned later, but it might be precisely because it is so unusual. Further it's not mentioned used in war after Jacob 1:10. Mosiah 1:16 treats it more as a sacred relic.

The whole point of apologists is that just like a Christian home in Rome looks Roman, a Nephite home will probably be indistinguishable from other mayan homes. If you find some artifact that is unambiguously Nephite that'd be great. But again it's not at all clear what that would be.

Oh I just threw in the limnah and onti in for color...but I'd bet my life that no one will ever find either of these so called measurements of weight... and as for horses and chariots...of course apologists have set aside horses and chariots for tapirs and travois...they're smart enough to know that neither the horse nor wheeled vehicles of work existed in ancient America.

But I find it interesting that apologist like to say that we know from a close reading of the Book of Mormon that lehi's party merged with "others"  ummm ok...so why then when we apply this same standard in other BoM claims...a close reading of the BoM is rejected....seems like apologetic cherry picking to me.

And I  reject your claim that a Nephite house would be indistinguishable from a Mayan house...pure bunk...Mayan house's actually exist.  Nephite house's do not...at least not out side the pages of the Book of Mormon.

 

Edited March 14, 2017 by Johnnie Cake

[Gray]

I would think that Nephite cities could be discerned from other native cities by their inscriptions, yes? We might also expect, early on at least, for the architecture to be quite different from any other known group. 

Edited March 14, 2017 by Gray

[CA Steve]

So if we do not know what a Book of Mormon city would look like, what is in this book?

 

Mormon's Codex: An Ancient American Book

[Johnnie Cake]

deleted

Edited March 14, 2017 by Johnnie Cake