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Just Another P-Day at the Mall...


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Recent rule changes in my local mission have disallowed missionaries from using the computers at the library for emailing home on P-day (the computers are too isolated, so companions can't see each others' computer screens).  Member's homes are off limits. 

Where can missionaries go and find free access to the internet, where the computer screens can be seen by their companions?  Turns out the local Apple store works great!

So each P-day, the entire zone of missionaries (as many as 15 or 20) descend on the Apple store to email friends and family about their weekly adventures. 

But the oddest aspect of all this is that they're allowed to email as much as they want during this time period.  Which means if a friend or family member is online, they can effectively "chat" by emailing back and forth.  So they can sit there for hours and chat with friends and family.  I guess each zone has to find their own solution, and some Apple stores (and Microsoft stores, and Best Buys...) are more tolerant than others.  And yes, customers do mistake them for employees and ask for help.  And not all computers have USB ports, so you have to get there early if you want to be able to upload pictures or documents to send home.

Of course, when I heard about this I had to get a picture or two.  Here they are, the Armies of Helaman, at rest at the Apple Store:

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They don't have a time limit on the computers?  (Imposed by mission rules, not Apple or someone else)

The chatting back and forth via emails is nothing new.  My sisters have been on missions throughout the last decade and all have done this.  One of them I talked with more ON her mission than off because of this. 

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All modern day missionaries I've ever seen have tablets for their scriptures that can also connect to the internet via Wi-Fi, and we all know how easy it is to find a place with Wi-Fi access, I think.

And the tablets are big enough for more than one missionary to look at it at the same time.

Surely the "brethren" are aware of all of this.

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3 minutes ago, Ahab said:

All modern day missionaries I've ever seen have tablets for their scriptures that can also connect to the internet via Wi-Fi, and we all know how easy it is to find a place with Wi-Fi access, I think.

And the tablets are big enough for more than one missionary to look at it at the same time.

Surely the "brethren" are aware of all of this.

That doesn't mean that they have email capabilities though.  You can lock things up pretty well if you want to.  My son has an iPhone that has all of his scriptures and that stuff but he can't email and while he can access wi-fi he can't access the internet or email.

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12 minutes ago, Ahab said:

All modern day missionaries I've ever seen have tablets for their scriptures that can also connect to the internet via Wi-Fi, and we all know how easy it is to find a place with Wi-Fi access, I think.

And the tablets are big enough for more than one missionary to look at it at the same time.

Surely the "brethren" are aware of all of this.

As bluebell said, I think their devices are locked out of email and texting. 

Considering how often I checked the mailbox on my mission, I suspect the temptation to check your Inbox would be overwhelming for some missionaries whenever they got near a hotspot.

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16 minutes ago, bluebell said:

That doesn't mean that they have email capabilities though.  You can lock things up pretty well if you want to.  My son has an iPhone that has all of his scriptures and that stuff but he can't email and while he can access wi-fi he can't access the internet or email.

Hmm, okay, but if the elders wanted to I'm sure they could learn how easy it is to reset their tablets to the default factory settings and then load them with whatever setting and software they could get via the internet.

I have a feeling though that they really don't want to make those kinds of changes.

Edited by Ahab
typo, unfortunately
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I'm the kind of guy who usually goes with my gut instincts while trying to avoid breaking specific laws/rules and when there is no law/rule given that I would respect then I feel I must do what I believe is the right thing, or at least a good thing, to do.

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11 minutes ago, cinepro said:

I know some missions with iPads have "tablet checks" at the District meetings and Zone Conferences where the DL/ZL inspects all the iPads to make sure they haven't been tampered with. 

It's like Joseph Smith said, "I teach them correct principles and inspect their iPads at Zone Conferences."

Part of teaching is checking to see if someone understands the principle, supervising them to ensure they have it right prior to setting them off to govern themselves.  Some of the worst teachers I have seen have been great at demonstrating the principles themselves, but they never cared enough to take the time and make the effort to ensure their students could then properly demonstrate that they had learn them.

You don't show a five year old the correct principles behind operating a stove once and then just let him govern himself around it.  Why assume youth and young adults or even adults are different?

While there are likely many missionaries who are indeed ready to govern themselves, there are others who cannot yet.  There will be less resistance to supervision, which can interfere with learning of responsibility, if everyone is treated the same.

Edited by Calm
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29 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Hmm, okay, but if the elders wanted to I'm sure they could learn how easy it is to reset their tablets to the default factory settings and then load them with whatever setting and software they could get via the internet.

I have a feeling though that they really don't want to make those kinds of changes.

Yes, i'm sure many missionaries could break the rules concerning use of their electronic devices if they wanted to and tried hard enough.  

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9 minutes ago, Calm said:

Part of teaching is checking to see if someone understands the principle, supervising them to ensure they have it right prior to setting them off to govern themselves.  Some of the worst teachers I have seen have been great at demonstrating the principles themselves, but they never cared enough to take the time and make the effort to ensure their students could then properly demonstrate that they had learn them.

You don't show a five year old the correct principles behind operating a stove once and then just let him govern himself around it.  Why assume youth and young adults or even adults are different?

While there are likely many missionaries who are indeed ready to govern themselves, there are others who cannot yet.  There will be less resistance to supervision, which can interfere with learning of responsibility, if everyone is treated the same.

If you're arguing that missionaries are treated like five-year-olds, I can't disagree with you.  I won't even argue that many of them shouldn't be.

As for what this says about the men and women being called on missions, and how the goals and policies of the missionary program are structured and implemented, I can only wonder...?

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11 minutes ago, Meadowchik said:

Cinepro, my six-year-old is going nuts over your avatar.  He insisted I go back to the page to see it again and erupted in a torrent of giggles.  :)

Yes, cinepro does look a lot like Yoda, the Jedi.  Looks like, I say, but is NOT Yoda.

Please teach your 6 year old that there is a difference and, when in doubt, look to Yoda as the kind of teacher that young padawans should have.

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4 minutes ago, bluebell said:

Yes, i'm sure many missionaries could break the rules concerning use of their electronic devices if they wanted to and tried hard enough.  

Do you know how the rule is worded, exactly?

"Do not use library computers to email" doesn't mean they can't use other computers, or even their own pocket computer/phone/tablet to email.

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Just now, Ahab said:

Do you know how the rule is worded, exactly?

"Do not use library computers to email" doesn't mean they can't use other computers, or even their own pocket computer/phone/tablet to email.

No i don't.  I'm not a missionary so it's irrelevant to me.  I've been a missionary though and i do know that mission Presidents aren't stupid.  They will make sure that missionaries absolutely understand what the rules are.  

And obviously, if a mission iPad has the email purposely disabled, then missionaries should have the brain power to understand that that means 'don't use this to email.'  

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7 minutes ago, bluebell said:

No i don't.  I'm not a missionary so it's irrelevant to me.  I've been a missionary though and i do know that mission Presidents aren't stupid.  They will make sure that missionaries absolutely understand what the rules are.  

And obviously, if a mission iPad has the email purposely disabled, then missionaries should have the brain power to understand that that means 'don't use this to email.'  

I try to avoid making assumptions because the assumptions I make could be and often are wrong.  Not that they always are, but they could be.

So to assume that the reason their devices are not set up for email is because their leaders do not want them to use them for email, at any time, even on their p-day, is not an assumption that I would make.

It would simply be a sign to me that they "have not" been set up for emails.

Edited by Ahab
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Just now, Ahab said:

I try to avoid making assumptions because the assumptions I make could be and often are wrong.  Not that they always are, but they could be.

So to assume that the reason their devices are not set up for email us because their leaders do not want them to use them for email, at any time, even on their p-day, is not an assumption that I would make.

It would simply be a sign to me that they "have not" been set up for emails.

It's an assumption you should make.  

iPads come set up for emails.  You have to purposefully choose to disable it.  And mission iPad's are set up so that only certain people have access to make those kinds of changes.  They are locked down.

Since mission iPads are purposefully set up so that email is disabled, and missionaries do not have authority to change that, it's reasonable to assume that the mission president does not want them using it to email.

It would be unreasonable to assume anything else.

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2 minutes ago, bluebell said:

It's an assumption you should make.  

iPads come set up for emails.  You have to purposefully choose to disable it.  And mission iPad's are set up so that only certain people have access to make those kinds of changes.  They are locked down.

Since mission iPads are purposefully set up so that email is disabled, and missionaries do not have authority to change that, it's reasonable to assume that the mission president does not want them using it to email.

It would be unreasonable to assume anything else.

It would be another unwarranted assumption for me to assume that you are right just because you say so.  And from personal experience I remember having to set up my own email accounts on my own phones after I got them.  

So for now I will simply say that I am not convinced by your argument and I will continue to try to avoid making assumptions.

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10 minutes ago, Ahab said:

It would be another unwarranted assumption for me to assume that you are right just because you say so.  And from personal experience I remember having to set up my own email accounts on my own phones after I got them.  

So for now I will simply say that I am not convinced by your argument and I will continue to try to avoid making assumptions.

Yes, you have to set up your own email, because that's how the device comes to you-it comes to you ready for email.  You had the option to set up your own email because email comes enabled on your phone.  

Missionary iPads typically have email disabled, meaning there is no option to set up an email.  The option to have email has been blocked by the mission.

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Ahah, why don't you ask a recent missionary what his/her experience was to see if there is a likelihood that any missionary would miss using devices given to them by the Church were not intended to include email privileges.

Edited by Calm
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Ugh..having people looking over your shoulder 24/7 is not an ideal way to grow, think..and learn.  This is why when I have familiar friends/missionaries at the store, should conversation from them, I tell them that if they need to contact home..if they need to call parents and are upset about anything, they are welcomed to use my phone (in privacy).  This is sad and rediculous.  Having just a day to be in touch is a good thing..but having others watch is quite another. 

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