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MormonLeaks publishes docs on GA pay, meetings

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I don't have an issue with these salaries.   I assume they receive other perks/compensation on top of this amount and have no issue with that either.   I don't have the same level of responsibility they do but I earn a comparable amount.   

At some point I believe the LDS Church will need to become more transparent with finances or these types of leaks will become more common

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15 minutes ago, Calm said:

Not only did the Church get money through sale of Utah lands as Nehor pointed out, there are a lot of people who donate to the Church outside of tithing and fast offerings and this is often in real estate or stocks or other forms of property.  It is not unusual from what I hear for major bequests to be left to the Church.

That's like saying that same exact water poured from 2, 3 or 10 pitchers into single bowl can returned back into the same pitchers and contain the same exact water molecules as were in the original pitchers.... sorry I don't believe it...but the church can dispell this mystery by being transparent 

Edited by Johnnie Cake

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1 minute ago, Johnnie Cake said:

That's like saying that same exact water poured from 2, 3 or 10 pitchers into single bowl can returned back into the same pitchers and contain the same exact water molecules as were in the original pitchers.... sorry I don't believe it

Then you can't claim they are paid from tithing either because if you can't track other donations, you can't track tithing.

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10 minutes ago, Calm said:

Of the last seven, only Bednar (52) and one other (58) were not in their 60s.

I dread the day there is an apostle younger then me. :) 

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16 minutes ago, rockpond said:

And how was the church able to sell lands in Utah to make this money?  Oh yeah, the sacrifices of the saints. 

Its all consecrated money and the D&C doesn't separate out the funds that came directly from tithing vs those that were otherwise consecrated to the church.  The same requirement is on all funds that the church has. 

Uhhhhhh.....no.

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6 minutes ago, Johnnie Cake said:

That's like saying that same exact water poured from 2, 3 or 10 pitchers into single bowl can returned back into the same pitchers and contain the same exact water molecules as were in the original pitchers.... sorry I don't believe it...but the church can dispell this mystery by being transparent 

But then you would find out about our secret survival and world domination bunker under Adam-ondi-Ahman.

We also have huge stockpiles of silver and gold down there too.

Why would we want to be transparent?

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12 minutes ago, sjdawg said:

I don't have an issue with these salaries.   I assume they receive other perks/compensation on top of this amount and have no issue with that either.   I don't have the same level of responsibility they do but I earn a comparable amount.   

At some point I believe the LDS Church will need to become more transparent with finances or these types of leaks will become more common

You mean more incredibly boring leaks? The Church will collapse if that happens.

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1 hour ago, mfbukowski said:

First of all, cut all those salaries by at least 11% because those individuals give back at least that much to the organization which pays them!

 

It seems like I read somewhere once that Apostles exempted themselves from the tithing requirement back in the 1840's.     Does that sound right to anyone?   I can't recall where I read it.   

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5 minutes ago, sjdawg said:

It seems like I read somewhere once that Apostles exempted themselves from the tithing requirement back in the 1840's.     Does that sound right to anyone?   I can't recall where I read it.   

Actually, I believe that the leak showed that Eyrings tithing is automatically deducted from his paycheck. He pays a full tithe. 10% of gross income

Edited by Johnnie Cake

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47 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

It does to me. Stipend doesn't necessarily mean small. It is a payment given not for work but so that the person does not need a paying job.

I should have stated "modest stipend" as opposed to "living stipend".   Keep in mind that this amount does not include what are likely very generous benefits.  

When the Church uses "modest stipend" to describe their pay, do you think most members imagine anywhere close to 120k/year plus generous benefits?

Once again I'm all for paying the brethren a fair salary (I'm one of the few here that believe BPs and SPs should be paid as well), just be open about it, or at the very least don't be misleading.

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Just now, Johnnie Cake said:

Actually, I believe that the leak showed that Erings tithing is automatically deducted from his paycheck. He pays a full tithe. 10% of gross income

Thanks.  I haven't reviewed any of the leaked documents.

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I'm actually surprised they're paid so little

Edited by Johnnie Cake

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14 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

You mean more incredibly boring leaks? The Church will collapse if that happens.

Who said anything about the Church collapsing?   

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26 minutes ago, Calm said:

Then you can't claim they are paid from tithing either because if you can't track other donations, you can't track tithing.

I think the suggestion is that the Church, being a church (if not the church), might prudently consider every single penny that comes under its control to be "tithing", regardless of its origin.

Certainly, the Church seems to promote the idea that all the money that its members receive should be considered "the Lord's" (and therefore "tithable").  If there are different kinds of money that I earn, and only some of it is actually considered "the Lord's" and the rest is non-tithing income, I wish the Church wouldn't keep this a secret only to themselves.

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Just now, The Nehor said:

I dread the day there is an apostle younger then me. :) 

i'm sure there are no end of guys who want to be, the more's the pity

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2 minutes ago, cinepro said:

I think the suggestion is that the Church, being a church (if not the church), might prudently consider every single penny that comes under its control to be "tithing", regardless of its origin.

Certainly, the Church seems to promote the idea that all the money that its members receive should be considered "the Lord's" (and therefore "tithable").  If there are different kinds of money that I earn, and only some of it is actually considered "the Lord's" and the rest is non-tithing income, I wish the Church wouldn't keep this a secret only to themselves.

I really don't think the Lord likes how the church spends His money. Nothing in the Bible about malls, land development etc. Maybe shelters, hospitals, nursing homes, would be better suited.

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I have a document that is interesting but not no way not no how would I send it to that fella to put up online. It's not that interesting, really

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41 minutes ago, Calm said:

Really?  I know in the past they were called pretty early, but in the past 20 years or more it seems like they were in their 60s.

The average age at ordination is 57.73 years, and the median age is 59--based on my handy-dandy Excel spreadsheet.

Thomas S. Monson 21-Aug-27 10-Oct-63 36
Henry B. Eyring 31-May-33 1-Apr-95 61
Dieter F. Uchtdorf 6-Nov-40 2-Oct-07 66
Russell M. Nelson 9-Sep-24 7-Apr-84 59
Dallin H. Oaks 12-Aug-32 1-May-84 51
M. Russell Ballard 8-Oct-28 6-Oct-85 56
Robert D. Hales 24-Aug-32 2-Apr-92 59
Jeffery R. Holland 3-Dec-40 23-Jun-94 53
David A. Bednar 15-Jun-52 7-Oct-04 52
Quenten L. Cook 8-Sep-40 6-Oct-07 67
D. Todd Christofferson 24-Jan-45 5-Apr-08 63
Neil L. Andersen 9-Aug-51 4-Apr-09 57
Ronald A. Rasband 6-Feb-51 3-Oct-15 64
Gary E. Stevenson 6-Aug-55 3-Oct-15 60
Dale G. Renlund 13-Nov-52 3-Oct-15 62
      57.73333333

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In the trib a church spokesman disclosed this little gem, previously unknown I might add, that all GAs 1st presidency, the 12, 70s etc all earn the same income...too bad it took a leak for the church to share this nugget

Edited by Johnnie Cake

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40 minutes ago, The Nehor said:

Uhhhhhh.....no.

Feel free to explain how the church came to have all the profitable assets without any help from its members. 

Then document how the non-consecrated funds are used to pay the apostles and GA's. 

 

Edited by rockpond

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10 minutes ago, Duncan said:

I have a document that is interesting but not no way not no how would I send it to that fella to put up online. It's not that interesting, really

Most of the docs leaked to date have not been very interesting.  

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32 minutes ago, omni said:

I should have stated "modest stipend" as opposed to "living stipend".   Keep in mind that this amount does not include what are likely very generous benefits.  

When the Church uses "modest stipend" to describe their pay, do you think most members imagine anywhere close to 120k/year plus generous benefits?

I did.

15 minutes ago, Tacenda said:

I really don't think the Lord likes how the church spends His money. Nothing in the Bible about malls, land development etc. Maybe shelters, hospitals, nursing homes, would be better suited.

None of which Jesus built either.

17 minutes ago, Duncan said:

i'm sure there are no end of guys who want to be, the more's the pity

Want to be apostles? I kind of wish I had that level of workaholicism. I'd be a millionaire by now.

7 minutes ago, rockpond said:

Feel free to explain how the church came to have all the profitable assets without any help from its members. 

Then document how the non-consecrated funds are used to pay the apostles and GA's. 

Thank you. I will feel free to if I ever feel so inclined. That is a big burden off my mind.

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