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GLBT+ Protest planned for Fast Sunday?

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1 minute ago, Mystery Meat said:

I am still not sure how to create this safe space that you envision. I am open to your further recommendations.

How about wearing just a little ribbon to let them know that they are okay and loved for who they are? 

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13 minutes ago, JAHS said:

The point is that it is inappropriate to do it in Sacrament meeting. It's not the right time to try and force people to look inward on such a controversial issue.  If they could at least wait and do it after Sacrament meeting (ie during the other two hours) it might not be so distracting to one's worship. Can we really be certain that those wearing it are not doing it in the spirit of contention? For some, I don't think so. 

Love and support isn't a controversial issue.  If someone showing love and support for a marginalized group is distracting to one's worship, I think Sacrament Mtg is a perfect time to look inward and evaluate.

Edited by rockpond

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12 minutes ago, Jeanne said:

Your experiences break my heart Rockpond.  What do you say to young people who are doing all they can do..and never feel like they have measured up?  I am sorry for them and sorry too that you have to deal with this face to face.  That is the difference..they are real people.  In your bishopric and in your calling, you must have a special gift that lets them share such heartbreak.  For this you are a man of God.

You flatter me.

I just try to love them and help them feel the love of God.

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10 minutes ago, Mystery Meat said:

None of the above, but some that are similar. The LGBT members I am closer to are actually no longer practicing. So the conversations have been quite different.

Practicing?

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9 minutes ago, Mystery Meat said:

I am still not sure how to create this safe space that you envision. I am open to your further recommendations.

Wear a rainbow ribbon this Sunday.

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7 minutes ago, Jeanne said:

How about wearing just a little ribbon to let them know that they are okay and loved for who they are? 

Exactly.

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5 minutes ago, rockpond said:

Love and support isn't a controversial issue.

You know I didn't mean that. We show love and support by how we actually treat people and we encourage others to do that by being good examples; not by what we wear on our lapel.

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35 minutes ago, rockpond said:

Wear a rainbow ribbon this Sunday.

that's it? Wear a pin?

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27 minutes ago, JAHS said:

You know I didn't mean that. We show love and support by how we actually treat people and we encourage others to do that by being good examples; not by what we wear on our lapel.

There is no single right way to show love and support.  I can tell you that not all of our LGBT youth are feeling the love and support we are giving right now so I think looking for other methods of communicating that to them is a great idea.

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1 minute ago, Mystery Meat said:

that's it? Wear a pin?

Yes, wear a rainbow lapel pin.  I think you might be surprised at the results.

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Showing love and support for people is always great.  But there is a line between supporting LGBT individuals and celebrating homosexuality.

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32 minutes ago, Rivers said:

Showing love and support for people is always great.  But there is a line between supporting LGBT individuals and celebrating homosexuality.

What is "celebrating homosexuality"?

 

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56 minutes ago, rockpond said:

What is "celebrating homosexuality"?

 

 

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6 hours ago, Rivers said:

 

I don't think you have to worry about that happening at church. 

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3 hours ago, rockpond said:

I don't think you have to worry about that happening at church. 

Not that, no. 

Just expressing opposition to the leaders and position of the Church. 

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16 hours ago, rockpond said:

There is no single right way to show love and support.  I can tell you that not all of our LGBT youth are feeling the love and support we are giving right now so I think looking for other methods of communicating that to them is a great idea.

Helping them understand their identity as children of God is one way. That includes teaching them they are capable of overcoming the natural man. 

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21 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Helping them understand their identity as children of God is one way. That includes teaching them they are capable of overcoming the natural man. 

What do you think that phrase means to an LGBT youth in our church?  How do you think they understand it?  What message does it send to them?

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25 minutes ago, Scott Lloyd said:

Not that, no. 

Just expressing opposition to the leaders and position of the Church. 

It's your fault if you interpret the wearing of a rainbow ribbon as expressing opposition to the leaders of the church.  That isn't at all what the rainbow ribbon means. 

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22 minutes ago, rockpond said:

It's your fault if you interpret the wearing of a rainbow ribbon as expressing opposition to the leaders of the church.  That isn't at all what the rainbow ribbon means. 

The swastika is commonly used as a religious symbol in Hinduism and Buddhism. Maybe I will wear swastika pin on my lapel to church this Sunday. People will just think I am a Hindu, right?

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36 minutes ago, JAHS said:

The swastika is commonly used as a religious symbol in Hinduism and Buddhism. Maybe I will wear swastika pin on my lapel to church this Sunday. People will just think I am a Hindu, right?

When has the rainbow ribbon ever been used as a symbol of opposition to LDS church leaders?

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4 minutes ago, rockpond said:

When has the rainbow ribbon ever been used as a symbol of opposition to LDS church leaders?

My point is that we need to take some responsibility for what people are going to think. We can't put all the blame on them just because they are not thinking what we want them to think.  The rainbow colors in general have come to represent the active gay lifestyle; an issue that is contrary to the Gospel of Jesus Christ and what our latter-day prophets have told us.  You may want the ribbon to represent love and support for gay people affected by the new policy, but many people are going to see it as a protest against it or as an attempt to promote the gay lifestyle. These thoughts that people will have is not conducive to an experience of proper worship in Sacrament meeting. You say they are wrong for having these thoughts, but they may not even be aware of the real reason you are doing it. 

 

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On 5/29/2016 at 10:32 PM, Robert F. Smith said:

Nonetheless, fast & testimony meetings are sometimes the scene of political diatribes and occasional fisticuffs.  Some members bring guns to sacrament meeting, and sometimes arrests are made there.  It is illegal to disturb religious meetings in virtually every jurisdiction, and an arrestable offense.

Not only do some members bring firearms with them to sacrament meeting (even I have done so in the past), but it might be surprising to some people how many law enforcement officers are LDS.

In my ward alone, we have three men who are federal law enforcement officers with powers of arrest, and they attend every Sunday.  One is in the bishopric.  And we also have two current special operations soldiers who regularly attend -- you know, the kind of guys who took bin Laden down?

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58 minutes ago, Stargazer said:

Not only do some members bring firearms with them to sacrament meeting (even I have done so in the past), but it might be surprising to some people how many law enforcement officers are LDS.

In my ward alone, we have three men who are federal law enforcement officers with powers of arrest, and they attend every Sunday.  One is in the bishopric.  And we also have two current special operations soldiers who regularly attend -- you know, the kind of guys who took bin Laden down?

A friend of mine got into a pushing and shoving match with a couple of FBI agents in his ward in Texas once during sacrament meeting.  All fellow Mormons with some very different points of view -- and maybe too much testosterone -- on fast Sunday.   Church is not the place for politics.

In another case, in Utah, we had an arrest made at the close of a sacrament meeting.  Federal marshals sat quietly and waited until the end of the meeting to take the subject of a warrant into custody.

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4 hours ago, rockpond said:

What do you think that phrase means to an LGBT youth in our church?  How do you think they understand it?  What message does it send to them?

I imagine it varies. 

Some will take it to heart, receive the help they need, and strive to confirm their lives to principles of righteousness. 

Of those who feel pain from it, some will pridefully resist it to their own detriment. 

Many forms of therapy are initially painful but, in the long term, bring healing and wellness. 

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