Youth Pioneer Treks And...mobs? "kill The Mormons!"

[cinepro]

Just when I thought I'd seen it all, this is apparently a thing:

 

http://bycommonconsent.com/2015/06/23/treks-mobs-and-spiritual-escalation/

 

 

Sometimes I think I understand the range of stupidity found in the Church, and then something like this comes along and I realize there are greater idiots in the Church than even I could have imagined (start at 12:20 in the video):

 

Edited June 23, 2015 by cinepro

[bluebell]

I'm not going to watch a 40 minute video to figure out what you're referring to. Care to summarize?

[Duncan]

Why do they even do this anymore? Why don't they celebrate something else like like a Mormon founded Atari, Nolan Bushnell, I think that would have much more appeal !

[HappyJackWagon]

Is this really any different than any other type of trek or even watching a play about the subject? The trek is really just a form of role play to help people connect to certain ideas, or people in church history. I'm sure the theory is that if youth connect emotionally to an experience they will be able to appreciate it better. So how do you connect with history? Role play.

[cinepro]

I'm not going to watch a 40 minute video to figure out what you're referring to. Care to summarize?

 

While on a Pioneer Trek Re-Enactment, adult leaders dressed as mobsters and shooting guns (presumably loaded with blanks) "attack" the camp in the middle of the night.  The youth then hide, pray, sing hymns etc. in an effort to find (fake) protection from the (fake) mob.

[bluebell]

While on a Pioneer Trek Re-Enactment, adult leaders dressed as mobsters and shooting guns (presumably loaded with blanks) "attack" the camp in the middle of the night.  The youth then hide, pray, sing hymns etc. in an effort to find (fake) protection from the (fake) mob.

 

Ah.

 

That doesn't seem too bad, as long as no one was hurt during the surprised or traumatized i guess.  Kind of reminds me of civil war reenactments.  

[BookofMormonLuvr]

No better way to help a group bond than to instill a good healthy sense of persecution. 

[HappyJackWagon]

While on a Pioneer Trek Re-Enactment, adult leaders dressed as mobsters and shooting guns (presumably loaded with blanks) "attack" the camp in the middle of the night.  The youth then hide, pray, sing hymns etc. in an effort to find (fake) protection from the (fake) mob.

We actually did a trek very similar to that back about 10 years ago. It was very memorable for the leaders and kids alike. It was more about getting them to relate to the fear and persecution than it was about getting a fake spiritual reaction by praying for safety from a fake mob. That would seem really over the top. But it was a pretty fun activity. Many of the youth from the time (now have children of their own) still tell me about the impact that had on them. The neat thing was that when they bonded with these reenactments it helped them bond in other ways too. So towards the end of our very arduous trek we had some of the older boys carrying the younger ones who couldn't walk any more. That was inspiring.

[Kenngo1969]

Is this really any different than any other type of trek or even watching a play about the subject? The trek is really just a form of role play to help people connect to certain ideas, or people in church history. I'm sure the theory is that if youth connect emotionally to an experience they will be able to appreciate it better. So how do you connect with history? Role play.

 

 

We actually did a trek very similar to that back about 10 years ago. It was very memorable for the leaders and kids alike. It was more about getting them to relate to the fear and persecution than it was about getting a fake spiritual reaction by praying for safety from a fake mob. That would seem really over the top. But it was a pretty fun activity. Many of the youth from the time (now have children of their own) still tell me about the impact that had on them. The neat thing was that when they bonded with these reenactments it helped them bond in other ways too. So towards the end of our very arduous trek we had some of the older boys carrying the younger ones who couldn't walk any more. That was inspiring.

In less than a week, this is twice now that I find myself agreeing with you.  It was a lot more fun when I could trot out my R. Lee Ermey meme and ask you, "What're you thinking, you jackwagon?!!"  I'm wondering if our newfound trend of accord is more evidence that people should begin preparing for the second coming in earnest!

[Kenngo1969]

No better way to help a group bond than to instill a good healthy sense of persecution. 

I don't know that the "Trek Trend" has as much to do with that as it has to do with the fact (whether you agree that such reenactments are a good idea or not) that it's impossible for members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (and probably those of other restorationist groups) to have a good idea where we are without recognizing where we've come from and the debts we owe our forebears as a result.

[HappyJackWagon]

 

 

In less than a week, this is twice now that I find myself agreeing with you.  It was a lot more fun when I could trot out my R. Lee Ermey meme and ask you, "What're you thinking, you jackwagon?!!"  I'm wondering if our newfound trend of accord is more evidence that people should begin preparing for the second coming in earnest!

I'm happy to agree with anyone if they're right :) :)    (not to be outdone by your emoticon frenzy

[The Nehor]

While on a Pioneer Trek Re-Enactment, adult leaders dressed as mobsters and shooting guns (presumably loaded with blanks) "attack" the camp in the middle of the night.  The youth then hide, pray, sing hymns etc. in an effort to find (fake) protection from the (fake) mob.

But LARPing is fun.

[cinepro]

I don't know that the "Trek Trend" has as much to do with that as it has to do with the fact (whether you agree that such reenactments are a good idea or not) that it's impossible for members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (and probably those of other restorationist groups) to have a good idea where we are without recognizing where we've come from and the debts we owe our forebears as a result.

 

But why does that only seem to apply to the brief period of hand-cart migration?  The history of the Church over the last 170+ years is much more than people in pioneer garb walking down a dirt path. 

 

And as pointed out in that blog post and elsewhere, the current version of the "treks" now involve a mixture of non-historical details seemingly meant to spiritually manipulate the youth, not teach them.  Certainly, there were no mob attacks on the plains.  But I guess it's tough to find Native Americans willing to fake an Indian attack these days.

[HappyJackWagon]

But why does that only seem to apply to the brief period of hand-cart migration?  The history of the Church over the last 170+ years is much more than people in pioneer garb walking down a dirt path. 

 

And as pointed out in that blog post and elsewhere, the current version of the "treks" now involve a mixture of non-historical details seemingly meant to spiritually manipulate the youth, not teach them.  Certainly, there were no mob attacks on the plains.  But I guess it's tough to find Native Americans willing to fake an Indian attack these days.

When we did our we didn't use handcarts. We reenacted the Battle of Crooked River and the ensuing Mormon War. It was pretty epic.

[bluebell]

 

 

And as pointed out in that blog post and elsewhere, the current version of the "treks" now involve a mixture of non-historical details seemingly meant to spiritually manipulate the youth, not teach them.  Certainly, there were no mob attacks on the plains.  But I guess it's tough to find Native Americans willing to fake an Indian attack these days.

 

Someone else pointed out on another thread that this really isn't all that different than when kids do the nativity play for Christmas.  The wise men didn't show up the night the baby was born, but does it really matter?  It's still a good way to help the kids internalize Jesus' birth and the bible narrative.

 

If the point of Trek was to teach history, then that would be a problem.  But that's not really the point is it?  The objective is something different than that.

[The Nehor]

But why does that only seem to apply to the brief period of hand-cart migration?  The history of the Church over the last 170+ years is much more than people in pioneer garb walking down a dirt path. 

 

And as pointed out in that blog post and elsewhere, the current version of the "treks" now involve a mixture of non-historical details seemingly meant to spiritually manipulate the youth, not teach them.  Certainly, there were no mob attacks on the plains.  But I guess it's tough to find Native Americans willing to fake an Indian attack these days.

In trek reenactments liberties are taken with history to mash up some representative events of the period together. The leaders told the youth this before it started.

Are you one of those people who goes to Rennaisance fairs and points out anachronisms?

[Kenngo1969]

But LARPing is fun.

 

There is that.  Whether it's "fun" or not, I think LARPing pioneers certainly is preferable to LARPing someone from the latest blood-and-guts, shoot-em-up, smash-'em-up, blow-stuff-up video game.  If someone reads something, perhaps he will internalize it; if he sees and hears it, perhaps the odds are somewhat greater; if he experiences it, the odds are, perhaps, greatest of all.

Edited June 23, 2015 by Kenngo1969

[Kenngo1969]

But why does that only seem to apply to the brief period of hand-cart migration?  The history of the Church over the last 170+ years is much more than people in pioneer garb walking down a dirt path. 

 

And as pointed out in that blog post and elsewhere, the current version of the "treks" now involve a mixture of non-historical details seemingly meant to spiritually manipulate the youth, not teach them.  Certainly, there were no mob attacks on the plains.  But I guess it's tough to find Native Americans willing to fake an Indian attack these days.

And it's tough to reenact freezing, starving, et cetera without incurring serious liability.  I agree with you to an extent: if an arduous enough trek is undertaken, it's not necessary to manufacture aggravated assault, attempted murder, and murder: there will be enough injury and sickness along the way as it is (although, again, the issue of liability may rear its ugly head).

[stemelbow]

I'm with Cinepro, this is pretty dumb and a little irresponsible--putting in things that didn't happen so the kids could testify that they now know what it's like to have been like the pioneers.

Ya gotsta jazz it up somehow though. Last time my oldest went on trek, last year, he found it pretty boring.

[Bernard Gui]

I'm with Cinepro, this is pretty dumb and a little irresponsible--putting in things that didn't happen so the kids could testify that they now know what it's like to have been like the pioneers.Ya gotsta jazz it up somehow though. Last time my oldest went on trek, last year, he found it pretty boring.

My objection is setting up extreme situations where the youth feel they are in danger and have to pray or get priesthood blessings. I think that borders on emotional manipulation. Having a mob attack at night might be fun and exciting ....like capture the flag or laser tag with the purpose of experiencing what it might have been like, but prayer? That's a step too far IMO.

[Craig in Austin]

Good discussion.  There's even a church website now (search for "trek safety" at www.lds.org) to help guide handcart trek planning.

 

I like the idea at bycommonconsent- since there were no mob attacks of handcart companies, maybe reenact a real danger for pioneers: typhus and cholera.  But it would probably be unwise to give all the youth diarrhea, so they would know what it was like. 

[The Nehor]

My objection is setting up extreme situations where the youth feel they are in danger and have to pray or get priesthood blessings. I think that borders on emotional manipulation. Having a mob attack at night might be fun and exciting ....like capture the flag or laser tag with the purpose of experiencing what it might have been like, but prayer? That's a step too far IMO.

It is emotional manipulation. I am not sure what is wrong with that. Most of our entertainment is designed to manipulate emotion.

[Senator]

It is emotional manipulation. I am not sure what is wrong with that.

 

Well, just know that there are large number of individuals that don't like to be emotionally manipulated.

 

So you'll kindly excuse us if we opt out of participation?

[The Nehor]

Well, just know that there are large number of individuals that don't like to be emotionally manipulated.

 

So you'll kindly excuse us if we opt out of participation?

I think you mean you do not like being covertly emotionally manipulated by those seeking gain or being manipulated without assent. No one likes those. If you truly hated anything that manipulated your emotions you would shun your family, flee from music, never watch a movie, never compete in athletics, or even read a book.

People who go on a pioneer trek at least in theory want an experience and want it to be an emotional one so I say we let them have it.

[cinepro]

I think you mean you do not like being covertly emotionally manipulated by those seeking gain or being manipulated without assent. No one likes those. If you truly hated anything that manipulated your emotions you would shun your family, flee from music, never watch a movie, never compete in athletics, or even read a book.

People who go on a pioneer trek at least in theory want an experience and want it to be an emotional one so I say we let them have it.

 

As long as everyone can distinguish between "emotion" and "the spirit", there shouldn't be a problem.

Edited June 24, 2015 by cinepro