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Samurai Jack

The Trinity

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it doesnt fall short....for it is an egg....when you take the yoke...you will have a yoke of an egg....if you take the white stuff....it is part of the egg...all three equals ONE egg.......you are just trying to make it more difficult than it really is....for example.....you have the yoke....where did it come from? From the egg....you have the white stuff....where did it come from? from the egg....how about the shell? from the egg...all three is ONE egg....it doesnt matter what substance...and here is the reason why it doesnt fall short....God is a spirit....Jesus who is God is in human form...substance is different here....God spirit...Jesus in human form...but ONE God...

Can you explain Jesus being down on earth, the Father in Heaven and the Holy Ghost descending upon Jesus in terms of the egg analogy?

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it doesnt fall short....for it is an egg....when you take the yoke...you will have a yoke of an egg....if you take the white stuff....it is part of the egg...all three equals ONE egg.......you are just trying to make it more difficult than it really is....for example.....you have the yoke....where did it come from?

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Servant,

I appreciate your effort to explain, but the analogy does not work. It would work for most eight year-olds, but it doesn't square with the Athanasian Creed.

The Creed says:

So the Father is God, the Son is God and the Holy Ghost is God, ...

Is an egg shell fully an egg? Is an egg yolk fully an egg? Is an egg white fully an egg? If you seperated an egg and put the shell on one plate, the yolk on another and the white on another, then showed the three plates to several people and you ask while showing the plate with the shell, "What is this?" Would anybody say, "That's an egg."? The same with the yolk, would anybody say, "why, that's an egg."? And, finally with the white, would anybody say, "Well, that's easy, that's an egg."?

Do you see my point? Your analogy is good for teaching children, but it does not work when compared to the creed itself.

I have tried to get trinitarians to explain the trinity using a viable analogy that fits with the creed and makes it easy to understand but no one has ever been able to do it. Most people eventually admit they don't understand it, but that we aren't supposed to anyway.

Can anyone here provide a simple, comprehensive analogy that actually fits with the wording of the creed so that my eyes can be opened?

Thanks,

T-Shirt

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No Alexander, my 8 year old is not "naive". She just has that wonderful child-like faith that Christ said we all sould have, which makes a purer understanding of things. She has not been corrupted by prejudice and cynicism like the rest of us have been.

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Explaning the Trinity is very easy: mutliple personality disorder (think of the movie 3 Faces of Eve) :P

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It is in the Bible ... one God in three divine persons.

Sweet, then we probably just define a God different. We beleive a divine person is a God. You Believe a divine person is a piece of a God. And, as we believe, three Gods unified in purpose essentialy are one God. :P

Without the Son, then, is God only part God? If the pieces are distinct they can be removed in theory, so what would that do? I think I know what your responce will be, its just the two different interpretations of scripture justify either point we make, and I dont know if you agree with that or not.

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I always liked the "Bewitched" explanation. **** York is Darrin Stephens. **** Sargent is Darrin Stephens. So either one is Darrin Stephens. Unfortunately, It has the same problem as the egg explanation, except going the other way.

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Servant,

I appreciate your effort to explain, but the analogy does not work.  It would work for most eight year-olds, but it doesn't square with the Athanasian Creed.

The Creed says:

So the Father is God, the Son is God and the Holy Ghost is God, ...

Is an egg shell fully an egg?  Is an egg yolk fully an egg?  Is an egg white fully an egg?  If you seperated an egg and put the shell on one plate, the yolk on another and the white on another, then showed the three plates to several people and you ask while showing the plate with the shell, "What is this?"  Would anybody say, "That's an egg."?  The same with the yolk, would anybody say, "why, that's an egg."?  And, finally with the white, would anybody say, "Well, that's easy, that's an egg."?

Do you see my point?  Your analogy is good for teaching children, but it does not work when compared to the creed itself.

I have tried to get trinitarians to explain the trinity using a viable analogy that fits with the creed and makes it easy to understand but no one has ever been able to do it.  Most people eventually admit they don't understand it, but that we aren't supposed to anyway.

Can anyone here provide a simple, comprehensive analogy that actually fits with the wording of the creed so that my eyes can be opened?

Thanks,

T-Shirt

when you eat a fried egg what are you saying you are eating? I am eating a yoke and white stuff? no...you are eating an EGG.....

you guys are just trying to make it more difficult than it is...and you are focusing on the meteral than the point...that is where it lays.

three seperate beings with different minds does NOT harmonize with "God is pure spirit" or "there is only ONE God" Or the other scriptures I have put out....it just doesnt harmonize...

I posted verses because it was asked...it harmonizes with eachother...then others just simply couldnt understand so I just gave out an anology...is simplier form....however my kids understood it through the verses...and me having a mormon background...I was able to grasp the trinity with no problem at all....it seems that a few is just trying to make it seem hard....and also avoding the point of the explaination...

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It is one thing not to believe in the Trinity but to make fun of it...is different.

Suppose if you are wrong and you find out the truth? Would you be making fun of the Trinity then?

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three seperate beings with different minds does NOT harmonize with "God is pure spirit" or "there is only ONE God" Or the other scriptures I have put out....it just doesnt harmonize...

Quick question, where in the Bible does it say "God is pure spirit"?

Moving on. You made the point that we call the inside of the egg, egg rather than "the inside of the egg". That's because we are used to calling it that. If you were eating just the egg shell, nobody would say "I

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No Alexander, my 8 year old is not "naive". She just has that wonderful child-like faith that Christ said we all sould have, which makes a purer understanding of things. She has not been corrupted by prejudice and cynicism like the rest of us have been.

Child like faith, not child like everything else. Jesus said faith.

Has your 8 year old studied and compared the various documents describing the trinity including the CCC, Athanasian Creed, and all the little analogies floating around?

I did not say your child was dumb or whatnot, I said she, like all 8 year olds, is naive. During the time I was growing up it seemed like during any one point in my life I was on top of the world and thought I had it all figured out. It also seamed like every couple months I would look back and say "man that was dumb, how stupid was I?" It wasn

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Alexander writes,

ck question, where in the Bible does it say "God is pure spirit"?

For discussion see the discussion in the following post:

Is God Male, What does the Bible say?

However T-Shirt is right, the creed itself states that each are fully God and not each are partially God.

Each is fully egg ...

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Try John 4:24.

Just as I suspected, the word "pure" is nowhere to be found.

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Alexander writes,

ck question, where in the Bible does it say "God is pure spirit"?

For discussion see the discussion in the following post:

Is God Male, What does the Bible say?

However T-Shirt is right, the creed itself states that each are fully God and not each are partially God.

Each is fully egg ...

And what? You want me to just copy and paste Kevin Graham's response?

"This is deception on your part. You put "pure spirit" in quotes and then follow up with a verse, pretending the phrase can be found therein. The fact is, as I have always said, "pure spirit" is Johnny's own invention. Eph 4:6 doesn't mention "pure spirit." You're playing us for idiots. ..." -Kevin Graham

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Many LDS doctrines are not laid out word for word in the Bible either. I would imagine you challenge those also?

The awesome thing about the Catholic Church is that we in addition to the cannonized scriptures we have the oral Tradition handed to us through the Apostles (see 2 Thessalonians 2:14), the teachings of the early church Fathers, and the inspiration of the Holy Spirit through the Magesterium of the Catholic Church (the Pope and the Bishops). That brings us the fullness of the Gospel.

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Many LDS doctrines are not laid out word for word in the Bible either. I would imagine you challenge those also?

The awesome thing about the Catholic Church is that we in addition to the cannonized scriptures we have the oral Tradition handed to us through the Apostles (see 2 Thessalonians 2:14), the teachings of the early church Fathers, and the inspiration of the Holy Spirit through the Magesterium of the Catholic Church (the Pope and the Bishops). That brings us the fullness of the Gospel.

Still doesn't change the fact that "pure spirit" isn't found in the Bible despite the fact that both you and Johnny are saying it is.

Likewise, the awesome thing about The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is we don't have to pretend the Bible says what it clearly does not (eg. "pure spirit" in John 4:24 or anywhere else for that metter).

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three seperate beings with different minds does NOT harmonize with "God is pure spirit" or "there is only ONE God"  Or the other scriptures I have put out....it just doesnt harmonize...

Quick question, where in the Bible does it say "God is pure spirit"?

Moving on. You made the point that we call the inside of the egg, egg rather than "the inside of the egg". That's because we are used to calling it that. If you were eating just the egg shell, nobody would say "I

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Try John 4:24.

Just as I suspected, the word "pure" is nowhere to be found.

you dont think God is pure?

so do you think He is unpure? Dont we have to be pure to be in Heaven? Or could be defiled?

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4:24

God is a spirit: and they that adore him must adore him in spirit and in truth.

I don't know if anybody has brought this up or not, since I haven't read through the whole thread (just skimming today), but the word translated "spirit" in John 4:24 is the same word translated "ghost" at the end of Luke (I think Luke 24:39, if I remember right). Anyway, in Luke, Jesus defines "spirit" or "ghost" as something that does not have flesh and bones.

Just a thought. Take care, everyone :P

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Alexander ,

And what? You want me to just copy and paste Kevin Graham's response?

I thought you might read the thread ... Kevin preferred saying a spirit that that can "appear in any form" in place of the words "pure spirit". See post below:

Pure spirit

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an eggshell..well you will be eating part of the egg...regardless it doesnt matter how you say it...it is still part of an egg....yeah a shell you wouldnt just say an egg but an egg shell....just like God is a Spirit...and Jesus is in human form..you have two items from part of one....

Now you

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Can anyone here provide a simple, comprehensive analogy that actually fits with the wording of the creed so that my eyes can be opened?

Thanks,

T-Shirt

You folks keep saying how simple this is, okay, then can anyone answer the question I asked above? Anybody?

Don't get me wrong, I respect Catholics, and all people of faith that do their best to live their religion, and I hope no one thinks I am being disrespectful, but I really want to find someone that can explain the trinity in a clear, easy to comprehend way. I understand the language of the doctrine, but it just does not make any sense. If you want to say it is a mystery, and we can't understand the things of God, I can accept that, however please, then admit that you don't understand it either and stop telling me it is simple.

Thanks,

T-Shirt

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Try John 4:24.

Just as I suspected, the word "pure" is nowhere to be found.

you dont think God is pure?

so do you think He is unpure? Dont we have to be pure to be in Heaven? Or could be defiled?

Context context context!

Pure seems to be used here (and I'm taking a guess on this, after all it's you who inserted this word into the bible, not me) to mean only.

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