More Exclusion...Lds Child Not Admitted To "Christian" School

[The Nehor]

If another religion had it in their scripture that my religion was "wrong", I'm not sure how much comfort I would feel if they insisted that even though it was "stated", they weren't teaching it every week.

I really doubt this is in reaction to that. If Mormonism announced tomorrow that all religions are a different path to the same truth and embraced Universalism I don't think the school would change its policy.

[thesometimesaint]

The Nehor:

The mighty Oak stands firm against the storm, and if the storm is big enough down goes the mighty Oak. The Slender reed bends with storm and survives to another day. India was the weak reed against the strong storm of British might. History records India won.

[The Nehor]

The Nehor:

The mighty Oak stands firm against the storm, and if the storm is big enough down goes the mighty Oak. The Slender reed bends with storm and survives to another day. India was the weak reed against the strong storm of British might. History records India won.

Won themselves a civil war, continuing conflict with Pakistan, a continuously unstable government, and all kinds of other problems. I guess you can call that a victory but if it was I would define it as Pyrrhic. I believe India needed independence but I wish they had a better role model giving it to them in a better way and at a better time. Gandhi seems to me a horrible choice.

[Mudcat]

Comments?

I don't get the appeal to PC on this Bernard.

If I were to offer a comment, it would be to say, that when the CoJCoLDS allows me as an evangelical to marry my LDS wife in an LDS Temple.. I think your point about exclusion would be merited.

[ERayR]

I don't get the appeal to PC on this Bernard.

If I were to offer a comment, it would be to say, that when the CoJCoLDS allows me as an evangelical to marry my LDS wife in an LDS Temple.. I think your point about exclusion would be merited.

Mudcat,

There are requirements to anything worthwhile. Even a college will not allow you to receive a degree without fulfilling the requirements. A temple marriage bestows certain reward and if it was open to all without them meeting the requirements then you would end up with what you now have, A wonderful marriage to a wonderful woman.

[Yirgacheffe]

Mudcat,

There are requirements to anything worthwhile. Even a college will not allow you to receive a degree without fulfilling the requirements. A temple marriage bestows certain reward and if it was open to all without them meeting the requirements then you would end up with what you now have, A wonderful marriage to a wonderful woman.

And that particular school has laid out requirements, the child in question did no fulfill their requirements, same as in Temple marriage. Why is it wrong for them to spell out their own criteria for participation?

[Storm Rider]

Of the 700 million people who identify as Evangelical (Lausanne Global Analysis, 2010) how many would you say you've been exposed to? How many have you known on a personal basis, i.e., counted as friends? Just curious. I've been living "among them" for decades and my experience is quite different.

How many of the General Authorities do you suppose endorse your sentiment that Evangelicals are "a lost people full of hate, contention, dishonesty, and evil?"

I lived in the NW Florida for many years and it was the home of my mom and dad; still have siblings that live there and I visit almost every year. Annually I hear the same type of stories about things I experiences as a young man. Announcements not to play with boy X because he is a LDS; Demands by the local First Baptist church to their youth to not vote for child "Y" for student government because he is LDS; no LDS children could lead the school prayer by degree from the FBC; Evangelical church announcements not to allow your children to mix with the LDS youth; etc., etc., etc. The quarterly sermons on how terrible LDS are; going to hell, godmakers, yada, yada, yada.

I have also had the occasion to live on the west coast; same drivel from the same groups. Everything is okay if you keep your religion to yourself i.e. never admit to being a LDS. The moment you open your mouth, Ding, the smiles fade and the gossip and stories come out.

I continue to have friends among them; some of them still talk badly about the Church even when they know better, but we just don't talk religion.

I am glad your experience is different, but I have lived far too long and my family and relatives have endured far too much to ever feel safe around Evangelicals. It is one of the reasons I get uncomfortable with prayer in school desires (not too much a problem now, I realize). What they really mean is we should have prayer in schools and only our children can say them. No LDS, no Catholics, no Muslims, no one different. My guard will always be up around them as a people. As individuals there can be good ones, but they are the exception rather than the rule.

[KevinG]

I find the notion that a single child could convert an entire Christian school hilarious. We ran into this in Chattanooga when we lived there. One school required the kids to renounce their Mormon beliefs before returning to the school they had attended for years. For my part I didn't know why any parent felt the need to send a child to a religious institution where their children would be steeped in another religion and tradition? Its bad enough deprogramming them from the stuff they learn in the public schools.

Edited June 2, 2012 by KevinG

[ERayR]

And that particular school has laid out requirements, the child in question did no fulfill their requirements, same as in Temple marriage. Why is it wrong for them to spell out their own criteria for participation?

I don't think I said that it was wrong. Please reread what I wrote and to what post I was responding to.

[Zeta-Flux]

Do you believe the Bible to be the only inspired and infallible Word of God, our final authority in all matters of faith and conduct?

My answer: No. That is Christ's role, not the Bible's.

[Bernard Gui]

I don't get the appeal to PC on this Bernard.

If I were to offer a comment, it would be to say, that when the CoJCoLDS allows me as an evangelical to marry my LDS wife in an LDS Temple.. I think your point about exclusion would be merited.

Then I would want my ordination to serve as a bishop in the LDS church to be recognized by the Catholic Church.

I would also want to be bishop of your church.

Bernard

Edited June 3, 2012 by Bernard Gui

[Bernard Gui]

And that particular school has laid out requirements, the child in question did no fulfill their requirements, same as in Temple marriage. Why is it wrong for them to spell out their own criteria for participation?

What requirement did the child not fulfill?

Bernard

[Bernard Gui]

I am glad your experience is different, but I have lived far too long and my family and relatives have endured far too much to ever feel safe around Evangelicals. It is one of the reasons I get uncomfortable with prayer in school desires (not too much a problem now, I realize). What they really mean is we should have prayer in schools and only our children can say them. No LDS, no Catholics, no Muslims, no one different. My guard will always be up around them as a people. As individuals there can be good ones, but they are the exception rather than the rule.

A hearty Amen to this. In our community, several large evangelical churches have great influence on politics, schools, and community.

Some is good, but some is exclusionary. For example, our stake presidency offered the use of the stake center which is across the

baseball field from the school for the high school senior baccalaureate ceremony (without a fee). Not acceptable...it is now in a Lutheran church that charges for the use. The Young Life club at the high school kept a list of LDS students going to the school to be singled out for special "attention." We planned a run-out recital for our orchestra

at our chapel, but some of the students said their parents would not let them go into a Mormon church.

Bernard

Edited June 3, 2012 by Bernard Gui

[The Nehor]

What requirement did the child not fulfill?

The "not being a Satanic cultist" one. It's always a stumbling-block.

[Yirgacheffe]

What requirement did the child not fulfill?

Bernard

The requirement to fit their definition of a "Christian", though I think they are inconsistent because it seems Catholics don't fit the requirements either but they admit them to the school.

[Ron Beron]

Mormons shouldn't be bellyaching, really, about being excluded from the trappings of evangelicalism when we teach that all professors of religion are corrupt.

I started the application for doctoral work at Fuller Theological Seminary, only to be discouraged when I asked if my ecclesiastical recommendation could be a Mormon bishop. No big deal. We make our bed the way we want and shouldn't complain about the sheets we pick.

Maybe their attitude has changed since their president publicly apologized to the LDS. I called them awhile back and asked if they accepted LDS and was told they did.

[Ron Beron]

Imagine the outcry if the article replaced the word, "Mormon" with black. I doubt they would hold firm to their dogma for very long. Secondly, the directors comment of, ...Gary Arnold, the school’s director. “Their doctrine doesn’t align with our doctrine. But I do know that the Mormon faith is not regarded to be in the historic, orthodox stream of Christianity.” If you study enough 1st century Christianity you will find that they should be regarded as orthodox either.

[Saints Alive]

I'm surprised Mormon tuition money isn't good enough for Evangelical schools. I really wish there was a more widely available Mormon alternative to Christian and Catholic private schools. Unfortunately these schools have every right to exclude whatever flavor of religion they like.

[thesometimesaint]

We don't do too badly for the small religion we are.

Edited June 3, 2012 by thesometimesaint

[Senator]

I subscribe to the "limited scope of corruption" theory of the First Vision, where Jesus wasn't referring to all other Churches when he said "they were all wrong" and that "those professors were all corrupt", but only those in the upstate New York area in the spring of 1820. At that time, Joseph Smith's "world" was only a few counties big, so when Jesus said "all", He really meant "all that are within a radius of a few miles".

This would mean that there may have been non-wrong, non-corrupt churches and professors in other cities and counties, but since Joseph didn't specify a radius, the answer would probably just apply to those within easy commuting distance.

Cinepro,

I have to say how often I get a chuckle out of your many satirical rejoinders. (whether I agree or not)!!

I would like to know you IRL.!

[theplains]

Maybe their attitude has changed since their president publicly apologized to the LDS.

Has any Mormon apologized to Catholics and Protestants for Joseph Smith writing in his vision account that all

their creeds are an abomination to God or [others stating] that all their baptisms and ordinations are really

useless because they are said not to have the proper priesthood authority?

Come to think of it, has any LDS President apologized in any way to another religious faith (apart from the

backlash that arose when some deceased Jews were proxy-baptized)?

As for my apology, I am sorry but I do not believe in Joseph Smith's teaching that a man became a God (i.e.

Elohim), nor do I worship this being. But as always, we can agree to disagree.

Thanks,

Jim

[thesometimesaint]

Christianity itself excludes every other non Christian.

John 14:16

[CQUIRK]

Has any Mormon apologized to Catholics and Protestants for Joseph Smith writing in his vision account that all

their creeds are an abomination to God or [others stating] that all their baptisms and ordinations are really

useless because they are said not to have the proper priesthood authority?

Has Jesus apologized to the saducees and pharisees for the things he said about them?

[altersteve]

Has any Mormon apologized to Catholics and Protestants for Joseph Smith writing in his vision account that all

their creeds are an abomination to God or [others stating] that all their baptisms and ordinations are really

useless because they are said not to have the proper priesthood authority?

Joseph Smith didn't say that, Jesus Christ did. We're not going to apologize for the words of the Savior.

Come to think of it, has any LDS President apologized in any way to another religious faith (apart from the

backlash that arose when some deceased Jews were proxy-baptized)?

What do we have to apologize for?

As for my apology, I am sorry but I do not believe in Joseph Smith's teaching that a man became a God (i.e.

Elohim), nor do I worship this being. But as always, we can agree to disagree.

First of all, Joseph never said that. That's a caricature. What he said was that God is a man like ourselves, meaning that He (like Jesus Christ) had a mortal existence. Second, do you believe the New Testament's teaching that the divine became man? If so, then what's so crazy about man becoming divine?

Edited June 3, 2012 by altersteve

[Calm]

Has any Mormon apologized to Catholics and Protestants for Joseph Smith writing in his vision account that all

their creeds are an abomination to God.

Would you feel comfortable apologizing for something or even think it was appropriate if you believe God said it even though it offended someone? Edited June 3, 2012 by calmoriah